The LDS church taught people with brown skin (especially black) were cursed until 2013.

[dank69]

I will take a lot of old crumpled dollars over a few new crisp ones. I could also say a lean healthy body is of finer quality than a massively fat one. So let’s play Jordan Peterson and define what qualities and quantities we are talking about. But let’s wait until you have had a lot of sleep, because I wouldn’t want to exhaust you, Cody.

Quality of life or quantity of life.

 

[Moonbeam]

Quality of life or quantity of life.

I have no problem with assuming what you would mean by life, but quality of life sounds to me like something profoundly subjective. I think, looking at myself, there was a time in my life when I experienced an shift from black hopeless despair to the joy of being in a single instant. The latter would not have happened without the former as the former drove me to find a way out and the realization not only that there wasn't one nor any need for one. So, while, I know what you mean generally by quality of life as referring to the state of one's relative freedom from misery, there is the matter of the unconscious which people generally fail to consider determines how they really feel, and that is the worst in the world.. My intention is to first make you aware of that and secondly that it is a lie you do not know you believe and that you don't want to know that either.

When the truth is yet to dawn on you it appears to be catastrophic but, realized, it is the door to heaven.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I will take a lot of old crumpled dollars over a few new crisp ones. I could also say a lean healthy body is of finer quality than a massively fat one. So let’s play Jordan Peterson and define what qualities and quantities we are talking about. But let’s wait until you have had a lot of sleep, because I wouldn’t want to exhaust you, Cody.

Lol, your obvious bias aside, your casual annoyance is pretty funny.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I have no problem with assuming what you would mean by life, but quality of life sounds to me like something profoundly subjective. I think, looking at myself, there was a time in my life when I experienced an shift from black hopeless despair to the joy of being in a single instant. The latter would not have happened without the former as the former drove me to find a way out and the realization not only that there wasn't one nor any need for one. So, while, I know what you mean generally by quality of life as referring to the state of one's relative freedom from misery, there is the matter of the unconscious which people generally fail to consider determines how they really feel, and that is the worst in the world.. My intention is to first make you aware of that and secondly that it is a lie you do not know you believe and that you don't want to know that either.

When the truth is yet to dawn on you it appears to be catastrophic but, realized, it is the door to heaven.

Way to many words, quality isnt that hard to determine. For instance, you can take a survey from one of the many reports about countries ranked by quality of life.

Example: https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/rankings/quality-of-life

Quantity is even easier, simply length

 

[ch33zw1z]

I like that Mormons treat the body as a temple and are religiously bound to keep it healthy.

They pound sugar like theres no tomorrow, cuz the other vices are off limits. Also, see “soaking”, its a mormon thing.

 

[pmv]

Interesting that those two frauds are the two most influential groups on the planet.
Things that make you go hmmmmm.

That's entirely consistent with my sense that human beings are an irredemiably-flawed species, and have no long-term future (other than an endless cycle of social collapse, violent conflict and rebuilding, till we wipe ourselves out entirely). Of course fraudulent groups are influential, because human beings are fundamentally a bit crap. Religion serves a purpose, it fills a need in human nature, but that doesn't mean it's consistent with long-term survival. Especially not when there is no One True religion, so inevitably they will conflict with each other, the more fervent the belief the more violent the conflict.

 

[nakedfrog]

That's entirely consistent with my sense that human beings are an irredemiably-flawed species, and have no long-term future (other than an endless cycle of social collapse, violent conflict and rebuilding, till we wipe ourselves out entirely). Of course fraudulent groups are influential, because human beings are fundamentally a bit crap. Religion serves a purpose, it fills a need in human nature, but that doesn't mean it's consistent with long-term survival. Especially not when there is no One True religion, so inevitably they will conflict with each other, the more fervent the belief the more violent the conflict.

I suspect even if there was one true religion, there would soon be a competitor formed by someone who sees the opportunity for power and control.

 

[pmv]

I suspect even if there was one true religion, there would soon be a competitor formed by someone who sees the opportunity for power and control.

Yeah, but if it were the TRUE religion, it would be backed by an all-powerful God, who would soon deal with the upstart competitor!

 

[Moonbeam]

Lol, your obvious bias aside, your casual annoyance is pretty funny.

Please explain what my bias is. I don’t know what you know.

 

[Moonbeam]

Way to many words, quality isnt that hard to determine. For instance, you can take a survey from one of the many reports about countries ranked by quality of life.

Example: https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/rankings/quality-of-life

Quantity is even easier, simply length

I am not a believer. To me the so called wise men are fools. Imagine what
I think about common sense. You know what a prison religious belief is. Why did you leave one prison and lock yourself in another?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Please explain what my bias is. I don’t know what you know.

Ez, you expose this with your offhand comment about peterson and calling someone “cody” in a reference to the roundtable. Obviously an emotional response to the JP is a crank thread and the SMN review of JP's dismal performance debating young people with far less experience at the roundtable.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I am not a believer. To me the so called wise men are fools. Imagine what
I think about common sense. You know what a prison religious belief is. Why did you leave one prison and lock yourself in another?

blah blah blah, quality is quantifiable, you just have to be open to it.

 

[Moonbeam]

Ez, you expose this with your offhand comment about peterson and calling someone “cody” in a reference to the roundtable. Obviously an emotional response to the JP is a crank thread and the SMN review of JP's dismal performance debating young people with far less experience at the roundtable.

Thank you for making your point clear. I understand what you are saying and I agree. I guess I was a bit confused. I figured that someone like you so emotionally and additionally so blindly bigoted against Peterson for the blindest of reasons and who turns that bigotry into open proclaimed contempt wouldn't get all that upset at a little ribbing. Did you seriously think you were going to look in the mirror and experience contempt for the person holding it? Did you think I am a target you can shoot at for free? Trust me, I am extremely gentle. You have no idea how much you hate yourself and the punishment you inflict because of it.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Thank you for making your point clear. I understand what you are saying and I agree. I guess I was a bit confused. I figured that someone like you so emotionally and additionally so blindly bigoted against Peterson for the blindest of reasons and who turns that bigotry into open proclaimed contempt wouldn't get all that upset at a little ribbing. Did you seriously think you were going to look in the mirror and experience contempt for the person holding it? Did you think I am a target you can shoot at for free? Trust me, I am extremely gentle. You have no idea how much you hate yourself and the punishment you inflict because of it.

Lol ok moonie. “I was j/k!”

 

[Moonbeam]

blah blah blah, quality is quantifiable, you just have to be open to it.

Saying that quality is quantifiable is circular reasoning. By what yard stick are you quantifying it. This business that you have the capacity to know what is coarse and what is fine is an ego belief you hold that tells you your a touchstone. I simply ask you what your beliefs are based on and you spout out more empty words. You are full of righteous arrogance. My aim isn't to put you down for that. I would like to help you get free. I am determined to do just that because I know the jail you are in. I offer you only insights I have into my own condition because we are all in the same prison.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Saying that quality is quantifiable is circular reasoning. By what yard stick are you quantifying it. This business that you have the capacity to know what is coarse and what is fine is an ego belief you hold that tells you your a touchstone. I simply ask you what your beliefs are based on and you spout out more empty words. You are full of righteous arrogance. My aim isn't to put you down for that. I would like to help you get free. I am determined to do just that because I know the jail you are in. I offer you only insights I have into my own condition because we are all in the same prison.

I gave you a link to methods used to quantify it. Its not circular reasoning, click the link and read. Use a search engine and find out more.

Saying its circular and then asking how it’s quantified….like wtf man. You ok?

 

[Moonbeam]

Lol ok moonie. “I was j/k!”

Are you taking your ball and running home? Whatever is true is going to be true. Nothing will change that. As true for me as it is for you. Thanks for your courage so far.

 

[Moonbeam]

I gave you a link to methods used to quantify it. Its not circular reasoning, click the link and read. Use a search engine and find out more.

Saying its circular and then asking how it’s quantified….like wtf man. You ok?

OK didn't notice a link.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Are you taking your ball and running home? Whatever is true is going to be true. Nothing will change that. As true for me as it is for you. Thanks for your courage so far.

Why would i be running home? Your response was classic moonie. Gosh, it couldnt be that youre emotional, Blind, etc… its someone else thats like that and you were just joking!

 

[ch33zw1z]

OK didn't notice a link.

……wut

Way to many words, quality isnt that hard to determine. For instance, you can take a survey from one of the many reports about countries ranked by quality of life.

Example: https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/rankings/quality-of-life

Quantity is even easier, simply length

 

[ch33zw1z]

@Moonbeam another one for you: https://fortune.com/well/2025/03/20/americans-miserable-world-happiness-report/

 

[Moonbeam]

Why would i be running home? Your response was classic moonie. Gosh, it couldnt be that youre emotional, Blind, etc… its someone else thats like that and you were just joking!

Of course it could. I acknowledged that. I simply said it's not a one way street. I grew up in the same fucked up world you did and have all the same defenses. I just happen to see them for what they are. But if you want to be a seeker of truth you will have to confront the sirens, three headed dogs, that warn you away from the door to the underworld where the dragon guards it treasure. You will need a mirror polished shield and a sword or maybe a psychiatrist or confessor. We self haters hate those who offer help and no good deed goes unpunished.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Of course it could. I acknowledged that. I simply said it's not a one way street. I grew up in the same fucked up world you did and have all the same defenses. I just happen to see them for what they are. But if you want to be a seeker of truth you will have to confront the sirens, three headed dogs, that warn you away from the door to the underworld where the dragon guards it treasure. You will need a mirror polished shield and a sword or maybe a psychiatrist or confessor. We self haters hate those who offer help and no good deed goes unpunished.

Take your own advice.

 

[Moonbeam]

@Moonbeam another one for you: https://fortune.com/well/2025/03/20/americans-miserable-world-happiness-report/

From the first link:

Beyond the essential ideas of broad access to food, housing, quality education, health care and employment, quality of life also may include intangibles such as job security, political stability, individual freedom and environmental quality. Through all phases of life, these countries are seen as treating their citizens well.

Now I know why I failed to address your link. You linked to data that is a quantification of people's opinions as to their inner sense of how their government treats them as citizens. It is a measure of how people say they feel in relationship to how well they feel respected as human beings. It would seem that people prefer environments that promote a sense of well being, in short self affirming rather than self negating. It seems people with a greater sense of self worth are happier than those who are doubtful they are worth anything.

But all of this is an external measure as if it is the environment out there that determines our inner state. That is a belief I want to challenge. The real issue, then, in my opinion, is that people who are miserable rage against the machine whereas people who are happier have less ambition to change anything. They are more content. They are also less able to be triggered and less sensitive to every minor slight that comes their way. They are more rational and make more logical and less negative emotion driven decisions.

The greater the discontent the greater the likelihood that decisions are hate filled and self destructive. So we should maybe first improve our mental state before we make too many rash self destructive qualitative decisions because the more fucked up we are the less we have any idea as to what quality really is. The thing materialistic people believe is that everything happens at a material level and there is no such thing as unconscious motivation and that is a profoundly delusional condition to be in.

But it explains why I have trouble communicating with you. I am talking to you out of what to you is darkness. Essentially truth is of a different dimension that the flat world of meterialistic thinking.

 

[Pontius Dilate]

From the first link:

Beyond the essential ideas of broad access to food, housing, quality education, health care and employment, quality of life also may include intangibles such as job security, political stability, individual freedom and environmental quality. Through all phases of life, these countries are seen as treating their citizens well.

Now I know why I failed to address your link. You linked to data that is a quantification of people's opinions as to their inner sense of how their government treats them as citizens. It is a measure of how people say they feel in relationship to how well they feel respected as human beings. It would seem that people prefer environments that promote a sense of well being, in short self affirming rather than self negating. It seems people with a greater sense of self worth are happier than those who are doubtful they are worth anything.

But all of this is an external measure as if it is the environment out there that determines our inner state. That is a belief I want to challenge. The real issue, then, in my opinion, is that people who are miserable rage against the machine whereas people who are happier have less ambition to change anything. They are more content. They are also less able to be triggered and less sensitive to every minor slight that comes their way. They are more rational and make more logical and less negative emotion driven decisions.

The greater the discontent the greater the likelihood that decisions are hate filled and self destructive. So we should maybe first improve our mental state before we make too many rash self destructive qualitative decisions because the more fucked up we are the less we have any idea as to what quality really is. The thing materialistic people believe is that everything happens at a material level and there is no such thing as unconscious motivation and that is a profoundly delusional condition to be in.

But it explains why I have trouble communicating with you. I am talking to you out of what to you is darkness. Essentially truth is of a different dimension that the flat world of meterialistic thinking.

To be fair, and ignoring that magazines specific methodology for their little top 10, quantifying quality of life can be done to an extent by measuring things such as access to food, housing, quality education, health care and employment. We don't really need to ask people who live in Gaza for their current opinions on their quality of life, it's objectively awful on average.