TF2 and Vista Ultimate - How does it run?

[Haui]

I know that most you you guys have the TF2 beta installed and are playing it, but I am curious to know how it is running on a Vista Ultimate machine.

Tonight I took the plunge and upgraded from XP Pro to Ultimate. I will be purchasing Orange Box tomorrow, but want to know how the TF2 beta will run on the following config:

Dell E521
EVGA 7600GT 256MB PCI-E
2GB DDR2-800 Kingston
AMD X2 5600+
250GB SATA 7200RPM HD
Windows Vista Ultimate 32BIT
Dell E205WFP 20" Widescreen

How will it run? Should I upgrade to 4GB ram tomorrow (will this even help?)?

Any input will be greatly appreciated!

 

[Sniper82]

As long as the system handles HL2,CS:S,ect fine then it should handle TF2. I don't think 4gb will help much performance wise, video card would be the better upgrade.

 

[Haui]

So going to 4gb wont help?

 

[Miklebud]

It runs greaaaat! Looks great too! It seems to be a little harder on your computer than HL2 and CS:S. At comparable settings (4xAA, 16AF) CS:S and HL2 run great, but those settings in TF2 are pretty taxing. I had to turn it down to 2xAA and 4AF in TF2 to get it to a more playable level. But it is VERY fun! I love it!

EDIT- And now that I notice you've got a 20" monitor, you're probably going to want to think about upgrading your video card.

 

[Haui]

Originally posted by: Miklebud
It runs greaaaat! Looks great too! It seems to be a little harder on your computer than HL2 and CS:S. At comparable settings (4xAA, 16AF) CS:S and HL2 run great, but those settings in TF2 are pretty taxing. I had to turn it down to 2xAA and 4AF in TF2 to get it to a more playable level. But it is VERY fun! I love it!

EDIT- And now that I notice you've got a 20" monitor, you're probably going to want to think about upgrading your video card.

Again, should I upgrade to 4gb ram?

 

[Darkstar757]

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: Miklebud
It runs greaaaat! Looks great too! It seems to be a little harder on your computer than HL2 and CS:S. At comparable settings (4xAA, 16AF) CS:S and HL2 run great, but those settings in TF2 are pretty taxing. I had to turn it down to 2xAA and 4AF in TF2 to get it to a more playable level. But it is VERY fun! I love it!

EDIT- And now that I notice you've got a 20" monitor, you're probably going to want to think about upgrading your video card.

Again, should I upgrade to 4gb ram?

I would. After reading your post I went down to 2gb of ram versus 4gb. I noticed that the level loading time was longer with 2gb versus 4gb. 4gb just seemed to make thinks run more smooth.

 

[Haui]

So it is worth the upgrade then?

 

[mb]

Indecisive much? Upgrading to 4GB won't do ANYTHING noticeable for you if you are still using 32bit Vista. It is a waste of money unless you upgrade to 64bit.

You can use your 32bit key to install 64bit Vista. All you need is the disc. You can get it from MS for $10 http://www.microsoft.com/windo...ta/editions/64bit.mspx


Upgrading your video card will give you more performance than 4GB + 64bit Vista anyway.

 

[Darkstar757]

I would upgrade your video card first! Then the system ram.

 

[Mem]

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: Miklebud
It runs greaaaat! Looks great too! It seems to be a little harder on your computer than HL2 and CS:S. At comparable settings (4xAA, 16AF) CS:S and HL2 run great, but those settings in TF2 are pretty taxing. I had to turn it down to 2xAA and 4AF in TF2 to get it to a more playable level. But it is VERY fun! I love it!

EDIT- And now that I notice you've got a 20" monitor, you're probably going to want to think about upgrading your video card.

Again, should I upgrade to 4gb ram?

Only if you go Vista x64,personally a better video card for now, then when you want to go 4GB,seriously think about upgrading to Vista x64.

 

[Haui]

So what are the advantages of going 64 bit?

 

[Haui]

What card can I upgrade to considering I have a Dell e521 with a 300wt psu?

 

[msi1337]

edited

 

[Mem]

Originally posted by: Haui
So what are the advantages of going 64 bit?

Main advantage is able to use all 4GB of ram or more depending on your hardware etc.....slightly better security then Vista x68,able to run most 32 bit and 64 bit software.

Bad points are no legacy 16 bit software support so can't run any 16 bit software unless you use something like Virtual PC 2007,using 64 bit OS depends on if you can get 64 bit drivers for your hardware and what 32 bit software you'll be using,also need to be using a 64 bit cpu(obvious really).


I can only speak for myself but I have no problems with 32 bit games or 32 bit software so in my case Vista x64 was the right choice,your needs may be different especially if you use any specialized 32 bit software.

 

[Haui]

Originally posted by: Mem

Originally posted by: Haui
So what are the advantages of going 64 bit?

Main advantage is able to use all 4GB of ram or more depending on your hardware etc.....slightly better security then Vista x68,able to run most 32 bit and 64 bit software.

Bad points are no legacy 16 bit software support so can't run any 16 bit software unless you use something like Virtual PC 2007,using 64 bit OS depends on if you can get 64 bit drivers for your hardware and what 32 bit software you'll be using,also need to be using a 64 bit cpu(obvious really).


I can only speak for myself but I have no problems with 32 bit games or 32 bit software so in my case Vista x64 was the right choice,your needs may be different especially if you use any specialized 32 bit software.

Then I see no real reason why I need to upgrade to 64bit. Maybe upgrading to 3gb might help?

 

[Sniper82]

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: Mem

Originally posted by: Haui
So what are the advantages of going 64 bit?

Main advantage is able to use all 4GB of ram or more depending on your hardware etc.....slightly better security then Vista x68,able to run most 32 bit and 64 bit software.

Bad points are no legacy 16 bit software support so can't run any 16 bit software unless you use something like Virtual PC 2007,using 64 bit OS depends on if you can get 64 bit drivers for your hardware and what 32 bit software you'll be using,also need to be using a 64 bit cpu(obvious really).


I can only speak for myself but I have no problems with 32 bit games or 32 bit software so in my case Vista x64 was the right choice,your needs may be different especially if you use any specialized 32 bit software.

Then I see no real reason why I need to upgrade to 64bit. Maybe upgrading to 3gb might help?

Really you might see a slight difference with 3-4gb but I don't think it would be enough to justify the cost(even though memory is cheap right now). If you want more performance putting the money toward a 500watt PSU and upgrading the video card would be the best performance boost. If you don't want to break the bank with a 8800 series a x1950 or similar would be a decent upgrade. Then sell the 7600GT and get around half the costs back(that you have in the X1950).

With already having 2gb memory I don't think adding more memory will just make higher resolutions and max settings just smooth out completely.

 

[msi1337]

edited

 

[mb]

You won't see a difference with the extra RAM in 32bit Vista. The OS will only see about 400-800MB more and that won't help any. You might get HALF a frame-per-second more.

 

[Haui]

Originally posted by: msi1337
you really want to buy more memory don't ya!!

2gb is fine. For $70 you could get 2gb more of SuperTalent DDR2-800, but I doubt you will see a difference.

Also, what Sniper82 said is partially correct. These computers use BTX power supplies and a better power supply would be Linked. Also, you are limited on upgrading the video card because anything bigger than a 7600gt will not fit next to the heatsink..since the processor is in the middle of the motherboard in a BTX design. I think I fit a 7900gs in an E521 once with a molex to 6 pin adapter for video card power..can't promise that though. Definetly none of the higher end video cards will fit in that case.

Also, I don't recommend Vista at all...to anyone. I regard it as one of the worst OS's ever since Windows ME.
Beside a slightly increased proficiency in memory usage it is embarrasingly slow and cumbersome. XP pro sp2 is the way to go for this Dell E521 computer. Its not a gaming system, its a Dell dude

Dude, I have built machines for years. The only difference in this and your so called "gaming machine" is the fact that you can OC. I play HL2, DOD Source, BF2 all at the highest settings and get GREAT game play. People are so ignorant. You do know Dell produces great machines. They are upgradeable too.

You mom is a gaming machine....

Also, Vista is a GREAT OS.......no reason for you to bash it. Sure, like any OS, it has it's SMALL problems in the beginning, but they will get worked out. How dare you compare it to Windows ME.

 

[mb]

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: msi1337
you really want to buy more memory don't ya!!

2gb is fine. For $70 you could get 2gb more of SuperTalent DDR2-800, but I doubt you will see a difference.

Also, what Sniper82 said is partially correct. These computers use BTX power supplies and a better power supply would be Linked. Also, you are limited on upgrading the video card because anything bigger than a 7600gt will not fit next to the heatsink..since the processor is in the middle of the motherboard in a BTX design. I think I fit a 7900gs in an E521 once with a molex to 6 pin adapter for video card power..can't promise that though. Definetly none of the higher end video cards will fit in that case.

Also, I don't recommend Vista at all...to anyone. I regard it as one of the worst OS's ever since Windows ME.
Beside a slightly increased proficiency in memory usage it is embarrasingly slow and cumbersome. XP pro sp2 is the way to go for this Dell E521 computer. Its not a gaming system, its a Dell dude

Dude, I have built machines for years. The only difference in this and your so called "gaming machine" is the fact that you can OC. I play HL2, DOD Source, BF2 all at the highest settings and get GREAT game play. People are so ignorant. You do know Dell produces great machines. They are upgradeable too.

You mom is a gaming machine....

Also, Vista is a GREAT OS.......no reason for you to bash it. Sure, like any OS, it has it's SMALL problems in the beginning, but they will get worked out. How dare you compare it to Windows ME.

Wow, calm down. Dell does built nice machines, I got one for my parents and it is rock solid. But the E521 is not a gaming machine, pure and simple. XPS, maybe, E521 - no.

Anyway. As I've said a dozen times already, don't waste your money on more than 2GB with 32bit Vista. If you do, upgrade to 64bit. I did the same thing. I went from 2GB --> 4GB on 32bit Vista, and it didn't do much of anything. So I got the 64bit disc and upgraded, and now that Vista can use all 4GB, it does help.
BUT, as I already said, you STILL won't get all that much performance out of your games that way. Buy this and something like this or this or this. According to this thread an 8600 will work with the stock PSU.

This 7950 will outperform the 8600, but I don't know if it will work with your PSU or not. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2975&p=2

If you need more power, you'll have to get this. These PSUs may fit, but you may need to use a dremel to make them fit. YMMV.

 

[Haui]

Originally posted by: mb

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: msi1337
you really want to buy more memory don't ya!!

2gb is fine. For $70 you could get 2gb more of SuperTalent DDR2-800, but I doubt you will see a difference.

Also, what Sniper82 said is partially correct. These computers use BTX power supplies and a better power supply would be Linked. Also, you are limited on upgrading the video card because anything bigger than a 7600gt will not fit next to the heatsink..since the processor is in the middle of the motherboard in a BTX design. I think I fit a 7900gs in an E521 once with a molex to 6 pin adapter for video card power..can't promise that though. Definetly none of the higher end video cards will fit in that case.

Also, I don't recommend Vista at all...to anyone. I regard it as one of the worst OS's ever since Windows ME.
Beside a slightly increased proficiency in memory usage it is embarrasingly slow and cumbersome. XP pro sp2 is the way to go for this Dell E521 computer. Its not a gaming system, its a Dell dude

Dude, I have built machines for years. The only difference in this and your so called "gaming machine" is the fact that you can OC. I play HL2, DOD Source, BF2 all at the highest settings and get GREAT game play. People are so ignorant. You do know Dell produces great machines. They are upgradeable too.

You mom is a gaming machine....

Also, Vista is a GREAT OS.......no reason for you to bash it. Sure, like any OS, it has it's SMALL problems in the beginning, but they will get worked out. How dare you compare it to Windows ME.

Wow, calm down. Dell does built nice machines, I got one for my parents and it is rock solid. But the E521 is not a gaming machine, pure and simple. XPS, maybe, E521 - no.

Anyway. As I've said a dozen times already, don't waste your money on more than 2GB with 32bit Vista. If you do, upgrade to 64bit. I did the same thing. I went from 2GB --> 4GB on 32bit Vista, and it didn't do much of anything. So I got the 64bit disc and upgraded, and now that Vista can use all 4GB, it does help.
BUT, as I already said, you STILL won't get all that much performance out of your games that way. Buy this and something like this or this or this. According to this thread an 8600 will work with the stock PSU.

This 7950 will outperform the 8600, but I don't know if it will work with your PSU or not. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2975&p=2

If you need more power, you'll have to get this. These PSUs may fit, but you may need to use a dremel to make them fit. YMMV.

I need you to define what a gaming PC is compared to a regular PC. Then, based upon my specs, tell me what I am missing?

 

[gtsing]

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: mb

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: msi1337
you really want to buy more memory don't ya!!

2gb is fine. For $70 you could get 2gb more of SuperTalent DDR2-800, but I doubt you will see a difference.

Also, what Sniper82 said is partially correct. These computers use BTX power supplies and a better power supply would be Linked. Also, you are limited on upgrading the video card because anything bigger than a 7600gt will not fit next to the heatsink..since the processor is in the middle of the motherboard in a BTX design. I think I fit a 7900gs in an E521 once with a molex to 6 pin adapter for video card power..can't promise that though. Definetly none of the higher end video cards will fit in that case.

Also, I don't recommend Vista at all...to anyone. I regard it as one of the worst OS's ever since Windows ME.
Beside a slightly increased proficiency in memory usage it is embarrasingly slow and cumbersome. XP pro sp2 is the way to go for this Dell E521 computer. Its not a gaming system, its a Dell dude

Dude, I have built machines for years. The only difference in this and your so called "gaming machine" is the fact that you can OC. I play HL2, DOD Source, BF2 all at the highest settings and get GREAT game play. People are so ignorant. You do know Dell produces great machines. They are upgradeable too.

You mom is a gaming machine....

Also, Vista is a GREAT OS.......no reason for you to bash it. Sure, like any OS, it has it's SMALL problems in the beginning, but they will get worked out. How dare you compare it to Windows ME.

Wow, calm down. Dell does built nice machines, I got one for my parents and it is rock solid. But the E521 is not a gaming machine, pure and simple. XPS, maybe, E521 - no.

Anyway. As I've said a dozen times already, don't waste your money on more than 2GB with 32bit Vista. If you do, upgrade to 64bit. I did the same thing. I went from 2GB --> 4GB on 32bit Vista, and it didn't do much of anything. So I got the 64bit disc and upgraded, and now that Vista can use all 4GB, it does help.
BUT, as I already said, you STILL won't get all that much performance out of your games that way. Buy this and something like this or this or this. According to this thread an 8600 will work with the stock PSU.

This 7950 will outperform the 8600, but I don't know if it will work with your PSU or not. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2975&p=2

If you need more power, you'll have to get this. These PSUs may fit, but you may need to use a dremel to make them fit. YMMV.

I need you to define what a gaming PC is compared to a regular PC. Then, based upon my specs, tell me what I am missing?

seriously man, stop trying to defend your pc...

so basically, unless your going to buy vista 64 bit, DONT UPGRADE TO 4GB OF RAM. and with a 300 watt PROPRIETARY psu i doubt you have enough juice to power a decent card and you might not even be able to upgrade it...gg.

 

[mb]

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: mb

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: msi1337
you really want to buy more memory don't ya!!

2gb is fine. For $70 you could get 2gb more of SuperTalent DDR2-800, but I doubt you will see a difference.

Also, what Sniper82 said is partially correct. These computers use BTX power supplies and a better power supply would be Linked. Also, you are limited on upgrading the video card because anything bigger than a 7600gt will not fit next to the heatsink..since the processor is in the middle of the motherboard in a BTX design. I think I fit a 7900gs in an E521 once with a molex to 6 pin adapter for video card power..can't promise that though. Definetly none of the higher end video cards will fit in that case.

Also, I don't recommend Vista at all...to anyone. I regard it as one of the worst OS's ever since Windows ME.
Beside a slightly increased proficiency in memory usage it is embarrasingly slow and cumbersome. XP pro sp2 is the way to go for this Dell E521 computer. Its not a gaming system, its a Dell dude

Dude, I have built machines for years. The only difference in this and your so called "gaming machine" is the fact that you can OC. I play HL2, DOD Source, BF2 all at the highest settings and get GREAT game play. People are so ignorant. You do know Dell produces great machines. They are upgradeable too.

You mom is a gaming machine....

Also, Vista is a GREAT OS.......no reason for you to bash it. Sure, like any OS, it has it's SMALL problems in the beginning, but they will get worked out. How dare you compare it to Windows ME.

Wow, calm down. Dell does built nice machines, I got one for my parents and it is rock solid. But the E521 is not a gaming machine, pure and simple. XPS, maybe, E521 - no.

Anyway. As I've said a dozen times already, don't waste your money on more than 2GB with 32bit Vista. If you do, upgrade to 64bit. I did the same thing. I went from 2GB --> 4GB on 32bit Vista, and it didn't do much of anything. So I got the 64bit disc and upgraded, and now that Vista can use all 4GB, it does help.
BUT, as I already said, you STILL won't get all that much performance out of your games that way. Buy this and something like this or this or this. According to this thread an 8600 will work with the stock PSU.

This 7950 will outperform the 8600, but I don't know if it will work with your PSU or not. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2975&p=2

If you need more power, you'll have to get this. These PSUs may fit, but you may need to use a dremel to make them fit. YMMV.

I need you to define what a gaming PC is compared to a regular PC. Then, based upon my specs, tell me what I am missing?

Quit your whining, we're trying to help you. Must you take offense to everything we say? It is not a gaming PC, even Dell doesn't call it that.

Just to entertain you, it lacks:
A motherboard that can run SLI/crossfire
A non-generic motherboard with adjustable BIOS settings
A strong PSU
Room for long graphic cards (maybe?)
Multiple drive bays (internal and external)
Multiple expansion slots
And for some: a nice case


Will it play games? Yes. But so will my laptop with integrated graphics.

 

[Haui]

Originally posted by: mb

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: mb

Originally posted by: Haui

Originally posted by: msi1337
you really want to buy more memory don't ya!!

2gb is fine. For $70 you could get 2gb more of SuperTalent DDR2-800, but I doubt you will see a difference.

Also, what Sniper82 said is partially correct. These computers use BTX power supplies and a better power supply would be Linked. Also, you are limited on upgrading the video card because anything bigger than a 7600gt will not fit next to the heatsink..since the processor is in the middle of the motherboard in a BTX design. I think I fit a 7900gs in an E521 once with a molex to 6 pin adapter for video card power..can't promise that though. Definetly none of the higher end video cards will fit in that case.

Also, I don't recommend Vista at all...to anyone. I regard it as one of the worst OS's ever since Windows ME.
Beside a slightly increased proficiency in memory usage it is embarrasingly slow and cumbersome. XP pro sp2 is the way to go for this Dell E521 computer. Its not a gaming system, its a Dell dude

Dude, I have built machines for years. The only difference in this and your so called "gaming machine" is the fact that you can OC. I play HL2, DOD Source, BF2 all at the highest settings and get GREAT game play. People are so ignorant. You do know Dell produces great machines. They are upgradeable too.

You mom is a gaming machine....

Also, Vista is a GREAT OS.......no reason for you to bash it. Sure, like any OS, it has it's SMALL problems in the beginning, but they will get worked out. How dare you compare it to Windows ME.

Wow, calm down. Dell does built nice machines, I got one for my parents and it is rock solid. But the E521 is not a gaming machine, pure and simple. XPS, maybe, E521 - no.

Anyway. As I've said a dozen times already, don't waste your money on more than 2GB with 32bit Vista. If you do, upgrade to 64bit. I did the same thing. I went from 2GB --> 4GB on 32bit Vista, and it didn't do much of anything. So I got the 64bit disc and upgraded, and now that Vista can use all 4GB, it does help.
BUT, as I already said, you STILL won't get all that much performance out of your games that way. Buy this and something like this or this or this. According to this thread an 8600 will work with the stock PSU.

This 7950 will outperform the 8600, but I don't know if it will work with your PSU or not. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2975&p=2

If you need more power, you'll have to get this. These PSUs may fit, but you may need to use a dremel to make them fit. YMMV.

I need you to define what a gaming PC is compared to a regular PC. Then, based upon my specs, tell me what I am missing?

Quit your whining, we're trying to help you. Must you take offense to everything we say? It is not a gaming PC, even Dell doesn't call it that.

Just to entertain you, it lacks:
A motherboard that can run SLI/crossfire
A non-generic motherboard with adjustable BIOS settings
A strong PSU
Room for long graphic cards (maybe?)
Multiple drive bays (internal and external)
Multiple expansion slots
And for some: a nice case


Will it play games? Yes. But so will my laptop with integrated graphics.

You hit it right on the nail......it plays the games I want it to....just like yours...and just like your laptop. These are gaming rigs. Something with onboard everything does NOT qualify as a gaming machine.

So...

 

[Sniper82]

They are different levels of gaming systems low,mid and high. Yours is considered somewhere in the mid range. Something with performance of around a 8800 series or Sli/Cross would be a high end IMO if the rest of the system is up there aswell. Anything with less performance than say a 6800 series would be low end IMO.