The birthers are at it again

[fskimospy]

My favorite is when they say being black gave him an unfair advantage.

Wait, did people really say that? If so, that is so amazingly awesome.

 

[Zebo]

I heard it be said here. Something along the lines white guilt forced many ppl to vote for obama.

 

[fskimospy]

I heard it be said here. Something along the lines white guilt forced many ppl to vote for obama.

Hmm, I will have to conduct a search then. That's hilarious.

 

[Zebo]

Hmm, I will have to conduct a search then. That's hilarious.

Heard IRL a lot too by my republican friends. They have to be getting it from somewhere search national figures like Limbaugh or Fox. I don't listen to radio or TV so can't help with where it started.

 

[nonlnear]

Heard IRL a lot too by my republican friends. They have to be getting it from somewhere search national figures like Limbaugh or Fox. I don't listen to radio or TV so can't help with where it started.

Is the claim that there is some sort of reverse Bradley effect going on? That would sound about right, as the existence of the Bradley effect is itself a dubious claim. Why not parody one cracked theory when coming up with another one?

It's funny to think that there are so many people who can't imagine that a large number of people looked at the camapigns run by Obama and McCain and decided that Obama was the more compelling choice. I wasn't thrilled with either one and there are a lot of points that I prefered McCain on (not that I was ever a McCain fan) but McCain ran a terrible campaign and deserved to lose. Many of the best pieces of his platform he completely failed to communicate, and then there's the whole Palin thing. I mean come on!

 

[HomerJS]

I heard it be said here. Something along the lines white guilt forced many ppl to vote for obama.

Would it have anything to do with Republicans fucking up the country for the past 8 years? Here's a story I remember cause I live in PA...

So a canvasser goes to a woman's door in Washington, Pennsylvania. Knocks. Woman answers. Knocker asks who she's planning to vote for. She isn't sure, has to ask her husband who she's voting for. Husband is off in another room watching some game. Canvasser hears him yell back, "We're votin' for the n***er!"

Woman turns back to canvasser, and says brightly and matter of factly: "We're voting for the n***er."

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/10/on-road-western-pennsylvania.html

That white guilt stuff is just Fox News / Limbaugh bullshit. Things had gotten so bad under the GOP even racists were willing to give the "ni**er" a try.

 

[woolfe9999]

Hmm, I will have to conduct a search then. That's hilarious.

I'm 100% positive that people have said that very thing right here on ATP&N, more than once. I can't be bothered to run a search particularly as the necessary search terms aren't all that clear, but I know it's been said right here. Stands to reason it's being said elsewhere as well.

 

[Ninjahedge]

NL - I preferred McCain when he still had a spine (before it was ripped out for Bush Jr in 2000).

Just look at some of the interviews he had with John Stewart back then. Great stuff with a guy that would voice his thoughts on a bunch of things that were not lock-step Republican.

 

[yllus]

It would have been utterly impossible for him to get passing grades at Harvard Law with the IQ range you suggest. 130-140 is probably an average Harvard law mind. The LSAT is heavily g-loaded and is used as an alternative for Mensa qualification. Your assessment of his intelligence is, needless to say, not terribly objective.

I'd think he's 140+ based on his rather stunning accomplishments. Magna cum laude, president of the Harvard Law Review, but most of all, his engineering the rise from a state senator to the President of the United States within an astonishingly short time period. Luck is always involved in these things, but nobody is that lucky.

This is meant for the guy your are quoting and not you.

Also well documented that Bush was an excellent debater when he was younger, and suspected that his gaffs, etc, where due to age related brain functioning problems. Obama is young, and if you compare Bush's debate performance around the same age as Obama, Bush would stomp him.

Not saying I agree with either on policies, but you are taking an old man's mind feeling the affects of age, and comparing it to a younger mind. Not a good comparison.

Could I see this documentation proving that Bush was an excellent debater? I imagine that as a jet fighter pilot and Harvard graduate he's no idiot, but an excellent debater? I'd like to see it.

I really don't understand this constant obsession with somehow proving that Obama isn't as smart as everyone thinks he is. The idea that you're going to conjure up a Bush from 20 years ago and that he would somehow 'stomp' present day Obama in a debate is a ridiculous fantasy.

1.) The exercise is absurd on its face.
2.) Obama proved to be an excellent debater in the election.
3.) Presidential debates have little to do with actual debating ability.
4.) Frequently, those who were supposed to 'stomp' someone in a debate did nothing of the sort.

Obama is by all available measures an extremely intelligent individual with enormous gifts for speaking and debating. You don't have to like him or his policies, but this continuing effort to show that he's somehow not so smart is a waste of your time.

In the debate we did see, I thought John McCain was pretty soundly trounced by Obama in their two debates. That's a multiple term senator who by all accounts knows his foreign policy up and down being beaten by a one-term senator - who looked perfectly at ease in doing it. The guy is good.

 

[SilthDraeth]

I really don't understand this constant obsession with somehow proving that Obama isn't as smart as everyone thinks he is. The idea that you're going to conjure up a Bush from 20 years ago and that he would somehow 'stomp' present day Obama in a debate is a ridiculous fantasy.

1.) The exercise is absurd on its face.
2.) Obama proved to be an excellent debater in the election.
3.) Presidential debates have little to do with actual debating ability.
4.) Frequently, those who were supposed to 'stomp' someone in a debate did nothing of the sort.

Obama is by all available measures an extremely intelligent individual with enormous gifts for speaking and debating. You don't have to like him or his policies, but this continuing effort to show that he's somehow not so smart is a waste of your time.

Fine. Maybe Bush wouldn't have stomped Obama. I don't care. I never said Obama isn't smart. I just said, you can't just go out and say that Obama is way smarter than Bush, and base that on old man Bush vs young man Obama.

 

[SilthDraeth]

Could I see this documentation proving that Bush was an excellent debater? I imagine that as a jet fighter pilot and Harvard graduate he's no idiot, but an excellent debater? I'd like to see it.

1994 Governor Debate

Seems well poised, and speaking fluently and eloquently without making gaffes. Whether or not he would, at his prime, held up to Obama of today is arguable, though, not provable, or winnable. So I retract my statement that I think he would trounce Obama.

 

[Siddhartha]

"Ultimately, I'm confident that the Supreme Court will not take what would be an unprecedented, extraordinary step of overturning a law that was passed by a strong majority of a democratically elected Congress"

I [more than ever] want to see his college transcripts; I guess that makes me a 'transcripter' and he an obfuscating bullshitter.

I want to see his high school driver education class scores and more importantly his DMV driving test scores too. I know that this is not important and actually a stupid demand but it in my mind allows me to question the legitimacy of his presidency and to call him names.

 

[cybrsage]

That white guilt stuff is just Fox News / Limbaugh bullshit. Things had gotten so bad under the GOP even racists were willing to give the "ni**er" a try.

Completely untrue:

A report in the Washington Post from 1978 describes the exploitation of white guilt by con artists:[5]

5 ^ Lou Cannon. Phony Ad Salesmen Prey on "White Guilt". The Washington Post. January 16, 1978. Accessed September 30, 2007.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_guilt

Fox News Channel (FNC), often referred to as Fox News, is a cable and satellite television news channel owned by the Fox Entertainment Group, a subsidiary of News Corporation.

The channel was launched on October 7, 1996[2] to 17 million cable subscribers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxnews


FoxNews does not own a WABAC Machine.

 

[cybrsage]

I'd think he's 140+ based on his rather stunning accomplishments. Magna cum laude, president of the Harvard Law Review, but most of all, his engineering the rise from a state senator to the President of the United States within an astonishingly short time period. Luck is always involved in these things, but nobody is that lucky.

He did not engineer his own rise...he was simply along for the ride. The DNC did that and told him to just hang on.

I stand by my view his intelligence is no where near genius.

 

[cybrsage]

I never gave any estimate with certainty. I responded to a post in which you had estimated his IQ in the 100-110 range by giving a counter-estimate based on his achievements, and now you respond to me with the "we can't know his IQ" argument? Let me get this straight. You can estimate his IQ but when I do it it's time to trot this out? Wow, the hypocrisy is astounding.

I know that learning new info and changing your view based on new info learned is a strange concept to you, but others actually do it.

 

[cybrsage]

Unpossible. I was informed earlier in the thread by cybrsage that I was the only one that thought that was the outcome when he met with the GOP congress-persons.

Liar, quote me saying that. Take your time, and please never post again until you do.

And no, quoting YOU saying that is NOT the same as quoting ME saying that. Figured I would stop you from pretending they are the same.

 

[HomerJS]

Completely untrue:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_guilt


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxnews


FoxNews does not own a WABAC Machine.

I'm more inclined to believe an honest racist voter then a closeted racist talk show host.

 

[cybrsage]

Is this your way of saying "I was wrong for saying something so easily shown to not be true"?

 

[HomerJS]

Is this your way of saying "I was wrong for saying something so easily shown to not be true"?

I'm not saying there wasn't someone out there who decided to make up a phrase called white guilt. What I'm saying it is a bullshit explination as to why white people voted for Obama. If a racist can vote for Obama that negates the "white guilt" explination.

In that way Fox and Limbaugh can avoid admitting the GOP fucked up for 8 years.

 

[cybrsage]

Ah, so you agree white guilt has been called that prior to FoxNews even existing, so using this already known phenomenon to explain why so many whites refused to attack any of Obama's positions but instead "got a tingle up the leg" when he spoke is to be expected?

What point were you trying to make when you said it is just FoxNews and Limbaugh bullshit?

 

[yllus]

He did not engineer his own rise...he was simply along for the ride. The DNC did that and told him to just hang on.

I stand by my view his intelligence is no where near genius.

The DNC had all but appointed Hillary Clinton the president-in-waiting before Obama's DNC keynote speech in 2004. Even in 2007 he wasn't raising more money than she was. It was an amazing come from nowhere win - a claim that the DNC had this as a plan is ridiculous beyond belief.

 

[cybrsage]

They only felt like that about Hillary because they were afraid of her. A legitimate fear, too.

Personally, I liked Hillary more than Obama. While I disliked a lot of her views, I felt I knew where she stood on things. I felt she was honest in her public views. Cannot say the same about Obama.

 

[HomerJS]

Ah, so you agree white guilt has been called that prior to FoxNews even existing, so using this already known phenomenon to explain why so many whites refused to attack any of Obama's positions but instead "got a tingle up the leg" when he spoke is to be expected?

What point were you trying to make when you said it is just FoxNews and Limbaugh bullshit?

You are factually incorrect. Even the "tingle up the leg" guy criticizes him.

I'm talking about its use in this case, not its inception.

Yes you win on the "somebody created that phrase"

 

[Pens1566]

Liar, quote me saying that. Take your time, and please never post again until you do.

And no, quoting YOU saying that is NOT the same as quoting ME saying that. Figured I would stop you from pretending they are the same.

You didn't disagree with me, and you certainly didn't question the original point that he in fact did make them look foolish. The "only" bit is mocking your complete unwillingness to recognize that fact. Anyone with any kind of objective view on that event would agree. You also failed to answer another poster as to why the GOP declined a follow up invite if it was not the case that they were made to look foolish. I see you do share a similarity with them in that regard.