The best low-power SFF lineup you've never heard of: Intel's Z3735F Atom system

[Kaido]

I have had been thinking about the Pico for a while for my bedroom TV. lol one day.

I'm testing it today to see how the heat is; one reviewer said it gets pretty toasty, so the MINIX may have it beat for low temps. I also have a VOYO Mini PC coming in for a different project, so I'll be able to get my hands on both the iWork & the VOYO to see how they fare for stuff like HTPC & basic emulator gaming. The Pico is great (very tiny), but if the VOYO runs cooler, I think that's going to be the ticket if you don't need built-in Ethernet because it's $50 cheaper & has a built-in UPS, which essentially gives you battery backup.

 

[Kaido]

Some notes on the Pico:

1. The mounting bracket is VESA 75 & 100-compliant (has 2 screws to mount to half the mounting holes, horizontally or vertically).

2. It comes with a recovery DVD disc. That's nice. Although it's weird that they give you a CD when there's no CD drive with the computer The higher-end quad-core (desktop CPU) Gigabyte BRIX include a tiny USB stick with all of the drivers on it; would have been nice to have a USB installer instead, but given the margins, whatever. The recovery process is like this:

1) Boot from the recover DVD (requires a USB DVD reader)
2) Press "1" to start recovery (at the DOS box)
3) Press "Y" to continue past the warning
4) Press "R" to reboot Windows (then just follow the on-screen instructions to complete Windows setup)

3. The recovery DVD converts to a 4.08gb ISO using ImgBurn. I used the Windows 7 USB/DVD Download Tool to restore it to an 8-gig USB stick, but it failed neared the end. Still tinkering with USB installer options. FWIW, the system reset in Windows worked fine (took maybe 45 minutes to reset back to factory). Setup is very nice, super easy on the Zotac - just a few settings & you're the desktop, nice & quick. Also did a Macrium clone for safe-keeping, here's a screenshot of the partitions:

http://i.imgur.com/v5hzepi.jpg

4. The license keys for the MINIX & Zotac are different (I used Belarc Advisor to snag the licensing details). I have some more MINIX boxes coming in today; I assume that the license keys for MINIX box #1 & MINIX box #2 are the same (same models), which would mean that they're using a bulk key licensed off the hardware (I'm assuming BIOS). I did try to uninstall the key (slmgr /upk /cpky /rearm), but it reactivates upon reboot unless you skip the /rearm switch (and the stock key from the device will reactivate it). The MINIX key won't work on the Zotac. So it's vendor-specific. Update: (1) it requires online (or phone) activation, even though the key is pre-installed, and (2) each key is different, I just checked 3 different MINIX boxes & they all have different keys. For fun, I tried activating one MINIX key on another box, but it wouldn't take it; my guess is that there's a vendor-specific OEM version installed, which then activates online & generates a code based on hardware UUID's. When I ran the Belarc key scan on an unconnected, not-yet-activated MINIX, it said "Key: None activated", and each of them had a different string of numbers before the AAOEM pre-activation or whatever key listed in Belarc Advisor. I'll have to try a Macrium restore to a different model next to see if it key-activates off the hardware UUID; this may or may not make mass rollout more difficult for sites that don't use a KMS type of system for activating Windows 8.1 Pro (for the models that get the upgraded OS for business usage on a domain).

I was kind of hoping it was a generic key, which would make installation easier. Next is to test the reinstallation media on the MINIX; perhaps the English restore disc is generic & simply activates off the BIOS. Not sure yet. I'm trying to make a deployment plan based off an ISO rather than a customized Macrium image since I haven't come across a legitimate Microsoft reinstaller. I'm also throwing 8.1 Pro (via the Pro Pack) on some of them, so maybe I can figure out some sort of clean install method.

5. It does get borderline hot, as in "extremely warm". Not actually hot where you'd take your hand off, but the MINIX definitely has it beat for cool temps. In the disassembly video, the MINIX had a large metal passive heatsink, so if you're going to run these all day long, I'd probably opt for the MINIX over the Zotac.

 

[Kaido]

Got a virus hit (trojan) off the Zotac reinstall CD :

http://i.imgur.com/mICH8F9.jpg

Although it didn't get any other hits other than Avast when I uploaded the file to Virus Total. Hmm.

 

[Kaido]

As it turns out, Zotac has a WinUSB Maker:

http://www.zotac.com/uk/z-zone/zotac-winusb-maker.html

Having trouble getting it to see it in BIOS. I did a DVD reinstall using the factory disc & then tried Windows 7 for fun, but it won't even see it. There's a shell you can get into, but I'm not familiar enough with the commands to mess with it more today.

 

[Kaido]

I'm still pondering the price difference between the Baytrail-T series of laptops & tablets vs. the desktop units. With a laptop or tablet, you get the added benefit of a screen & battery for the same price. The Zotac ZBOX Pico is $199, as is the Asus X205TA laptop (same guts) & the tablets are even cheaper. The benefit is that you can easily mount the desktop units as "fixtures" with a monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers, and I'd imagine the lower volume of the desktop units is why they're priced higher. But given the added price, I'd really like to see the minimum specs bumped up. This would be a winner for $199:

1. HDMI + VGA built-in, plus an HDMI to DVI adapter plug in the box. That way you're covered no matter what monitor or TV you want to use.

2. DVD drive: doesn't need to be Bluray, but a lot of people still have & use discs. People initially get really excited about buying these little computers for home use, but then I show them the $30 USB DVD drive, which is twice as big as the whole computer, and it kind of goes downhill from there. So even though it's a legacy item, it'd still work well for selling it to your average consumer.

I typically try to get people to buy a cheap laptop instead of a desktop, then use it with the lid shut as a desktop, since then it's smaller & has a built-in UPS battery of sorts, but most people can't really fathom that concept. Having an off-the-shelf box with a DVD drive built in (slimline slotload, ideally - no tray to break) would be a MAJOR selling point to consumers, especially when combined with the VGA port...that way if you have an old XP box, which a TON of people have, it's a simple drop-in replacement.

3. 4 to 6 USB ports. Minimum of 4 (one on the front to plug in a USB stick or phone to charge), but ideally 6...2 on the front, 4 on the back. Even though stuff like printers are wireless now, most people still just hook up a USB cord. That goes back to showing people the USB DVD drive, it's a turn-off when you're like well, you'd need a small USB hub to add more stuff & yada yada yada, because then you just have a wiring mess with cable adapters, USB hubs, USB disc drive, and so on.

4. More storage. 64gb should be the absolute MINIMUM. I would say a 128gb eMMC should be offered as a bump-up package for $249. It would be cool to have a hot-swap 2.5" so that people could throw in a terabyte for photos or whatnot, but that's kind of pushing the design a bit too much.

I mean, this kind of points towards stuff like the HP Stream Mini, but even that doesn't have a DVD drive built-in, and afaik nobody has a nice little $200 box that has VGA, HDMI, 4 or 6 USB ports, a DVD drive, a built-in SSD, etc. That would make a KILLER replacement box for a lot of people - parents, grandparents, and so on. I could see a few price-points, too - a $199 64gb model, a $249 128gb model, and a $299 Bluray model. I'd definitely pay $300 for an AIO Bluray model that I could stick next to my TV & dump my dedicated Bluray player, plus be able to surf the net & play basic games.

 

[Face2Face]

I'm testing it today to see how the heat is; one reviewer said it gets pretty toasty, so the MINIX may have it beat for low temps. I also have a VOYO Mini PC coming in for a different project, so I'll be able to get my hands on both the iWork & the VOYO to see how they fare for stuff like HTPC & basic emulator gaming. The Pico is great (very tiny), but if the VOYO runs cooler, I think that's going to be the ticket if you don't need built-in Ethernet because it's $50 cheaper & has a built-in UPS, which essentially gives you battery backup.

Mine gets toasty when playing games on it. It does surprisingly well playing games like Castle crashers, Limbo, and some other Indie games @ 1080p with low settings. I Velcro it to the back of my 65" TV and use it to play a couple indie games and then use it for Steam's In-home streaming.

I also have an Onda V975W Tablet. The Z3735D SOC does a reasonable job for general use, but I feel the 2048 x 1536 resolution might be a bit too much for the SOC (maintain 60Hz for general use)

I'm thinking about replacing the Zotac Pico with an Intel NUC or Gigabyte BRIX Broadwell i3 model, just so I can play some more demanding games - Goat simulator, Dust,and etc..., but nothing AAA.

 

[Kaido]

Mine gets toasty when playing games on it. It does surprisingly well playing games like Castle crashers, Limbo, and some other Indie games @ 1080p with low settings. I Velcro it to the back of my 65" TV and use it to play a couple indie games and then use it for Steam's In-home streaming.

I also have an Onda V975W Tablet. The Z3735D SOC does a reasonable job for general use, but I feel the 2048 x 1536 resolution might be a bit too much for the SOC (maintain 60Hz for general use)

I'm thinking about replacing the Zotac Pico with an Intel NUC or Gigabyte BRIX Broadwell i3 model, just so I can play some more demanding games - Goat simulator, Dust,and etc..., but nothing AAA.

Awesome, thanks for the RL experience! Which gets toasty, the VOYO?

Note that the NUC's also have integrated graphics...better than the plain Intel HD, but still not super great. I'll be testing some 3D CAD viewers on the newer HD 5500 models, but my hopes aren't high. The GTX760 model is pretty amazing (the green one), but it's stupid expensive & fairly noisy if you're in a quiet room. But with stuff like the new Tegra X1, we're only going to see the graphics performance of these mini computers grow more & more. Being able to play 1080p (on the Baytrail-T models) for so cheap & in such tiny of a package is a huge milestone.

 

[Face2Face]

Awesome, thanks for the RL experience! Which gets toasty, the VOYO?

Note that the NUC's also have integrated graphics...better than the plain Intel HD, but still not super great. I'll be testing some 3D CAD viewers on the newer HD 5500 models, but my hopes aren't high. The GTX760 model is pretty amazing (the green one), but it's stupid expensive & fairly noisy if you're in a quiet room. But with stuff like the new Tegra X1, we're only going to see the graphics performance of these mini computers grow more & more. Being able to play 1080p (on the Baytrail-T models) for so cheap & in such tiny of a package is a huge milestone.

I was referring to the Zotac ZBOX PI320 Pico. It get's pretty warm when gaming on it. I really don't mind, as long as it's not thermal throttling the CPU and GPU too much.

The Intel HD Graphics in the Zbox Pico is based off of Valley View (Ivy Bridge (4000 or Gen 7 series GPU), but it only clocks up to 646Mhz and there are only 4 EUs. So there are many games that simply won't run on it at all.

If I was to upgrade to a Core i3-5010U based BRIX or NUC, then I should be able to play a lot more games. The HD 5500 clocks up to 900MHz and has 24 EU's. Since it's faster clock per clock over the Gen 7 series, it can actually compete and beat the HD 5000 (40 EUs part) and the HD 4400 (20 EUs)

I'm not expecting balls out gaming here, but I would be nice being able to play some higher end Indie games at 1080p. The NUC and BRIX should be small enough for me to attached to my wall mounted TV, so it will be out of sight. I already have a 240 GB SSD to throw in there, I just have to buy the unit and 4GB or 8GB of ram.

I did see the GTX 760 BRIX models, but like you said; too expensive. I also don't want the noise either. The Zotac E series with the the Core I5 and the Maxwell based GTX 860M looks pretty good, but it would be around $550 with 8GB of memory, and I'm not wanting to spend that much.

It's nice to see the Tegra X1 and the GPU performance it can provide, but without supporting my current STEAM library (X86)... well, it just doesn't seem that enticing.

 

[Kaido]

I was referring to the Zotac ZBOX PI320 Pico. It get's pretty warm when gaming on it. I really don't mind, as long as it's not thermal throttling the CPU and GPU too much.

The Intel HD Graphics in the Zbox Pico is based off of Valley View (Ivy Bridge (4000 or Gen 7 series GPU), but it only clocks up to 646Mhz and there are only 4 EUs. So there are many games that simply won't run on it at all.

If I was to upgrade to a Core i3-5010U based BRIX or NUC, then I should be able to play a lot more games. The HD 5500 clocks up to 900MHz and has 24 EU's. Since it's faster clock per clock over the Gen 7 series, it can actually compete and beat the HD 5000 (40 EUs part) and the HD 4400 (20 EUs)

I'm not expecting balls out gaming here, but I would be nice being able to play some higher end Indie games at 1080p. The NUC and BRIX should be small enough for me to attached to my wall mounted TV, so it will be out of sight. I already have a 240 GB SSD to throw in there, I just have to buy the unit and 4GB or 8GB of ram.

I did see the GTX 760 BRIX models, but like you said; too expensive. I also don't want the noise either. The Zotac E series with the the Core I5 and the Maxwell based GTX 860M looks pretty good, but it would be around $550 with 8GB of memory, and I'm not wanting to spend that much.

It's nice to see the Tegra X1 and the GPU performance it can provide, but without supporting my current STEAM library (X86)... well, it just doesn't seem that enticing.

That's it in a nutshell...the margins on the pricing war are slim, and for stuff like the green GTX760 BRIX, I look at the price & say well, for just the price of the barebones unit, I can build an entire desktop gaming computer as an HTPC, which would be quieter, and just skip out on the smaller size & power savings. Even with stuff like the Zotac Pico, which is currently up to $199 ($20 more than when I bought it a few days ago), you suddenly realize you can buy an HP Stream Mini or a 15.6" laptop or even a Baytrail-T 11.6" laptop for the same money. Sub-$150 would be a far more ideal pricepoint for these units; hopefully the price will come down in time.

Yeah, I'm curious about the thermal throttling; I'm curious if there's a performance logger available for seeing the changes over time in regards to heat, CPU load, and on other models, USB power (less wattage available, like on the HDMI sticks versions of the Z3537 SoC's). Because the Zotac does get very warm, I'm going to stick with the MINIX boxes for 24/7 thin clients; just rolled out six and the users LOVE them! $275 with 8.1 Pro - join to domain, add the RDP Modern app to user via Assigned Access, voila - super fast RDP.

I have a side project using RemoteFX with an NVIDIA GRID coming up this summer, so I'm super curious to see how it fares for doing some lightweight 3D stuff. I'm especially curious about the models with both VGA & HDMI for dual-monitor support; in Windows 7, you had to use Ultimate or Enterprise on both the RDP & target machine in order to do dual-monitor RDP, so it would be super cool if they had a dual-HDMI version of these come out, upgrade it to 8.1 Pro, and then use it as a full-fledged workstation using dual screens & a RemoteFX 3D-enable RDP session on a 2008 or 2012 Terminal Server (Citrix & VMware being another story, hah). I detest Wyse thin clients; these make such a nice alternative, and have a far more standard setup than using an Android set-top box or AIO (like the Slate 21) with SureLock & the MS RDP app, not to mention better performance & future usability & upgradability. Very curious to see if Microsoft is going to offer a free upgrade to Windows 10 for 8.1 with Bing too.

I'm hoping NVIDIA will make a platform similar to the X1 available for Windows, would be great to have a killer GPU in a small footprint!

 

[Kaido]

Long story short, Geek Buying finally got around to processing my email & refund, ended up swapping out the iWork7 for an Egreat i6: ($139 shipped)

http://chinagadgetsreviews.blogspot.com/2015/02/egreat-i6-wintel-mini-pc.html

* Nice-looking mini computer
* Official Win8 license (not sure if it ships with Chinese default or not tho)
* Includes Vidon XBMC ("specially optimized app with full specification blu-ray menu, full format video hardware decoding, the vast amount of add-ons, and more valuable features")
* Side: 3x USB 2.0 ports
* Rear:

1. Power
2. VGA
3. HDMI
4. Ethernet
5. Mic input
6. Speaker output
7. MicroSD reader (max 128gb)

Decided to pay the extra ten bucks to get the onboard Ethernet port. And for some reason, the battery in the VOYO Mini PC scares me a little Not sure if they're using a tablet battery or what, or how the computer sees it. I'll probably get my hands on the various other Chinese models over time for side projects though, so we'll see! I did pick up a speedy 32-gig Class 10 MicroSD card for $15:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CES44EO/

The plan for the USB ports is:

1. Logitech K400 (wireless keyboard with touchpad, great for HTPC & on sale for $25)
2. X-arcade Tankstick (I have the non-rollerball version; wish it was wireless!)
3. Microsoft wireless USB adapter for Windows (with a pair of Xbox 360 controllers, which emulate the most controller layouts the best - NES, SNES, etc.)

I'm hoping to have it boot into PLEX, then be able to launch Hyperspin from there, and never see the desktop, i.e. set it up in fullscreen mode automatically. We'll see how that goes...I want to make it as appliance-like as possible to sit next to my Roku.

 

[you2]

Any of thse have linux ? Still thinking I shoudl wit till next generation when 4GB+ is supported.

 

[Capt Caveman]

I was referring to the Zotac ZBOX PI320 Pico. It get's pretty warm when gaming on it. I really don't mind, as long as it's not thermal throttling the CPU and GPU too much.

The Intel HD Graphics in the Zbox Pico is based off of Valley View (Ivy Bridge (4000 or Gen 7 series GPU), but it only clocks up to 646Mhz and there are only 4 EUs. So there are many games that simply won't run on it at all.

If I was to upgrade to a Core i3-5010U based BRIX or NUC, then I should be able to play a lot more games. The HD 5500 clocks up to 900MHz and has 24 EU's. Since it's faster clock per clock over the Gen 7 series, it can actually compete and beat the HD 5000 (40 EUs part) and the HD 4400 (20 EUs)

I'm not expecting balls out gaming here, but I would be nice being able to play some higher end Indie games at 1080p. The NUC and BRIX should be small enough for me to attached to my wall mounted TV, so it will be out of sight. I already have a 240 GB SSD to throw in there, I just have to buy the unit and 4GB or 8GB of ram.

I did see the GTX 760 BRIX models, but like you said; too expensive. I also don't want the noise either. The Zotac E series with the the Core I5 and the Maxwell based GTX 860M looks pretty good, but it would be around $550 with 8GB of memory, and I'm not wanting to spend that much.

It's nice to see the Tegra X1 and the GPU performance it can provide, but without supporting my current STEAM library (X86)... well, it just doesn't seem that enticing.

What do you think about a Zotac ZBOX-CI320NANO running a Celeron N2930? Add a Crucial Ballistix 8gb DDR3 1600 CL9(10% coupon available at Newegg) of ram for a total under $300.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883218044

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148734

 

[VirtualLarry]

What do you think about a Zotac ZBOX-CI320NANO running a Celeron N2930? Add a Crucial Ballistix 8gb DDR3 1600 CL9(10% coupon available at Newegg) of ram for a total under $300.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883218044

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148734

Don't forget the Brix i3 Haswell U CPU projector unit now on sale at Newegg for $290, with FREE 64GB mSATA SSD and 4GB DDR3L-1600 RAM stick.

 

[Kaido]

Any of thse have linux ? Still thinking I shoudl wit till next generation when 4GB+ is supported.

From the factory, not that I can see - but it doesn't seem too hard to install it aftermarket.

 

[Face2Face]

What do you think about a Zotac ZBOX-CI320NANO running a Celeron N2930? Add a Crucial Ballistix 8gb DDR3 1600 CL9(10% coupon available at Newegg) of ram for a total under $300.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883218044

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148734

It's not a terrible deal, but you're essentially buying a higher-end Baytrail CPU. The main difference is in it's memory support (8GB), higher CPU clock speeds, Quick Sync, and a higher clocked GPU. The GPU is still the same Ivy bridge based 4 EU part used in the Z3735 SOCs.

I do like Virtual Larry's recommendation, as it's a killer deal for the price.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856164010

The Haswell based i3 is much faster than the Baytrail based SOCs and it comes with The Intel HD 4400 GPU, which is many times faster vs. the Baytrail GPU.

 

[Kaido]

Stateside, I think the most versatile non-dual-boot device (just Windows) is the $119 Microcenter 8" WinBook TW802:

http://www.microcenter.com/product/440932/TW802_Tablet_-_Black

It has the better 2GB SoC with 32gb eMMC (instead of the cheaper 1gb/16gb on some tablets), plus comes with a single full-sized USB port (no OTG adapter required) in addition to the Micro-USB charging port (note: reviewers say the MicroUSB port has a pretty sensitive connector - weak solder points or something - so use the jack with care). If I ever get my hands on one, I'll have to see if the Unity receiver & MS 360 USB adapter will work off a 3-way unpowered USB hub.

 

[Kaido]

What do you think about a Zotac ZBOX-CI320NANO running a Celeron N2930? Add a Crucial Ballistix 8gb DDR3 1600 CL9(10% coupon available at Newegg) of ram for a total under $300.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883218044

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148734

The RAM is a really big deal - read Gizmodo's review of the HP Stream Mini: (they upgraded theirs with BIG benefits)

http://gizmodo.com/hp-stream-mini-review-a-deceptively-capable-tiny-deskt-1692158242

 

[Face2Face]

That's it in a nutshell...the margins on the pricing war are slim, and for stuff like the green GTX760 BRIX, I look at the price & say well, for just the price of the barebones unit, I can build an entire desktop gaming computer as an HTPC, which would be quieter, and just skip out on the smaller size & power savings. Even with stuff like the Zotac Pico, which is currently up to $199 ($20 more than when I bought it a few days ago), you suddenly realize you can buy an HP Stream Mini or a 15.6" laptop or even a Baytrail-T 11.6" laptop for the same money. Sub-$150 would be a far more ideal pricepoint for these units; hopefully the price will come down in time.

Yeah, I'm curious about the thermal throttling; I'm curious if there's a performance logger available for seeing the changes over time in regards to heat, CPU load, and on other models, USB power (less wattage available, like on the HDMI sticks versions of the Z3537 SoC's). Because the Zotac does get very warm, I'm going to stick with the MINIX boxes for 24/7 thin clients; just rolled out six and the users LOVE them! $275 with 8.1 Pro - join to domain, add the RDP Modern app to user via Assigned Access, voila - super fast RDP.

I have a side project using RemoteFX with an NVIDIA GRID coming up this summer, so I'm super curious to see how it fares for doing some lightweight 3D stuff. I'm especially curious about the models with both VGA & HDMI for dual-monitor support; in Windows 7, you had to use Ultimate or Enterprise on both the RDP & target machine in order to do dual-monitor RDP, so it would be super cool if they had a dual-HDMI version of these come out, upgrade it to 8.1 Pro, and then use it as a full-fledged workstation using dual screens & a RemoteFX 3D-enable RDP session on a 2008 or 2012 Terminal Server (Citrix & VMware being another story, hah). I detest Wyse thin clients; these make such a nice alternative, and have a far more standard setup than using an Android set-top box or AIO (like the Slate 21) with SureLock & the MS RDP app, not to mention better performance & future usability & upgradability. Very curious to see if Microsoft is going to offer a free upgrade to Windows 10 for 8.1 with Bing too.

I'm hoping NVIDIA will make a platform similar to the X1 available for Windows, would be great to have a killer GPU in a small footprint!

Agreed, the Zotac Pico is a bit overpriced when you compare to some of the laptops that use the same SOC, even at $179. I bought mine for that price as well.

I'm trying to figure out a way to monitor GPU and CPU temps while in game, to see if there really is throttling occurring. I have a feeling there is, because games tend to get a little slower when playing for a little bit (Kid tested) I'm using Fraps to monitor frame rate.

Send me a link to th MINIX boxes, as I haven't seen them. Additionally, I hope Microsoft does upgrade Windows 8.1 with bing, it should help these little Z3735 machines out quite a bit, as it appears to be a less resource heavy OS. Also, your side project also sounds pretty cool, let us know how it works out.

 

[Kaido]

Don't forget the Brix i3 Haswell U CPU projector unit now on sale at Newegg for $290, with FREE 64GB mSATA SSD and 4GB DDR3L-1600 RAM stick.

TBH I'm having a really hard time not buying one, that would make a perfect streamer/emulator station along with a portable video screen built-in for my BIL's kids. i3 for a $90 premium over the $199 Baytrail-T desktops is not bad at all...

 

[Face2Face]

Stateside, I think the most versatile non-dual-boot device (just Windows) is the $119 Microcenter 8" WinBook TW802:

http://www.microcenter.com/product/440932/TW802_Tablet_-_Black

It has the better 2GB SoC with 32gb eMMC (instead of the cheaper 1gb/16gb on some tablets), plus comes with a single full-sized USB port (no OTG adapter required) in addition to the Micro-USB charging port (note: reviewers say the MicroUSB port has a pretty sensitive connector - weak solder points or something - so use the jack with care). If I ever get my hands on one, I'll have to see if the Unity receiver & MS 360 USB adapter will work off a 3-way unpowered USB hub.

That is a sweet deal. I'd grab one for my daughter, but shes wrapped up in the Android ECO system and the MS store really need a lot more apps... I might have to get one for myself

Also, the MS store has the HP Stream 7 on sale for $79

http://www.microsoftstore.com/store...ntent=5fZCCa7g&WT.source=google&WT.medium=cpc

It's only got 1GB of memory, but it still has a lot of positive feedback.

 

[Kaido]

Agreed, the Zotac Pico is a bit overpriced when you compare to some of the laptops that use the same SOC, even at $179. I bought mine for that price as well.

I'm trying to figure out a way to monitor GPU and CPU temps while in game, to see if there really is throttling occurring. I have a feeling there is, because games tend to get a little slower when playing for a little bit (Kid tested) I'm using Fraps to monitor frame rate.

Send me a link to th MINIX boxes, as I haven't seen them. Additionally, I hope Microsoft does upgrade Windows 8.1 with bing, it should help these little Z3735 machines out quite a bit, as it appears to be a less resource heavy OS. Also, your side project also sounds pretty cool, let us know how it works out.

It's the MINIX NEO Z64 ($175) - the only Windows model they currently have out right now: (the rest are various Android boxes, and in fact, the Windows version has an Android logo embossed into the bottom plastic haha)

http://www.amazon.com/Windows-installed-Quad-Core-Streaming-Player/dp/B00TD8MTFY/

I've got half a dozen setup so far for RDP (either in remote locations for people to bounce back to their desktop, or for hooking up to a TS). As far as temp monitoring, check out Open Hardware Monitor:

http://openhardwaremonitor.org/

If you want live temps in-game, AIDA64 lets you stream them to your mobile device via an app, which is pretty cool: (pay-for software tho)

http://www.aida64.com/news/aida64-v500-released

I'll mess around with the emulator stuff this weekend to see what it can handle. I'm not really into the 3D stuff so much (N64 & whatnot), just the older 2D MAME & console stuff, and maybe some DOSbox for stuff like Commander Keen. It'd just be nice to not have to hook up aging consoles with wired controllers - have everything is a nice, compact little package with savestates & whatnot.

It is a tough price, that $199-ish range, because I see laptops go on sale for that all the time, there are Celeron boxes like the HP Stream Mini available, and so on. I bought the Egreat i6 as a "permanent" set-top box (for going next to my Roku) because I liked the fanless design of the Z3735 SoC. Although it's not as cheap as say the $99 tablets with HDMI output, it's kind of a no-futz system, so for $139 I feel like it was a pretty good bargain.

I would have preferred the MINIX due to the sealed design (no vent ports), but the Egreat adds (1) 3 USB ports total, (2) a VGA port (for connecting to older stuff or doing dual screens), and (3) a copy of the VIDON software, which is basically XBMC with Bluray ISO menu playback support & whatnot. I'm curious to see how it compares to the upcoming AppleTV, which supposedly adds an App Store & Siri, along with a cable TV streaming show competitor coming later this year:

http://www.engadget.com/2015/03/20/new-apple-tv/

 

[Kaido]

That is a sweet deal. I'd grab one for my daughter, but shes wrapped up in the Android ECO system and the MS store really need a lot more apps... I might have to get one for myself

Also, the MS store has the HP Stream 7 on sale for $79

http://www.microsoftstore.com/store...ntent=5fZCCa7g&WT.source=google&WT.medium=cpc

It's only got 1GB of memory, but it still has a lot of positive feedback.

Yeah, the only catch is that there's no HDMI output. The only workaround is to use a USB video card, which has crummy performance & is such an added expense that you might as well get the Microcenter version if you're planning on hooking it up to an external display to use as kind of an HTPC or desktop:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qbLc-8inVk

I would be curious to try emulator games & streaming on the 1GB. And actually, if you don't mind used, you can get a refurb Insignia laptop, which has Mini-HDMI out for $40 today:

http://slickdeals.net/f/7741485-16g...8-1-tablet-pre-owned-39-99-with-free-shipping

 

[Kaido]

One other note on using them for business purposes: still working on getting external stuff to boot properly & whatnot. I'll jump into Macrium this weekend for testing - I'm hoping a custom boot CD will be seen, but since Windows 7 wasn't seen at all (only the Zotac reinstall CD) I don't know. The system seems pretty locked down, and even installing Linux can be quite the involved processed on these things.

The difficult thing for me is deployment. It takes roughly 2 hours to do the initial upgrade & update to 8.1 Pro (key change + Internet connection), which is pretty dang slow in the commercial world. I don't think there's any options for restoring the OS via PXE from an image server like FOG, and booting via USB has proven to be a challenge, so my next hope is the Macrium boot CD + pulling a pre-configured image off a USB drive. I'm about 90% done with testing out the different key configurations, I just need to be able to do some bare restores to confirm that individual keys are tied to hardware UUID's or whatever, and to do a clean install of the Pro Pack to see if it can be done.

I just set one up on a rolling cart: 21" 1080p LCD with HDMI input (speakers built-in), a USB barcode scanner (the auto-scan ones from China are well under $50 on Amazon & work awesome), a MINIX with 8.1 Pro, and a surge protector with some heavy-duty velcro tape for everything. Roll it where you need & zap over to your desktop or a server depending on what you're working on, no worries about being in a dirty shop environment since it's all sealed. VERY nice!

 

[Capt Caveman]

It's not a terrible deal, but you're essentially buying a higher-end Baytrail CPU. The main difference is in it's memory support (8GB), higher CPU clock speeds, Quick Sync, and a higher clocked GPU. The GPU is still the same Ivy bridge based 4 EU part used in the Z3735 SOCs.

I do like Virtual Larry's recommendation, as it's a killer deal for the price.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856164010

The Haswell based i3 is much faster than the Baytrail based SOCs and it comes with The Intel HD 4400 GPU, which is many times faster vs. the Baytrail GPU.

Thanks for the info. That Brix is tempting. The Zbox does use passive cooling which I like as well as an O/S and wifi ac. Would I be able to install Windows 10 Preview on the
BRIX without any issues?

Note, the reason I'm looking at something like this is to run surveillance software that will be connected to a NAS. I like the small form-factor and low-power/low noise as it would be something I could hide easily in the house.

 

[Face2Face]

Thanks for the info. That Brix is tempting. The Zbox does use passive cooling which I like as well as an O/S and wifi ac. Would I be able to install Windows 10 Preview on the
BRIX without any issues?

Note, the reason I'm looking at something like this is to run surveillance software that will be connected to a NAS. I like the small form-factor and low-power/low noise as it would be something I could hide easily in the house.

I honestly I don't know. Also, have you looked at the requirements for the surveillance software?