Us white folks need to come up with some rules about what other people can and can't refer to us as. I mean, we can't call oriental people oriental, mexicans mexican, or black people black anymore. Here's a heads-up for all you PC whiners, making other people scared of calling you the wrong thing makes them not want to call you at all. And to stay on topic, that chick is hot.
yeah, i never got the whole oriental thing... a friend of mine in hs, she was refering to me as oriental and then she stopped in her tracks and started apologizing to me. I just stared at her blankly with a confused looked... "wth are you talking about?".. needless to say, i don't really care.
Staying in touch with what? What every single person of every single race and culture prefers to be called, doesn't mind being called, and takes offense at being called? Sure, that's not hard at all. This PC BS is nothing more than race/culture fads, no more sensical or relevant than ripped jeans, butterfly collars or friendship bracelets.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
no, staying in touch with society. would you call a black person a negro now? how do u know this? no one calls them negros anymore. maybe if u were transported back in time u would call em negros, but not now.
is staying in touch with society that hard? u still wearing bellbottoms or something?
sheltered....
is staying in touch with society that hard? u still wearing bellbottoms or something?
sheltered....
I stay in touch with society just fine, I just don't let society do my thinking for me. I guess if everyone started wearing bell-bottoms again you would to? Don't bother answering on my account, I already know the answer, and I'm out of this thread.
it's not obvious with oriental. i'm oriental and i didn't even know about it until some friends told me. this stuff is just arbitrary if you ask me.
you don't call black people negros because they'll shoot you or something. i still call native americans indians, japanese japs, and asians oriental. you PC people are really idiots.
The only thing I understand is the N word because that obviously have some racist history behind it. But what on earth is wrong with Negro? I forgot which famous black person said it(MLK?) but he mentioned that he prefer to be called Negro and not black because black people obviously don't have black color skin. Now people tolerate black again and it's wrong to use the word negro? You know, I hate to refer to people as African American all the time because that's just long.
I don't have a problem with people calling me oriental. It narrows it down. If you can me asian as far as other people know I can be from the middle east.
0roo0roo,
what do you mean people who use the word oriental is either immature or too shelter? Just because I was born in Taiwan and grew up in a school here full of asians who don't give a rats ass if you call em asians, orientals, flips, viet, or whatever we are sheltered? You know, 6 years in a 60% asian populated school system and then going through college with 1/2 the campus asian, it's the first time in my life I was made aware that there are people who find the usage of the word oriental offensive. Dang, I had no idea california was such a sheltered place. Actually, before I came to california I went to all black and then all Mexican schools. I've been called a nip, a beloved patriot, a gonk, a rice chopper, a chin chong, and a communist, so believe me I do not find usage of the word oriental anywhere near offensive.
Seriously, as long as you don't call us gonks, nips, or rice choppers I don't care.
And if you are an oriental and find the usage of the word oriental offensive, then you obviously never really experienced any racism. Because being the only chinese dude in a Texas school full of blacks and mexicans, trust me, oriental is nothing to complain about.
I don't have a problem with people calling me oriental. It narrows it down. If you can me asian as far as other people know I can be from the middle east.
0roo0roo,
what do you mean people who use the word oriental is either immature or too shelter? Just because I was born in Taiwan and grew up in a school here full of asians who don't give a rats ass if you call em asians, orientals, flips, viet, or whatever we are sheltered? You know, 6 years in a 60% asian populated school system and then going through college with 1/2 the campus asian, it's the first time in my life I was made aware that there are people who find the usage of the word oriental offensive. Dang, I had no idea california was such a sheltered place. Actually, before I came to california I went to all black and then all Mexican schools. I've been called a nip, a beloved patriot, a gonk, a rice chopper, a chin chong, and a communist, so believe me I do not find usage of the word oriental anywhere near offensive.
Seriously, as long as you don't call us gonks, nips, or rice choppers I don't care.
And if you are an oriental and find the usage of the word oriental offensive, then you obviously never really experienced any racism. Because being the only chinese dude in a Texas school full of blacks and mexicans, trust me, oriental is nothing to complain about.
how about Dim Sum. Hot Pot, Pot Stickers, Pho Boys/Girls, Yellow People, Ricer, Won Tons, Sushi, Chow Hai, Fortune Cookie, China Man, Chinese, Japanese, Korean.
to be pc call chinese people either Tang Ren or Zhong Guo Ren, japanese Nihonjin, and koreans hung beloved patriot
after it is all said and done go eat some food because the list i made really refers to food
chow hai anyone?
to be pc call chinese people either Tang Ren or Zhong Guo Ren, japanese Nihonjin, and koreans hung beloved patriot
after it is all said and done go eat some food because the list i made really refers to food
chow hai anyone?
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
<a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.imdiversity.com/Article_Detail.asp?Article_ID=5472">Orienting Myself to Being an Asian
</a>
"Here's one of most helpful the explanations from the "Ties-Talk" Japanese American discussion list, tracing the word back to the collapse of the Roman Empire: "Although some people view 'Occidental' as the opposite of 'Oriental,' meaning the white Europeans, the term originally meant the eastern European or western Asia... What was left of the Roman empire was split into two, the Occidental Empire and the Oriental Empire. This is how I believe the terms got started. 'Orient' is a Latin term for 'east' and 'occident' is a term for 'west.'"
The accepted rule is that "Oriental" is a word for inanimate objects from Asia, but not for people. If you're describing people from Asia, use the word "Asian" -- or better yet, take the time to discern beyond the racial distinctions and find out what country or heritage people are from. Asia is an awful big place, and there are many discrete cultures and traditions from Chinese and Japanese to Korean, East Indian, Tibetan, Vietnamese, Thai.... and within each country, different cultures thrive in different regions. There's a natural inclination to simplify the world and file people under broad categories. But few people would without a thought lump Italians and Swedes or French and English together culturally and ethnically, just because they all happen to be Europeans. For some reason, it seems easier to assume that all Asians think alike and act alike just because they look alike (of course, we don't all look alike either, but that's another column).
No one calls Eastern Europeans "Occidentals," and "Oriental" today is considered by Asians to be a derogatory term because it reflects centuries of a western-centric view of the world, which assumed that civilization and knowledge flowed from Europe to the rest of the world. The cultures of Asia, of course, in particular China, are much older and was refined long before Europeans wandered to other continents.
In addition, the word "Oriental" is confusing because the word is used to describe the "Middle East" as well as the "Far East" (two more words used to indicate geographic locale relative to Europe). Hence, rugs from Persian are today still called "Oriental rugs."....
"
a poll on the word
"Many Asian Americans are unaware that the term ?Oriental? is offensive because the term is often used in their home countries to refer to its citizens, the Philippines included, especially because the Philippines is also known as the ?Pearl of the Orient.? In Europe and the United States, however, the term acquired a Eurocentric depiction of the worst of Asian habits and lifestyles. Hence the word ?Oriental? was spoken with derision. To Asian Americans who know its historical reference, the term is as repugnant as the ?N? word used to slur African Americans. ?Many people didn?t realize the term had negative connotations,? Shin legislative aide Scott Passey told PNews how constituents responded to consultations about the issue. ?But once they understood, they were very agreeable. A few simply refused to believe the word was negative despite the historical evidence and dictionary references.?
?The major issue here is one of self-identity and self-determination,? Shin stressed. ?Members of the Asian community have told me that they are offended to be referred to as ?Oriental? in our state statutes. The definition of the word notwithstanding, its various applications, such as ?exotic,? ?strange,? and so forth is demeaning. While many Asians under European colonial influence have not been educated to the application of the word, they now understand its meaning and connotations. This is similar to the reason why blacks do not wish to be called ?Negros (sic).??
"http://news.ncmonline.com/news/view_article.html?article_id=143
and well this site just lists points.
"
It brings up unfortunate chapters in our global history. The terms "Orient" and "oriental" were popularized in the heyday of Western colonialism, when nations to the South and East of Europe were seen as ripe for subjugation and exploitation. As a result, usage of the term is an automatic cue for references to the British Raj, the Opium War, the occupation of the Phillipines, and other events and periods in which the inhabitants of Asian countries were enslaved, victimized, or otherwise mistreated by Europeans (and later, Americans).
It has problematic racial and political connotations. While "Orient" translates simply as "The East," over time, an ideological paradigm emerged that spun itself around the term: The Orient was seen as the farthest point from civilization (i.e. Europe) and thus a region of barbarism, exotic custom, and strange delight. "Orientals" were conceived of as mysterious and inscrutable, with traditions and beliefs so different as to be inhuman - and thus requiring of either speculative study or religious evangelism. As social historian Edward Said detailed in his seminal book of that name, the intent and result of orientalism was the objectification of cultures in Asia and the Middle East, providing a rationale for colonial subjugation, missionary conversion, and military adventure, it later also created a context for domestic racism and xenophobia.
It's nonspecific. As perceived by Western Europeans, "The Orient" included all of Turkey, the Middle East, Asia and to a lesser extent the Pacific Islands. An Iranian was therefore just as "Oriental" as a Chinese person, though in contemporary times, the term is never used in that manner. While "Asian" is not much more specific, it at least is a term bounded by geography, rather than paradigm. It would be difficult to argue that "Orientals" shared anything in common, other than in the feverish minds of European orientalists.
It doesn't have an appropriate counterpart. The most subtle yet invidious problem with the term "Oriental" is that it stands alone: No one refers to Europeans as "Occidentals." Consider the term "Orient" only has meaning in the West; in the East, it is the Americas and Europe that are foreign and "outside," and most Asian cultures have similar but inverted conceptions referring to "The West." Hemispheric definitions are always problematic, since the world is, after all, round; but at least the terms East and West don't come loaded with imagery and history of "Orient" and "Occident."
It's more appropriately used for inanimate objects. The establishment of trade routes linking the nations of Asia and the Middle East (which occurred long before the opening of Asia to the West) meant that commodities and other goods were regularly transmitted between cultures. As a result, when one refers to Oriental spices or rugs, one has a stable rationale from which to speak: spices and rugs are among the only things that the mixed bags of peoples known as "Orientals" actually had in common. In general, the use of the adjective in relation to inanimate objects or abstract concepts has largely been considered acceptable, if not embraced (there are people who still prefer speaking of Asian spices, or breaking down rugs into Persian, Indian, and Chinese carpets).
Some people don't like it. Many Asians find the term distasteful; the term has also been eliminated from usage in journalism and entertainment. The rule of thumb is simple: rather than risk offending, just don't bother - the term "Asian" is neutral, widely accepted - and safe." http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Lobby/2788/oriental.html
that being said, someone post pics.!
</a>
"Here's one of most helpful the explanations from the "Ties-Talk" Japanese American discussion list, tracing the word back to the collapse of the Roman Empire: "Although some people view 'Occidental' as the opposite of 'Oriental,' meaning the white Europeans, the term originally meant the eastern European or western Asia... What was left of the Roman empire was split into two, the Occidental Empire and the Oriental Empire. This is how I believe the terms got started. 'Orient' is a Latin term for 'east' and 'occident' is a term for 'west.'"
The accepted rule is that "Oriental" is a word for inanimate objects from Asia, but not for people. If you're describing people from Asia, use the word "Asian" -- or better yet, take the time to discern beyond the racial distinctions and find out what country or heritage people are from. Asia is an awful big place, and there are many discrete cultures and traditions from Chinese and Japanese to Korean, East Indian, Tibetan, Vietnamese, Thai.... and within each country, different cultures thrive in different regions. There's a natural inclination to simplify the world and file people under broad categories. But few people would without a thought lump Italians and Swedes or French and English together culturally and ethnically, just because they all happen to be Europeans. For some reason, it seems easier to assume that all Asians think alike and act alike just because they look alike (of course, we don't all look alike either, but that's another column).
No one calls Eastern Europeans "Occidentals," and "Oriental" today is considered by Asians to be a derogatory term because it reflects centuries of a western-centric view of the world, which assumed that civilization and knowledge flowed from Europe to the rest of the world. The cultures of Asia, of course, in particular China, are much older and was refined long before Europeans wandered to other continents.
In addition, the word "Oriental" is confusing because the word is used to describe the "Middle East" as well as the "Far East" (two more words used to indicate geographic locale relative to Europe). Hence, rugs from Persian are today still called "Oriental rugs."....
"
a poll on the word
"Many Asian Americans are unaware that the term ?Oriental? is offensive because the term is often used in their home countries to refer to its citizens, the Philippines included, especially because the Philippines is also known as the ?Pearl of the Orient.? In Europe and the United States, however, the term acquired a Eurocentric depiction of the worst of Asian habits and lifestyles. Hence the word ?Oriental? was spoken with derision. To Asian Americans who know its historical reference, the term is as repugnant as the ?N? word used to slur African Americans. ?Many people didn?t realize the term had negative connotations,? Shin legislative aide Scott Passey told PNews how constituents responded to consultations about the issue. ?But once they understood, they were very agreeable. A few simply refused to believe the word was negative despite the historical evidence and dictionary references.?
?The major issue here is one of self-identity and self-determination,? Shin stressed. ?Members of the Asian community have told me that they are offended to be referred to as ?Oriental? in our state statutes. The definition of the word notwithstanding, its various applications, such as ?exotic,? ?strange,? and so forth is demeaning. While many Asians under European colonial influence have not been educated to the application of the word, they now understand its meaning and connotations. This is similar to the reason why blacks do not wish to be called ?Negros (sic).??
"http://news.ncmonline.com/news/view_article.html?article_id=143
and well this site just lists points.
"
It brings up unfortunate chapters in our global history. The terms "Orient" and "oriental" were popularized in the heyday of Western colonialism, when nations to the South and East of Europe were seen as ripe for subjugation and exploitation. As a result, usage of the term is an automatic cue for references to the British Raj, the Opium War, the occupation of the Phillipines, and other events and periods in which the inhabitants of Asian countries were enslaved, victimized, or otherwise mistreated by Europeans (and later, Americans).
It has problematic racial and political connotations. While "Orient" translates simply as "The East," over time, an ideological paradigm emerged that spun itself around the term: The Orient was seen as the farthest point from civilization (i.e. Europe) and thus a region of barbarism, exotic custom, and strange delight. "Orientals" were conceived of as mysterious and inscrutable, with traditions and beliefs so different as to be inhuman - and thus requiring of either speculative study or religious evangelism. As social historian Edward Said detailed in his seminal book of that name, the intent and result of orientalism was the objectification of cultures in Asia and the Middle East, providing a rationale for colonial subjugation, missionary conversion, and military adventure, it later also created a context for domestic racism and xenophobia.
It's nonspecific. As perceived by Western Europeans, "The Orient" included all of Turkey, the Middle East, Asia and to a lesser extent the Pacific Islands. An Iranian was therefore just as "Oriental" as a Chinese person, though in contemporary times, the term is never used in that manner. While "Asian" is not much more specific, it at least is a term bounded by geography, rather than paradigm. It would be difficult to argue that "Orientals" shared anything in common, other than in the feverish minds of European orientalists.
It doesn't have an appropriate counterpart. The most subtle yet invidious problem with the term "Oriental" is that it stands alone: No one refers to Europeans as "Occidentals." Consider the term "Orient" only has meaning in the West; in the East, it is the Americas and Europe that are foreign and "outside," and most Asian cultures have similar but inverted conceptions referring to "The West." Hemispheric definitions are always problematic, since the world is, after all, round; but at least the terms East and West don't come loaded with imagery and history of "Orient" and "Occident."
It's more appropriately used for inanimate objects. The establishment of trade routes linking the nations of Asia and the Middle East (which occurred long before the opening of Asia to the West) meant that commodities and other goods were regularly transmitted between cultures. As a result, when one refers to Oriental spices or rugs, one has a stable rationale from which to speak: spices and rugs are among the only things that the mixed bags of peoples known as "Orientals" actually had in common. In general, the use of the adjective in relation to inanimate objects or abstract concepts has largely been considered acceptable, if not embraced (there are people who still prefer speaking of Asian spices, or breaking down rugs into Persian, Indian, and Chinese carpets).
Some people don't like it. Many Asians find the term distasteful; the term has also been eliminated from usage in journalism and entertainment. The rule of thumb is simple: rather than risk offending, just don't bother - the term "Asian" is neutral, widely accepted - and safe." http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Lobby/2788/oriental.html
that being said, someone post pics.!
I watched that Jackie Chan movie Gorgeous (sp?), and I expect to see a fine looking asian girl. I was highly dissapointed. -_-
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
and we should care what this article says.... why? so what if it has historical background, nobody uses that term in a derogatory fasion. \
please... if you're asian.... don't be offended by oriental. i don't want my kind to become one of those idiot races that protests everything like the indians, blacks, and hispanics.
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