The FBI Has Been Raiding Charter Schools

[WHAMPOM]

This isn't much different that the current "For Profit" College scheme. Its nothing but a money grab at federally backed student loans. People talk about student loan debt and "For Profit" colleges are a big problem with it.

You must mean the diploma mills, attend eight two hour seminars and get a doctorate.

 

[glenn1]

Uh, no they don't. I'll try to explain with numbers; not the actual numbers but for the purposes of trying to get through to you what's happening, they're good enough.

Pre-charter: public school overall average = 75%

Charter school comes in. Give us your best students. We don't want the special ed students.
Charter average: 80%
Public school average drops to 65%. See how much better the charter school is doing? However, if you look at the average of those students pre-charter school, the students they siphoned off used to have an 85% average. And, in many cases, there's a lot more grade inflation in charter schools.

Clue: why don't you think there's a charter school whose mission it is to take the special ed students and all the other academically challenged students, and educate them?

You have to apply to get into charter schools. By default, that eliminates the kids whose parents don't give a shit about their educations. So, of course they end up with better students, on average, than public schools. That gives a false illusion that they're doing better.

Just because you don't like how it was done doesn't make it a "false illusion." And I don't care if the stupid kids or ones with uninterested parents get dumped into public schools since there's no reason to bring the other kids down to their level rather than letting the excellent kids excel in a superior school.

 

[DrPizza]

Just because you don't like how it was done doesn't make it a "false illusion." And I don't care if the stupid kids or ones with uninterested parents get dumped into public schools since there's no reason to bring the other kids down to their level rather than letting the excellent kids excel in a superior school.

*sigh*
Let me explain part of that point again: they only LOOK like they're doing better. The good kids aren't doing better than they did in the public school. I.e., a kid who would have gotten a 5 on the AP test in public school only achieves a 4 in the charter school. But, because from outside, you're only seeing the averages of the kids in the charter schools, and the average of the kids in the regular schools, it looks like they're doing better.

 

[bshole]

*sigh*
Let me explain part of that point again: they only LOOK like they're doing better. The good kids aren't doing better than they did in the public school. I.e., a kid who would have gotten a 5 on the AP test in public school only achieves a 4 in the charter school. But, because from outside, you're only seeing the averages of the kids in the charter schools, and the average of the kids in the regular schools, it looks like they're doing better.

I think glenn might have ridden the short bus, I think you are going to have to dumb it down just a little bit more.

 

[ElFenix]

this is just like health insurance: extract big premiums from those who are healthy and don't need much help while providing just enough service to prevent pitchforks, and dump the unhealthy on the taxpayers. same thing.

 

[glenn1]

*sigh*
Let me explain part of that point again: they only LOOK like they're doing better. The good kids aren't doing better than they did in the public school. I.e., a kid who would have gotten a 5 on the AP test in public school only achieves a 4 in the charter school. But, because from outside, you're only seeing the averages of the kids in the charter schools, and the average of the kids in the regular schools, it looks like they're doing better.

Then by your logic Harvard is no better a school than ITT trucking academy since they only accept brighter students. Student sorting is an improvement in outcome on its own merits regardless of any educational outperformance.

 

[ElFenix]

Then by your logic Harvard is no better a school than ITT trucking academy since they only accept brighter students. Student sorting is an improvement in outcome on its own merits regardless of any educational outperformance.

No, its not.

 

[CitizenKain]

If you ever want to see how far down the rabbit hole of charter schools go, look no further then Accelerated Christian Education (A.C.E) and The School of Tomorrow are doing. Those schools are the ones that need to have Fed's kicking doors down and dragging people out by their hair.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

There is - in all honesty - nothing wrong with the public schools. I went through both private and public, all the Asian kids went through and stomped everyone in Public - none of which were in the private schools I attended.

The education is there for you to take be it public or private. Albeit, the teachers are likely to be better in private but that's a different subject and more in-depth.

 

[ElFenix]

There is - in all honesty - nothing wrong with the public schools. I went through both private and public, all the Asian kids went through and stomped everyone in Public - none of which were in the private schools I attended.

The education is there for you to take be it public or private. Albeit, the teachers are likely to be better in private but that's a different subject and more in-depth.

the biggest difference between teachers in public school and teachers in private school is that the private school teachers aren't completely hamstrung when it comes to classroom discipline.

 

[glenn1]

No, its not.

So you would be completely ambivalent if you were presented with 2 classrooms, one with children of drug addicts, criminals, and neglectful parents; and the other children of professionals, Nobel laureates, and PhDs?

 

[highland145]

the biggest difference between teachers in public school and teachers in private school is that the private school teachers aren't completely hamstrung when it comes to classroom discipline.

QFT at my kids school. They will put undisciplined children out of the door with no refund because of the policy the parents sign.

I love it. 85%+ teaching during a class period. Who da thunk?

 

[sandorski]

If you ever want to see how far down the rabbit hole of charter schools go, look no further then Accelerated Christian Education (A.C.E) and The School of Tomorrow are doing. Those schools are the ones that need to have Fed's kicking doors down and dragging people out by their hair.

Ahh, what are they up to? I actually graduated from an A.C.E. school. It wasn't a Charter and was structured solely on ability to Pay. That said, it was unique in that way and certainly not the norm.

What I disliked most about A.C.E., in retrospect, was how much Religion is involved in it. Science, for eg, was YEC focused and Noah's Flood was treated as a fact. Other subjects also had Religious messages throughout, but the actual subject matter was reasonably well covered, although History may have had some questionable content.

 

[CitizenKain]

Ahh, what are they up to? I actually graduated from an A.C.E. school. It wasn't a Charter and was structured solely on ability to Pay. That said, it was unique in that way and certainly not the norm.

What I disliked most about A.C.E., in retrospect, was how much Religion is involved in it. Science, for eg, was YEC focused and Noah's Flood was treated as a fact. Other subjects also had Religious messages throughout, but the actual subject matter was reasonably well covered, although History may have had some questionable content.

Generally being really shitty schools that are designed to funnel children to fundamentalist colleges.

A.C.E. stands to benefit massively from the school voucher movement, and is already more widespread than many realize. While it is virtually certain that School of Tomorrow (and others) are lobbying behind the scene for this, to my knowledge no documentation exists.
A.C.E. is designed as an explicitly political curriculum and is unabashedly pro-conservative. There is no nuance for any topic what-so-fucking-ever.
One of School of Tomorrow's explicit goals is to shift public policy as far right as possible. The curriculum itself actively advocates for students to become politically active in conservative causes.
There is no central governing authority or real certification process for School of Tomorrow schools. Operating an A.C.E. school is more akin to buying a T.V than actually educating children. As a result each A.C.E. school is more like a Greek city-state than an integrated education system. This comparison is not entirely apt because Greek city-state's had way more interaction with each other than A.C.E. schools do.
Physical abuse is part of the design. These come in the form of "Whacks", strong blows to a child delivered with a wooden paddle. (When I was nine I received my first whack for "scoring errors" and a "spirit of rebellion". Leaning over a heater, I was struck so hard my body numbed over for a few moments before I felt the pain) Although within the past few years A.C.E. has backed off of officially including whacks in its guidelines to teachers and principles, individual schools can "opt in" and design their own corporal punishment programs.
Students whom complete the full A.C.E. course graduate with no real skills beyond being really really good at simple math and following instructions. There are almost no other useful skills conferred.
Because oversight of individual schools is essentially non-existant, A.C.E. functions as a remarkably effective enabler for small fundamentalist cults. In reading survivor stories you will see the word "cult" ascribed to the various schools that employ this system often. In my own case, the school I attended was absolutely a cult.

This is from a person who got through a ACE school. Like he says, his was far more terrible then what most will go through.

 

[sandorski]

Generally being really shitty schools that are designed to funnel children to fundamentalist colleges.



This is from a person who got through a ACE school. Like he says, his was far more terrible then what most will go through.

Damn. My experience was much better, but as far as the Political and Evangelical slant, it is definitely part of the curriculum.

 

[MrCassdin]

why not raid some public schools?

No joke, public schools are a money pit and have been for 30 years.

Lets buy every kid an iPad, our graduation rates are 50% and even fewer can read but they'll all have iPads!