The F-35 is a piece of garbage!

[norseamd]

http://warontherocks.com/2016/03/stuck-on-denial-part-i-the-u-s-air-force-and-stealth/

 

[thesmokingman]

That's BS about their maneuverability. Check out this video of the vertical takeoff. The Chinese are scared about this.....especially if we ever float our carrier near Wake Island.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQb02O2CG9w

That is so fake.

 

[John Connor]

LMAO! Looks like BF2.

 

[Blackjack200]

http://warontherocks.com/2016/03/stuck-on-denial-part-i-the-u-s-air-force-and-stealth/

So, what did you think?

 

[Ventanni]

The article does hint on some interesting points, but I disagree with it overall. The Air Force has to utilize aircraft to fulfill a number of different missions:

-Stealth penetration
-Air Superiority and Long Range Patrol
-Ground Attack / Heavy Bombing
-Electronic Warfare
-Search and Rescue, Transport, etc.

Depending on the aircraft utilized, these roles can overlap. For instance, an F-16 can fulfill both a ground attack and air superiority role, but it doesn't match the B1B at bombing (obviously) and it certainly can't match the F-22 or F-15E at air superiority, but for most missions it does an extremely good job. What has made the US Air Force so extremely effective and dominant worldwide over the last 30 years is its effectiveness at stealth penetration, electronic warfare, and air superiority. If the enemy can't fight back, then what does it matter what aircraft is dropping the bombs? The F-35 is actually going to be an extremely good aircraft once it's finalized, because unlike other aircraft, it's centered around an extremely advanced avionics package that allows it to collect massive amounts of data and intelligence, spot and target enemy radar, and pick out objects on the ground that other planes could never see. It's also, according to former F-16 pilots, a pretty decent dog fighter, but that's not going to be its primary mission; the US Air Force flies F-22's and F-15's on interceptor missions simultaneously while the ground attack airplanes are doing their job.

Overall I think the F-35 will be a fantastic plane once it goes fully online. It's been sticky, for sure, but it's going to replace many different aircraft that already need replacing anyways, and it's going to simplify the logistics chain dramatically, which is always a plus. And since our allies will also be using it, it will simplify the logistics chain with them, too. Ever consider other nations flying their warplanes on our ships? Currently only the French Rafale-M is capable and licensed to launch from a US carrier, but imagine the British being able to fly and launch from our 10 Amphibious Warfare ships as well. It brings a lot of new possibilities to work with our allies.

 

[Blackjack200]

Denmark chooses F-35 after working with consultants on independent evaluation.

http://breakingdefense.com/2016/05/f-35-wins-denmark-competition-trounces-super-hornet-eurofighter/

tl-dr?

Denmark needed some new jets to replace their F16s. They looked at the F-35, the Super Hornet, and the Eurofighter Typhoon. The F-35 curb stomped all of them, and came in billions of dollars cheaper in total costs.

 

[norseamd]

They didnt even consider the Saab Gripen NG?

 

[norseamd]

Denmark chooses F-35 after working with consultants on independent evaluation.

http://breakingdefense.com/2016/05/f-35-wins-denmark-competition-trounces-super-hornet-eurofighter/

tl-dr?

Denmark needed some new jets to replace their F16s. They looked at the F-35, the Super Hornet, and the Eurofighter Typhoon. The F-35 curb stomped all of them, and came in billions of dollars cheaper in total costs.

Oh yeah! YEAH!

[UPDATE: Leading aviation analyst Richard Aboulafia pointed to me that the procurement prices per plane are dodgy. The F-35A is priced at $80 million, which is the ambitious but no longer implausible target that program manager Lt. Gen. Chris Bogdan says the plane will reach around 2019. But the F/A-18F Super Hornet is priced at a whopping $122 million, when the Navy’s official figure is $57 million and prospective sales are often priced lower.]

Now where the fuck have we seen this before? Class, can any one tell me?

 

[biostud]

They didnt even consider the Saab Gripen NG?

They pulled out of the process some years ago.

 

[norseamd]

They pulled out of the process some years ago.

Yeah, I remember reading about that now that I found a few articles talking about Saab declining to respond to the invitations to the tender.

Probably because they knew it was going to be rigged to begin with.

 

[norseamd]

I hate linking to this site, but oh well. For what it is worth, here is an article on Denmark deciding to purchase the F-35 for their military.

https://warisboring.com/denmarks-f-35-decision-is-pretty-dumb-e2c1037f50ad#.xs7q6g5wm

 

[pauldun170]

I hate linking to this site, but oh well. For what it is worth, here is an article on Denmark deciding to purchase the F-35 for their military.

https://warisboring.com/denmarks-f-35-decision-is-pretty-dumb-e2c1037f50ad#.xs7q6g5wm

Everytime you read that site it makes you dumber.
Norseamd...you are getting dumber and dumber each time you post from that site.
I won't even waste any time trying to explain all the nonsense presented at that blog

I'd suggest you refer to these links
http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=45487&sid=0572ac5fb377cd74f877f6d4727ed8e7
http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=45448&sid=3deb69daf022b3eac8862058aa0ed4ef

If you have questions, I suggest you sign up there and ask the many active and retired pilots and support crews on that site.

 

[Svnla]

I will put this here.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/denmark-just-issued-glowing-review-145618982.html



.

 

[biostud]

I will put this here.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/denmark-just-issued-glowing-review-145618982.html



.

There is a very strong chance that the reviewers have been assigned to make F-35 look as the best choice, since it is what the US government want, and the danish government does whatever US wants regarding military strategy.

 

[Blackjack200]

There is a very strong chance that the reviewers have been assigned to make F-35 look as the best choice, since it is what the US government want, and the danish government does whatever US wants regarding military strategy.

Why?

Why would the U.S. Government care whether Denmark purchased their fighters from Boeing or Lockheed?

Why would Denmark care what the American Government thought?

If you read the reports its very clear that Denmark did consider that the USAF is planning on keeping the F-35 around for 50 years. Do you think that Denmark wants to be stuck with a bunch of obsolete F-18s in 20 years when the USN is transitioning to F-35s and whatever gen 6 fighter comes next? This is a no-brainer from Denmark's perspective. The only reason to buy old fighter designs is to tide you over until your F-35s are ready.

 

[norseamd]

Why?

Why would the U.S. Government care whether Denmark purchased their fighters from Boeing or Lockheed?

Why would Denmark care what the American Government thought?

If you read the reports its very clear that Denmark did consider that the USAF is planning on keeping the F-35 around for 50 years. Do you think that Denmark wants to be stuck with a bunch of obsolete F-18s in 20 years when the USN is transitioning to F-35s and whatever gen 6 fighter comes next? This is a no-brainer from Denmark's perspective. The only reason to buy old fighter designs is to tide you over until your F-35s are ready.

So not only do you not have any brain cells when it comes to deciding whether or not the F-35 is the most Don Frye since sliced bread, you do not even have any brain cells when it comes to twisting and bending anything and everything in a discussion when it comes to something poo poo about your precious.

 

[Blackjack200]

I can't answer any of your questions

Understood.

 

[norseamd]

Understood.

No I very well can, the fact you speak as if you dont even know the answers to those simple questions is a sign you are nothing but a blathering ignorant groupie.

 

[Blackjack200]

You're the one throwing out crap about "rigged" fighter competitions with absolutely no plausible reason for Denmark to give two fucks about what the American government thinks of their procurement decisions.

Canada? The UK? Israel? Those are at least plausible. Denmark? No.

 

[norseamd]

You are pulling out a fallacy there, or even multiple fallacies. I will have to look it up to see if I can find which ones.

I am going to go with appeal to rationality and middle ground for $750.

 

[Blackjack200]

Irrational would be thinking that 20-30 year old fighter designs would compete with a contemporary fighter.

External quality assurance

In order to ensure external and independent control, external quality assurance has been conducted of the products prepared by the New Fighter Program in developing this basis for decision. Quality assurance has been carried out by Danish experts from Deloitte in cooperation with international experts from RAND Europe assisted by QinetiQ and Vorderman Consultancy. As Deloitte was involved in developing the economic model, the quality control of the evaluation of the economic aspects was undertaken by RAND Europe.

Hahaha, look at all those independent consultants that were in on the fix, just so Lockmart could sell 26 more jets.

 

[norseamd]

Appeal to authority, more appeal to rationality, personal incredulity, appeal to bandwagon, etc. Plus in all the arguments going back from both you and Pauldun170, lots of burden of proof, ambiguity, composition/division, black-or-white, anecdotal, etc.

 

[Blackjack200]

Appeal to authority, more appeal to rationality, personal incredulity, appeal to bandwagon, etc. Plus in all the arguments going back from both you and Pauldun170, lots of burden of proof, ambiguity, composition/division, black-or-white, anecdotal, etc.

An appeal to authority is only a fallacy if the authority's credibility is dubious. In other words, if you want to say my point about RAND et. al. is fallacious, you need to discredit those consultants. There's no such fallacy as appeal to rationality. Lol.

 

[norseamd]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=appeal+to+rationality

 

[Blackjack200]

You didn't actually check those results, did ya chief? Appeal to rationality is not a logical fallacy. Stop and think about how obvious that is for a moment.