the first 3-D printed firearm is out.

[Orignal Earl]

Now you got to figure out how to print some 2 KNO3 + S + 3 C → K2S + N2 + 3 CO2

 

[irishScott]

Or perhaps people should come up with numbers that show that magazines beyond the standard ones that come with pistols (7, 10, 13, 15, 20 or whatever odd number) aren't more dangerous.

We're just not going to agree because what you call a legal pinky swear was imo a show of good faith on the part of people involved in the crafting of the bill. What is wrong with increasing background checks which would increase the chances of catching some (though not all) people who shouldn't have firearms other than some moral harm/slippery slope argument? Nothing really.

They have. And not just in this video, but this one is the most professional:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qa-joxi63xs

It might be considered a show of good faith if the rest of the gun control leadership wasn't so historically rabid. At this point there's no doubt in my mind that they have an agenda to eliminate or else regulate-out-of-existence popular models of firearms for no logical reason. That or they're just plain incompetent and stupid (which I'm willing to entertain in some cases). Give me an alternate interpretation that adds up. How is that provision a show of good faith when most of the people voting for it would vote to repeal it given half an inch of slack?

As I said, in theory I'm not opposed to Universal Background Checks. But the gun control leadership have indicated multiple times in the strongest possible manner that it will not stop there. So long as that's the reality, I want the biggest buffer zone I can get.

 

[Moonbeam]

Clearly the answer to gun violence is to cure mental illness because it's not guns that are the problem but crazy folk who use them. And as technology advances and the capacity to destroy more and more lives with home brewed devices increases exponentially it will require more forceful methodologies to identify the mentally ill. Could the day be coming when the survival of the human race means the mentally ill will have to be culled? That might just include folk who have a brain defect that prevents logical reasoning, no? Only the illogical and irrational would build something that can destroy the human race or allow the system to run off a cliff, like say, by doing nothing about global warming. Perhaps we need colonies in space where pockets of sane people have a chance to survive the madness of an insane earth.

 

[BoberFett]

Licensed dealers have to do background checks at gunshows while private sellers do not in 33 states.
If that is not a loophole then when females fart, shart, or go take a dump it smells like cherry blossoms or roses.

What do private sales have to do with gun shows?

Private sales can happen anywhere. Ban private sales at gun shows, and it moves to parking lots and private homes.

More Democrat failure.

 

[OverVolt]

Clearly the answer to gun violence is to cure mental illness because it's not guns that are the problem but crazy folk who use them. And as technology advances and the capacity to destroy more and more lives with home brewed devices increases exponentially it will require more forceful methodologies to identify the mentally ill. Could the day be coming when the survival of the human race means the mentally ill will have to be culled? That might just include folk who have a brain defect that prevents logical reasoning, no? Only the illogical and irrational would build something that can destroy the human race or allow the system to run off a cliff, like say, by doing nothing about global warming. Perhaps we need colonies in space where pockets of sane people have a chance to survive the madness of an insane earth.

There aren't actually any technology advances in guns they are 1800s technology. Same with home brewed devices, same old same old chemistry as it always has been. Its just liberal hype rhetoric that there is some type of growing problem in weapon deadliness that needs immediate attention. The only growing problem is on the psychological side.

 

[blankslate]

What do private sales have to do with gun shows?

Private sales can happen anywhere. Ban private sales at gun shows, and it moves to parking lots and private homes.

More Democrat failure.

Private Sellers are part of Gun Shows

More Conservative comprehension failure.

Good Grief

 

[BoberFett]

Private Sellers are part of Gun Shows

More Conservative comprehension failure.

Good Grief

Wow. You're agonizingly stupid.

Private sales can occur anywhere. That is not a function of a gun show.

A gun could be sold at a bake sale. Is there a bake sale loophole?

A gun could be sold at a peace rally. Is there a peace rally loophole?

You're so fucking stupid it hurts.

 

[Fern]

-snip-

We're just not going to agree because what you call a legal pinky swear was imo a show of good faith on the part of people involved in the crafting of the bill. What is wrong with increasing background checks which would increase the chances of catching some (though not all) people who shouldn't have firearms other than some moral harm/slippery slope argument? Nothing really.

First, you need to fix the background check system. As it now stands states aren't required to forward their info, like those that have mental health issues, to the fed govt for background checks.

However, the background check system can only work when the database is well-supplied with information, and at present, states are not obligated to submit all of the mental health records that they possess. The lack of a mandate to disclose these records mean that they have only trickled in. The database currently has about 300,000 records when some simple demographic modeling by the Government Accounatbility Office (GAO) shows it should contain about 2.7 million records.

Loughner and Cho (the VT shooter) would have both been prevented from purchasing their weapons if reporting practices had been better:

"The alleged shooter in the Virginia Tech case was found by a special judge to be '“an imminent danger to himself as a result of mental illness.'” The mayors’ group says that ruling should have prevented him from owning a gun, but because his mental health records weren’t sent to NCIS, he was able to purchase the gun that was used in the college killings.

"The group notes that Jared Loughner, the gunman who allegedly killed six and wounded 20 in Tucson, also should have been barred from purchasing the shotgun used in the killings after he was rejected from enlisting in the U.S. Army due to drug abuse. The mayors’ group says his record was not forwarded to the NCIS."

A more recent report by the GAO goes into this problem in exacting detail (government reports are so good on this stuff). Part of the problem is technical issues relating to the transfer of data, other problems involve lack of funding for the incentives to turn over records. The study showed that three months ago, thirty 30 states were not making any non-criminal mental health records available to the federal database.

As I said before, it is not yet known whether Holmes (the BatmanDK shooter) had a mental health history that would have precluded him from purchasing the weapons he used in his attack (or whether he purchased them at all), but Colorado is not one of the 10 states that has so far mandated the submission of their state records to the federal government.

We now know that Holmes did have mental health issues and they were reported to the state, but the state failed to report them to feds.

http://www.policymic.com/articles/1...re-should-never-have-happened-and-here-is-why

Why don't liberals screaming for more gun control just start here? Just a simple bill to require states to forward their criminal and mental health records.

Liberals efforts at gun control are aptly described in my sig.

Fern

 

[blankslate]

Wow. You're agonizingly stupid.

Private sales can occur anywhere. That is not a function of a gun show.

A gun could be sold at a bake sale. Is there a bake sale loophole?

A gun could be sold at a peace rally. Is there a peace rally loophole?

You're so fucking stupid it hurts.

Gun shows have private sellers, the private sellers should get the license number or state id number of the buy and provide that with the serial number of the firearm to local or state law enforcement officials. Bake sales or peace rallies don't generally attract gun sellers or purchasers.

You're such an idiot that it's too bad your mother didn't swallow that one time 9 months before your birth

 

[blankslate]

First, you need to fix the background check system. As it now stands states aren't required to forward their info, like those that have mental health issues, to the fed govt for background checks.

That's not a bad idea I've heard reports on the radio that the person who shot up the midnight showing was giving clues to his mental health counselor that he was becoming dangerous.

Despite privacy concerns having a better mental health risk reporting system to screen out mentally ill people who would be a danger with firearms. The privacy issue makes this a potentially thorny issue but the fact that just about every mass shooting that has garnered wide media coverage it seems to be, imo, an avenue worth pursuing.

 

[Fern]

That's not a bad idea I've heard reports on the radio that the person who shot up the midnight showing was giving clues to his mental health counselor that he was becoming dangerous.
-snip-

Even worse, she actually reported him to the state. However, CO failed to report that to the feds so he passed the fed background check. I.e., had the gun dealer run a CO state check the guy would have failed.

Fern

 

[Zodiark1593]

That's not a bad idea I've heard reports on the radio that the person who shot up the midnight showing was giving clues to his mental health counselor that he was becoming dangerous.

Despite privacy concerns having a better mental health risk reporting system to screen out mentally ill people who would be a danger with firearms. The privacy issue makes this a potentially thorny issue but the fact that just about every mass shooting that has garnered wide media coverage it seems to be, imo, an avenue worth pursuing.

Those who are proven dangerous shouldn't have firearms, of course. However, unless someone acts openly belligerent in a way that threatens others or him/herself, then there isn't a solid way to prove whether or not you're dangerous. Just because a person is a psychopath (lacks empathy), doesn't necessarily mean he's a danger to society (most psychopaths understand and follow the law).

Unless you wish to mark anyone with a notable mental disability or illness associated with violence as high risk, and have them monitored (privacy issues there), I don't see how anyone can prove any particular person is a danger until an incident has occurred.

 

[davmat787]

Gun shows have private sellers, the private sellers should get the license number or state id number of the buy and provide that with the serial number of the firearm to local or state law enforcement officials. Bake sales or peace rallies don't generally attract gun sellers or purchasers.

Ok, but that is a different thing altogether. Are you saying that privates sellers would only need to do this IF they are selling at a gunshow, or all private sales regardless of location?

Do understand now why so many people that are actually knowledgeable of the laws maintain that there is no such thing as a "gun show loophole"?

I seriously hope that does not come across as condescending, that is not my intent I assure you.

 

[blankslate]

Ok, but that is a different thing altogether. Are you saying that privates sellers would only need to do this IF they are selling at a gunshow, or all private sales regardless of location?

It would only be necessary for private sellers at gun shows because the ATF has done investigations of gun shows and found that people do go to them looking for private sellers to obtain weapons for illicit purposes.

Do understand now why so many people that are actually knowledgeable of the laws maintain that there is no such thing as a "gun show loophole"?

I disagree with them.

As for private sellers who sell weapons one at a time and don't do so at a gun show; the initial purchase of the firearm was probably made from a licensed dealer. In which case there already is paperwork that will lead investigators (if a crime is committed and the firearm recovered) to the person who bought the firearm from the licensed dealer or store.

If the person bought from a private seller at a gun show then the proposed paper work would also lead to the purchaser.

Under the above conditions most private sellers who don't sell at gun shows can be tracked down if a firearm used in a crime is recovered. Then the onus would be upon them to remember who they sold the weapon to.

Given the risk of selling a firearm to a complete stranger I doubt most private sellers who don't sell at gun shows sell to strangers they've just met without checking them out somehow or having a mutual trusted friend as a reference.

 

[DCal430]

I would like to see how well it works.

 

[Matt1970]

Or perhaps people should come up with numbers that show that magazines beyond the standard ones that come with pistols (7, 10, 13, 15, 20 or whatever odd number) aren't more dangerous.

Nope. I would say just like in a court of law the burden of proof is on the accuser. If you want to ban something you need to prove it is dangerous.

 

[Angry Irishman]

Clearly the answer to gun violence is to cure mental illness because it's not guns that are the problem but crazy folk who use them. And as technology advances and the capacity to destroy more and more lives with home brewed devices increases exponentially it will require more forceful methodologies to identify the mentally ill. Could the day be coming when the survival of the human race means the mentally ill will have to be culled? That might just include folk who have a brain defect that prevents logical reasoning, no? Only the illogical and irrational would build something that can destroy the human race or allow the system to run off a cliff, like say, by doing nothing about global warming. Perhaps we need colonies in space where pockets of sane people have a chance to survive the madness of an insane earth.

It's clear you're not going to the colonies of sane people.

 

[Doppel]

Schumer wants to ban.

This seems, more than anything really, like a law that if in place would only affect law abiding people. This cat is out of the bag, you can't put it back. A person can buy a printer and the materials it uses and print absolutely anything, this gun, a huge dildo, you can't stop it.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-3-D-printer-undetectable-metal-detector.html

 

[michal1980]

trying to ban this is like the music industry trying to ban music downloads.

 

[BoberFett]

Gun shows have private sellers, the private sellers should get the license number or state id number of the buy and provide that with the serial number of the firearm to local or state law enforcement officials. Bake sales or peace rallies don't generally attract gun sellers or purchasers.

So there is a bake sale loophole, you just refuse to admit it. Why don't you support sensible legislation of bake sales to prevent murders?

You're such an idiot that it's too bad your mother didn't swallow that one time 9 months before your birth

If not swallowing leads to pregnancy in your family, that would explain some things...

 

[Uhtrinity]

Has anyone brought up concerns about bypassing metal detectors? I realize that there are still some metal parts like the firing pin and the bullets themselves, but how long before you can obtain non metals for these parts. I could see a plastic gun ban coming for this reason, after all we don't want these smuggled onto planes or into courtrooms or other similar environments. There were similar concerns years ago when the Glock first came out, as well as guns with ceramic parts. Add to that these can't be tracked as they have no serial number. Imo these will become as illegal as sawed off shotguns.

Beyond that I would be afraid to fire one of these more than a few times for safety reasons. Especially a higher caliber.

 

[zsdersw]

fighting a losing battle.

This is something many on the evangelical/Christian right should empathize with... as they're fighting losing battles on social issues.

 

[irishScott]

This is something many on the evangelical/Christian right should empathize with... as they're fighting losing battles on social issues.

So overall we're heading towards a socially liberal society with solid gun rights. That gives me hope.

 

[irishScott]

Has anyone brought up concerns about bypassing metal detectors? I realize that there are still some metal parts like the firing pin and the bullets themselves, but how long before you can obtain non metals for these parts. I could see a plastic gun ban coming for this reason, after all we don't want these smuggled onto planes or into courtrooms or other similar environments. There were similar concerns years ago when the Glock first came out, as well as guns with ceramic parts. Add to that these can't be tracked as they have no serial number. Imo these will become as illegal as sawed off shotguns.

Beyond that I would be afraid to fire one of these more than a few times for safety reasons. Especially a higher caliber.

Oh there's no doubt they'll be declared illegal. But with likely advances in 3D printing over the next decade, there won't be much to stop those who don't give a shit.

 

[zsdersw]

So overall we're heading towards a socially liberal society with solid gun rights.

Yes, I'd say we are... and that's a good thing.