the goal of anarchy is chaos, the goal of libertarianism is order through individual responsibility, that's my understanding.
the goal of anarchy is chaos, the goal of libertarianism is order through individual responsibility, that's my understanding.
Somalia has had a booming economy since the collapse of the central government. Exports have gone up tremendously, the telecommunications system is better than the surrounding countries, and the banking sector is flourishing as well. The overall standard of living has increased significantly.
You may not realize this, but democracy is incompatible with Somalian culture. Somalian culture developed around a sense of community with one's clan. When Somalia had democracy everybody would try to exploit the government to suit their clan which led to violence. I just hope the corrupt trash governments surrounding Somalia don't invade so Somalia will have a chance to develop (the governments that we seem to keep throwing money at..).
Translation: "If I'm rude enough in my response that you won't respond, I'll take advantage of that to make baseless claims that my post was just so wonderful it has no counter."
Way not to get a response.
Discussing with civil people is one thing, with others something else.
You believe what you like, the readers can judge for themselves. Let's just say that your inference about the response was wrong. You're visiting jerkland - don't move there.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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No. Libertarianism does not strive for order or responsibility. It strives for individual freedom and equality through the rule of law.
The first sentence of the wikipedia page sums it up IMO - Text
"Libertarianism is a political philosophy that advocates individuals should have complete freedom of action, in regard to use of their body and property, as long as they do not infringe on the same liberty of others."
But that wold mean that if somebody is having fun I couldn't pass a law to stop them. Hell, that sucks.
there's support for your descripton in that article, but also for my mine. in fact based on that article Libertarianism means whatever anyone wants it to mean, pretty much.
The confusion over this is, I believe, what causes such a lack of mainstream support for the Libertarian party.
In all seriousness, if Libertarians were to form a government it would be very nearly the original form of America's government -- a light weight government that grants inherent rights to people and limits the power of the government to infringe upon those rights while allowing citizens legal means to assert their own rights where they are encroached either by the government or by other people.
The Libertarian party was unnecessary while the Constitution was being upheld and interpreted as closely as possible to it's original intent. Since popular opinion is to ignore the fact that our government no longer checks or balances itself either against the other branches or against our Constitution (and we feel this is ok because we believe ourselves to be a democracy where majority opinion is the be all end all), there is a need for people (like those in the LP) to state things that should be obvious to anyone taught about the founding of this country.
We are to be protected from the rich, from the powerful, from the government and even from majority rule by the "rule of law" which is defined in the constitution. There are laws that should not be allowed to be made no matter how popular, and there are actions that should not be taken no matter how "morally apporpirate" and popular they may or may not be.
There are a great many laws that are unconstitutional, but never seem to get challenged ... we have failed to require our government to live up to its constraints, which is easy to slip into when the majority of people agree with the effect of a law.
Anyway, now I'm rambling ... I'll shut up
Originally posted by: DerekWilson
The confusion over this is, I believe, what causes such a lack of mainstream support for the Libertarian party.
In all seriousness, if Libertarians were to form a government it would be very nearly the original form of America's government -- a light weight government that grants inherent rights to people and limits the power of the government to infringe upon those rights while allowing citizens legal means to assert their own rights where they are encroached either by the government or by other people.
The Libertarian party was unnecessary while the Constitution was being upheld and interpreted as closely as possible to it's original intent. Since popular opinion is to ignore the fact that our government no longer checks or balances itself either against the other branches or against our Constitution (and we feel this is ok because we believe ourselves to be a democracy where majority opinion is the be all end all), there is a need for people (like those in the LP) to state things that should be obvious to anyone taught about the founding of this country.
We are to be protected from the rich, from the powerful, from the government and even from majority rule by the "rule of law" which is defined in the constitution. There are laws that should not be allowed to be made no matter how popular, and there are actions that should not be taken no matter how "morally apporpirate" and popular they may or may not be.
There are a great many laws that are unconstitutional, but never seem to get challenged ... we have failed to require our government to live up to its constraints, which is easy to slip into when the majority of people agree with the effect of a law.
Anyway, now I'm rambling ... I'll shut up
Since the days of the founding fathers, great new powers have arisen which they could not have foreseen - our private, corporate powers.
A far smaller version of these powers existed in the days of the founding fathers - it was the first and largest corporation in the world, the East india Trading Company, founded by Queen Elizabeth, and designed to profit its owners/partners, the government of England. It was opposition to the corrupt power of this corporation was the real focus of our revolutionary war. The corruption of the government of England granting this corporation special privileges for its own profit enraged the mercantile of the United States who suffered the results. This was the source of the specific complaints of 'taxation without representation', of the 'oppressive' taxes colonists had to pay and from which the East India Trading Company was exempted, leading directly to the Boston Tea Party.
Our fonding fathers wanted a society in which men, citizens, had power over the concentrated powers in society - at that time, the monarchy and parliament. You can find occassional warning comments from founding fathers about if the corporations should ever grow much in power, but how could they see the industrial revolution and the enormous growth of the financial markets to our situation today? If they had, I feel sure they would have included the protection of citizens' powers from private power as well.
They would have ensured the public could force the corporations, while profiting handsomely, to serve the public need, not bankrupt the nation for their own gain. We saw great American work through many of these issues as the 'laissez-faire' approach ofthe default system then and the Libertarian party today fell short, and adapted the role of government to help create a thriving marketplace and prosperity spread across the nation.
A call for simply returning to the setup that worked without the modern economic power structures, without any account for them, is incredibly naive and dangerous.
Rather, the founding *principles*, including the ones against corrupt concentrated power against which our founding fathers fought, have to be the principles we protect.
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