The Deep State is real.

Mar 11, 2004
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However, as usual, its basically the opposite (meaning Turmp and Republicans behavior has been to try and keep their old school corrupt broken all but outright white supremacist behavior as the status quo for government agencies as that's been changing). For the people saying that what Turmp did (with regards to various actions) have no precedence, go back and look at the Iranian arms sales and funding the Contras. Literally the same, arguably worse (because covering evidence required shredding documents back then, not just using encrypted messaging programs) was done by Republicans back then. And yet most people seem more focused on Oliver North's secretary. At the time, he literally used the Jack Nicholson "A Few Good Men" argument of "I did what I did because American needs us guarding that wall" (we just didn't get a public bombshell admittance that the movie did), where they claim any and all horrible shit they were doing was to save American lives.

Bush Sr pardoned people that were involved (with him) prior to their trials (meaning we never found out exactly what they did). Remember when people wondered if Turmp would/could do that? It already happened and fucking nothing was done about it. Republicans did all the same shit too. Stalled and were uncooperative and didn't turn over documents. Intentionally fucked up the investigations (in a variety of ways, including deliberately hamstringing the investigators) and just bleated "partisan witch hunt!" at every turn.

Its all the same shit. Its why they knew it would work, because Americans never understood or cared what actually happened, so they were of course doomed to let it repeat.

It also shows how much Nixon fucked us as every Presidential scandal was then viewed under the lens of the Watergate scandal, which completely fucked up how the Iranian arms sales and Contra support was approached.
 

Viper1j

Diamond Member
Jul 31, 2018
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However, as usual, its basically the opposite (meaning Turmp and Republicans behavior has been to try and keep their old school corrupt broken all but outright white supremacist behavior as the status quo for government agencies as that's been changing). For the people saying that what Turmp did (with regards to various actions) have no precedence, go back and look at the Iranian arms sales and funding the Contras. Literally the same, arguably worse (because covering evidence required shredding documents back then, not just using encrypted messaging programs) was done by Republicans back then. And yet most people seem more focused on Oliver North's secretary. At the time, he literally used the Jack Nicholson "A Few Good Men" argument of "I did what I did because American needs us guarding that wall" (we just didn't get a public bombshell admittance that the movie did), where they claim any and all horrible shit they were doing was to save American lives.

Bush Sr pardoned people that were involved (with him) prior to their trials (meaning we never found out exactly what they did). Remember when people wondered if Turmp would/could do that? It already happened and fucking nothing was done about it. Republicans did all the same shit too. Stalled and were uncooperative and didn't turn over documents. Intentionally fucked up the investigations (in a variety of ways, including deliberately hamstringing the investigators) and just bleated "partisan witch hunt!" at every turn.

Its all the same shit. Its why they knew it would work, because Americans never understood or cared what actually happened, so they were of course doomed to let it repeat.

It also shows how much Nixon fucked us as every Presidential scandal was then viewed under the lens of the Watergate scandal, which completely fucked up how the Iranian arms sales and Contra support was approached.

Uh huh... :rolleyes:

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Mar 11, 2004
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I'm not even the first person to make the comparison of Turmp with Iran-Contras scandals.

It seems that most Americans don't seem to know what all happened back then. Even if many know about North's testimony in front of Congress and that Reagan knew way more than he claimed, I don't think most people know that Bush Sr pardoned co-conspirators of his while he was President, including pardoning someone before they even had a trial (which got quite a lot of publicity about if Turmp would and if it would be allowed to happen in the various indictments of Turmp campaign and administration personnel).

It really shouldn't shock people how many of those names have come up over and over again in the 30 years after those scandals. Its what freaked out Republicans about Turmp is they thought he would boot them out, but, like I've shown over and over, once they realized Turmp compromised himself with the Russians just like many of the Republicans had, they were keen to enable the same behavior we saw under Reagan and saw a path back in for the ones that had been on the outs after multiple monumental fuckups (like Iraq/Afghanistan wars). But even they can only barely stand Turmp and his manbaby tantrums, hence the bitchfight between Turmp and Bolton for instance. Or Turmp and McCain. Or Turmp and the Bush family (which is 100% as rotten as Turmp is).
 
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Viper1j

Diamond Member
Jul 31, 2018
4,454
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Wait, did you become a Turmp humper? Also, do you not know actual factual information about what happened back then? Can you dispute anything I posted?

Also, wait, are you seriously arguing that America suddenly had these problems the day Turmp took office and never before? Because that's some Turmp level idiocy.

Its not like this info is hidden on conspiracy websites. Its literally in the Wiki entry and can be found on a variety of legit sources if that's not good enough for you.

But hey, thanks for perfectly proving my point. And because of your attitude and actions, its happened all over again. I know you were old enough to know better back then. So what's your excuse now? Dementia?

Seriously, did you actually read my post or just see Deep State, suffer a stroke, and then wake up as Lou Dobbs?

Uh huh... :rolleyes:

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Mar 11, 2004
23,444
5,852
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There was a decent You're Wrong About podcast episode on Iran and Contra scandals, but it was early enough (2 years ago) that I think it predated much of what happened with the Turmp situation. It was pretty interesting how much similar behavior happened, and how many names have shown up again.

This tweet helps highlight that point:
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
26,252
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I was literally born into the Deep State. So Deep, I can't tell you why.

Edit: Could have been a 3rd generation civil servant.
 
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UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
25,624
10,322
136
There was a decent You're Wrong About podcast episode on Iran and Contra scandals, but it was early enough (2 years ago) that I think it predated much of what happened with the Turmp situation. It was pretty interesting how much similar behavior happened, and how many names have shown up again.

This tweet helps highlight that point:

And while we’re on that topic:


The DHS whistle-blower complaint provides even more evidence of how the dept has simply become a cesspool of Trumpism. There's one set of details concerning Central America that seems worth calling attention to, since it may get overshadowed by all the other scandalous stuff.

In Dec 2019, Murphy attended a meeting w Cuccinelli & Glawe to discuss intelligence reports regarding conditions in Guatemala, Honduras, & El Salvador. The intelligence reports were designed to help asylum officers render better determinations regarding their legal standards.

Murphy presented the reports to Cuccinelli in the meeting. "Murphy defended the work in the reports, but Cuccinelli stated he wanted changes to the information outlining high levels of corruption, violence, & poor economic conditions in the three respective countries.

Cuccinelli expressed frustration with the intelligence reports, and he accused unknown 'deep state intelligence analysts' of compiling the intelligence information to undermine President Donald J. Trump's policy objectives with respect to asylum.

After Murphy defended the reports & pointed out that they "were consistent with past assessments made for several years," Cuccinelli ordered him to "identify the names of the 'deep state' individuals who compiled the intelligence reports & to either fire or reassign them
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,685
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And while we’re on that topic:


The DHS whistle-blower complaint provides even more evidence of how the dept has simply become a cesspool of Trumpism. There's one set of details concerning Central America that seems worth calling attention to, since it may get overshadowed by all the other scandalous stuff.

In Dec 2019, Murphy attended a meeting w Cuccinelli & Glawe to discuss intelligence reports regarding conditions in Guatemala, Honduras, & El Salvador. The intelligence reports were designed to help asylum officers render better determinations regarding their legal standards.

Murphy presented the reports to Cuccinelli in the meeting. "Murphy defended the work in the reports, but Cuccinelli stated he wanted changes to the information outlining high levels of corruption, violence, & poor economic conditions in the three respective countries.

Cuccinelli expressed frustration with the intelligence reports, and he accused unknown 'deep state intelligence analysts' of compiling the intelligence information to undermine President Donald J. Trump's policy objectives with respect to asylum.

After Murphy defended the reports & pointed out that they "were consistent with past assessments made for several years," Cuccinelli ordered him to "identify the names of the 'deep state' individuals who compiled the intelligence reports & to either fire or reassign them

Directives from the Supreme Leader are to be upheld even if you have to lie to do it. Cult of personality 101.
 

pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
9,510
5,734
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There was a decent You're Wrong About podcast episode on Iran and Contra scandals, but it was early enough (2 years ago) that I think it predated much of what happened with the Turmp situation. It was pretty interesting how much similar behavior happened, and how many names have shown up again.

This tweet helps highlight that point:


WTF
Seriously people. Take an hour or 2 to check out Elliot Abrams history.
This guy's influence has contributed to millions of deaths around the world.