The end of the Dream Team? David Stern comments on Olympic Basketball Dream Team

[The Boston Dangler]

i dislike the ioc as well as the ncaa

 

[Atomic Playboy]

All this talk about "amateurs vs. professionals" is ridiculous. The Olympics should be about seeing who the best athletes in the world are. In a lot of sports, the best athletes are going to be getting paid for being good at their sport; that's how life works. If you're good at something, do it for money. Instituting rules to keep the best athletes from attending is counter-productive and totally against the idea of a global athletic competition.

But as far as NBA players playing in the Olympics, I do think we need a rule change. Specifically, at least for team USA, I think only retired NBA players should be considered. Re-unite the Dream Team from 1992 and see if they can still hang with the youngins. Tell me you wouldn't love to see Jordan or Magic or Charles Goddamn Barkeley trying to square off with someone half their age. It would be awesome.

 

[dougp]

There's no way Stern could keep international players out of the Olympics and playing for their national teams. This would require a big change to the CBA which is secured for the next few years, and given that Euro contracts are already matching NBA contracts financially, ostracizing international players like this would hurt the NBA more than help it. Stern can go fuck himself - hell, the NBA rules aren't anywhere near a pain that the FIBA rules are (there are uh, slight changes, that have pissed off a few US players.)

 

[bfdd]

I like having the USA destroy everyone. I mean that's what the olympics are all about right?

Pretty much this, but I don't think anyone should get paid to do it. Unless some charity is collecting money to pay them, they should do it simply to show they're the best. It's pathetic how much money is involved with the NBA now.

 

[thegimp03]

I want to keep the dream teams because I like to see them kick ass. Plus, it's awesome to see that many high profile players team up when it counts for something, unlike at the All Star game. This basically comes down to Stern being pissed about not getting any money.

 

[surfsatwerk]

The NBA is destroying the game of basketball.

 

[MotionMan]

I want to keep the dream teams because I like to see them kick ass. Plus, it's awesome to see that many high profile players team up when it counts for something, unlike at the All Star game. This basically comes down to the owners, Stern's employer, being pissed about not getting any money.

Fixed.

MotionMan

 

[Fenixgoon]

i recall the USA "dream teams" losing more than winning, but that might be my clouded memory. after all, international basketball has different rules than NBA, and because all of those international teams play together (unlike the assembled team of solo artists the USA has had), they actually knew how to play as a team and win. on paper our team was superior in every way, but in actual play we lost.

but again, my memory is clouded and i stopped following bball a long time ago, so i could be wrong.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

i recall the USA "dream teams" losing more than winning, but that might be my clouded memory. after all, international basketball has different rules than NBA, and because all of those international teams play together (unlike the assembled team of solo artists the USA has had), they actually knew how to play as a team and win. on paper our team was superior in every way, but in actual play we lost.

but again, my memory is clouded and i stopped following bball a long time ago, so i could be wrong.

In the Olympics, they've won every gold medal except 2004.

 

[MotionMan]

i recall the USA "dream teams" losing more than winning, but that might be my clouded memory. after all, international basketball has different rules than NBA, and because all of those international teams play together (unlike the assembled team of solo artists the USA has had), they actually knew how to play as a team and win. on paper our team was superior in every way, but in actual play we lost.

but again, my memory is clouded and i stopped following bball a long time ago, so i could be wrong.

They have done pretty well since 2006 (http://www.usabasketball.com/mens/national/schedule.html)

MotionMan

 

[Childs]

i recall the USA "dream teams" losing more than winning, but that might be my clouded memory. after all, international basketball has different rules than NBA, and because all of those international teams play together (unlike the assembled team of solo artists the USA has had), they actually knew how to play as a team and win. on paper our team was superior in every way, but in actual play we lost.

but again, my memory is clouded and i stopped following bball a long time ago, so i could be wrong.

It only seems that way because the US losing is a really big deal. And when they lost it wasn't a lack of talent, its just the lack of prep time. Other countries keep their teams together for years, playing in every international event. US puts 12 different guys together every year, with a couple of weeks practice time. At least that was the conventional thinking, until the "B" team won the world championships in 2010 with mostly young players, and no bigs. It could be that we just need to send guys over who want to compete, and the college guys always did.

 

[JTsyo]

It only seems that way because the US losing is a really big deal. And when they lost it wasn't a lack of talent, its just the lack of prep time. Other countries keep their teams together for years, playing in every international event. US puts 12 different guys together every year, with a couple of weeks practice time. At least that was the conventional thinking, until the "B" team won the world championships in 2010 with mostly young players, and no bigs. It could be that we just need to send guys over who want to compete, and the college guys always did.

I bet if the team that won the last NBA finals went, they would do better than the Dream Teams overall.

 

[dougp]

I bet if the team that won the last NBA finals went, they would do better than the Dream Teams overall.

Don't be so sure. There are really solid international teams, as well as non-preferential calls and different rules when it comes to FIBA and international competition. Spain and Argentina are no slouches, and if the NBA looks to restrict players from playing internationally, then all the international players will look to play in the Euro leagues.

 

[Jadow]

I like the 23 and under rule.

I actually think that would hurt countries like Spain more than the USA.

We can suit up an awesome team of 23 year olds, but bye bye Gasols and most of the best Euro players.

 

[Red Storm]

I like the 23 and under rule.

I actually think that would hurt countries like Spain more than the USA.

We can suit up an awesome team of 23 year olds, but bye bye Gasols and most of the best Euro players.

I don't think it would have any bearing on the Spanish national team, just Team USA.

 

[dougp]

I like the 23 and under rule.

I actually think that would hurt countries like Spain more than the USA.

We can suit up an awesome team of 23 year olds, but bye bye Gasols and most of the best Euro players.

I wonder if you'll see a lot of Olympic competition push for under 23, such as baseball. But a lot of Euro players are young too - we just don't see them coming to the NBA because of contracts they can get overseas. It isn't strange to see $3-4mm/year contracts get handed out - might not seem like a lot to people when you look at the NBA, but they get to stay closer to home as well as shorter seasons.

 

[Red Storm]

I think the average NBA salary is ~6 mil/year.

 

[dougp]

I think the average NBA salary is ~6 mil/year.

A year ago it was $5.15mm/year - and it's set to go down, or at least that was the point of the new CBA. Like I said, I don't expect it to match over there but players have shorter season and they stay closer to home, as well as the ability to compete internationally vs. not if the NBA implements some sort of rule. A lot of international players feel it is their duty in playing for their country, and they take a lot of pride in it - look at Yao, the Gasol brothers, Rubio (who almost didn't come because of the money he made overseas) - quite honestly, I could keep going on in terms of naming off players.

 

[pelov]

I like the 23 and under rule.

I actually think that would hurt countries like Spain more than the USA.

We can suit up an awesome team of 23 year olds, but bye bye Gasols and most of the best Euro players.

The 23-and-under rule before '92 was a self-imposed rule on the US. We didn't field any over-23 players because up until the late '80s it was unnecessary. The college kids did great. Once the USSR started playing well (they didn't have such a rule) then the gloves came off and they put together the Dream Team.

A 23-and-under rule would only work if you have something like the World Cup for the other players -- all of them, actually, because both under and over 23 can participate in it. Attempting to revert to the old self-imposed regulations doesn't really accomplish anything unless the Olympic committee is going to apply that rule universally. It would be a mistake.

I would actually prefer a World Cup of basketball. The World Cup shows that you don't need the Olympics in order to provide a good stage for countries to showcase their talents in the more popular sports. Granted, basketball is nowhere near soccer as far as popularity and marketability goes but it's still a viable option. Something like baseball wouldn't work, though, because it would be just 2-3 nations watching a bunch of fat asses throw a ball back and forth for 4 hours. Nobody cares.

Basketball World Cup means more games, more TV viewing, and more viewers without losing that 'Merica, Fuck yeah! vibe.

 

[oddyager]

The 23-and-under rule before '92 was a self-imposed rule on the US. We didn't field any over-23 players because up until the late '80s it was unnecessary. The college kids did great. Once the USSR started playing well (they didn't have such a rule) then the gloves came off and they put together the Dream Team.

A 23-and-under rule would only work if you have something like the World Cup for the other players -- all of them, actually, because both under and over 23 can participate in it. Attempting to revert to the old self-imposed regulations doesn't really accomplish anything unless the Olympic committee is going to apply that rule universally. It would be a mistake.

I would actually prefer a World Cup of basketball. The World Cup shows that you don't need the Olympics in order to provide a good stage for countries to showcase their talents in the more popular sports. Granted, basketball is nowhere near soccer as far as popularity and marketability goes but it's still a viable option. Something like baseball wouldn't work, though, because it would be just 2-3 nations watching a bunch of fat asses throw a ball back and forth for 4 hours. Nobody cares.

Basketball World Cup means more games, more TV viewing, and more viewers without losing that 'Merica, Fuck yeah! vibe.

Agreed on most points with one exception. There is a world baseball classic already for international play.

 

[WelshBloke]

TBH the olympics should go back to excluding professionals from basketball, soccer, hockey and baseball

Personally I don't think traditional team sports belong in the Olympics at all.

 

[surfsatwerk]

Personally I don't think traditional team sports belong in the Olympics at all.

I am with you on this.

 

[KeithP]

Until a superstar gets a season/career ending injury and then it just sucks.

I like the new suggested model, it matches soccer. Have the young guys play in the Olympics, and the stars can still play in the World Championships.

So you are saying you have no problem with a young player getting a career ending injury you just don't want that to happen to a "superstar"?

Personally, I don't care either way. The Olympics are a joke. Between the over the top corporate sponsorship, individual and state-sponsored cheating, it is a hollow shell of what was originally intended.

-KeithP

 

[dougp]

The 23-and-under rule before '92 was a self-imposed rule on the US. We didn't field any over-23 players because up until the late '80s it was unnecessary. The college kids did great. Once the USSR started playing well (they didn't have such a rule) then the gloves came off and they put together the Dream Team.

A 23-and-under rule would only work if you have something like the World Cup for the other players -- all of them, actually, because both under and over 23 can participate in it. Attempting to revert to the old self-imposed regulations doesn't really accomplish anything unless the Olympic committee is going to apply that rule universally. It would be a mistake.

I would actually prefer a World Cup of basketball. The World Cup shows that you don't need the Olympics in order to provide a good stage for countries to showcase their talents in the more popular sports. Granted, basketball is nowhere near soccer as far as popularity and marketability goes but it's still a viable option. Something like baseball wouldn't work, though, because it would be just 2-3 nations watching a bunch of fat asses throw a ball back and forth for 4 hours. Nobody cares.

Basketball World Cup means more games, more TV viewing, and more viewers without losing that 'Merica, Fuck yeah! vibe.

There is a basketball world cup - it's the FIBA World Championship.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIBA_Basketball_World_Cup

The more you know ... :whiste:

 

[pelov]

There is a basketball world cup - it's the FIBA World Championship.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIBA_Basketball_World_Cup

The more you know ... :whiste:

I know this, but who played? Not the star-filled Olympic team and certainly not the best team.

The point Stern is making is that basketball has enough momentum and a big enough following that a World Cup type tournament and qualification makes sense. Don't kid yourself, FIBA isn't even close.

The World Cup of basketball should be treated like the World Cup of soccer. The biggest tournament of the sport and the Olympics serves as the B-team. FIBA and the Olympics don't fill that role