The future of AMD in graphics

[Yotsugi]

I think it's going to be a flop too, but even rolling out the services in the first place will get AMD several data centers' worth of GPU/APU sales. Nothing to sniff at.

Tru, but there's like 2 big cloud vendors doing streaming now, and MS is kinda treading carefully there.
I don't expect it to be THAT sizeable of a DC growth driver for AMD.

Plus they always have their very very cool server roadmap that will net them many DCs worth of CPU sales.

 

[Dribble]

I'm not sure if that's a valuable market segment. There's no consumer awareness to be gained and I don't think that any of these streaming platforms are viable in the long term and will fizzle out, but even assuming that I'm wrong, AMD doesn't have any kind of lock-in since the service providers can easily switch to NVidia or even Intel GPUs in the future and the end-users won't even notice.

AMD wins by being willing to accept significantly lower margins then Nvidia/Intel can stomach. As long as they continue to be willing to do that they will keep winning deals such as consoles/streaming/apple/etc.

 

[Topweasel]

It's not just that but it's also on AMD's willingness to develop solutions for them. The two really custom jobs by Intel, the OG Xbox (not even really custom) and the KBL-G required a a lot of pressure with substantial sales expectations. If Intel doesn't team up with AMD for KBL-G they probably lose all Apple sales to AMD. Nvidia has on it's 2 major custom hardware products alienated themselves with their customers.

Anyways it isn't always going to be about top performance. It's about knowing that you have a party willing to do what it takes, when it takes to give them a solution for them. Intel and Nvidia it tends to be creat a list of desires and maybe in next hardware iteration they will include it. If it's not you have to wait till they get around to it or find a different way to do it.

 

[Yotsugi]

and the KBL-G required a a lot of pressure with substantial sales expectations.

Did KBL-G even sell anything worthwhile?

 

[DrMrLordX]

Yikes.

Go try that in a debate society. See where it gets you.

You've just asked the next-gen consoles to have a dGPU upgrade so minor calling them next-gen would be a stretch.

I'm referring to the hypothetical first Navi-based consumer dGPU for PCs, not anything in a console. AMD put custom GPUs in PS4 and Xbone. I fully expect the same next generation. How powerful will those be remains to be seen.

edit: also, calling a Vega56-equivalent dGPU a "dGPU upgrade so minor calling them next-gen would be a stretch" is really odd. PS4 Pro has:

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/playstation-4-pro-gpu.c2876

Vega56 has:

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-rx-vega-56.c2993

TPU puts Vega56 at 195% of the performance of the PS4 Pro GPU. On top of that, I expect the console version of Navi to be different (probably faster) than the first consumer Navi products for PC.

 

[Fallen Kell]

TPU puts Vega56 at 195% of the performance of the PS4 Pro GPU. On top of that, I expect the console version of Navi to be different (probably faster) than the first consumer Navi products for PC.

I think you are forgetting that the console version of Navi needs to work with limited power. I don't expect the next gen consoles to have much more than 350W total, which means the graphics card won't be able to use 300W on its own like Vega 56 does. Anything much higher than 350W and the systems will cause complaints for being too loud and/or too hot.

 

[ozzy702]

I think you are forgetting that the console version of Navi needs to work with limited power. I don't expect the next gen consoles to have much more than 350W total, which means the graphics card won't be able to use 300W on its own like Vega 56 does. Anything much higher than 350W and the systems will cause complaints for being too loud and/or too hot.

I'd fully expect a 7nm based CPU/GPU combo based on Navi to fit inside a 350W envelope and to be at least as powerful as a Vega 56 (which is a thirsty pig).

 

[tajoh111]

AMD wins by being willing to accept significantly lower margins then Nvidia/Intel can stomach. As long as they continue to be willing to do that they will keep winning deals such as consoles/streaming/apple/etc.

Intel when they want to get into a market are willing to sell things at cost and below and lose billions. They will sell at high margins when they are the market leader, but when they are the underdog, they will literally pay companies to use their product.

Their attempt to get x86 into the mobile and tablet market was one of the most expensive low margins strategies i have seen.

When it comes to getting a big customer in a new market segment, intel can go lower than the floors will go.

This is one of the ways they ontained APPLEs baseband chips contract which displaced qualcomm.

 

[jpiniero]

This is one of the ways they ontained APPLEs baseband chips contract which displaced qualcomm.

Intel only got the contract because Apple really, really hates Qualcomm. It has nothing to do about the quality or even the price. Same with nVidia.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I think you are forgetting that the console version of Navi needs to work with limited power.

That PS4 Pro GPU is on 16nm. AMD could probably double the shader count, hold the same clocks, and use less power doing so. I don't think that's exactly what they're going to do, mind you. Regardless, I do think the consumer dGPU Navi (Navi10?) could match Vega56 at a much lower power point. Assuming that the bin the damn things properly (unlike Radeon VII, which comes overvolted out of the box). GCN on TSMC 7nm is very efficient compared to GCN on GF 14nm.

@Gikaseixas

https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/the-future-of-amd-in-graphics.2561715/post-39750493

Bad spelling? What did I get wrong? There's some abbreviations in there but otherwise, I'm confused.

 

[railven]

Man, this conductor is doing more than just taking tickets. But this always makes me wonder:

If laymen such as ourselves can get such juicy insider info, what can corporate spies do?

Anyways, now I got two reasons to look forward to August. I hope this time we don't have to deal with pesky FineWine and MagicDrivers rhetoric. A healthy team red is a good thing, but none the less, my popcorn tub is ready.

 

[guskline]

Railven, having a ton of fun with this Radeon VII. I ordered a Bykski waterblock last week and it is supposed to arrive on Monday. After I have it "underwater" I'll let you know how it performs.

 

[railven]

Railven, having a ton of fun with this Radeon VII. I ordered a Bykski waterblock last week and it is supposed to arrive on Monday. After I have it "underwater" I'll let you know how it performs.

Saw a few good builds with that block. Glad to see more companies putting blocks out faster. Options are always welcomed!

You plan on undervolt while on water or just going foot to the pedal?

 

[guskline]

Railven, probably pedal to the metal!

Navi is the one for efficiency.