Texas gets tough on illegals, unless you want a personal Mexican

[CycloWizard]

.... :'( :thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

FFS, let's make the hypocrisy a LITTLE more obvious next time boys.

You want such jobs filled? Hire an American. Can't get an American to do it? Raise the wages until it is filled. At what price is American sovereignty, is there a bid for selling out your own country?

What if someone can afford to hire someone for $5/hour but not $7.25 an hour (minimum wage)? The crime is that it is illegal for an American citizen to work for less than $7.25 an hour, so it goes to someone else.

 

[Patranus]

What if someone can afford to hire someone for $5/hour but not $7.25 an hour (minimum wage)? The crime is that it is illegal for an American citizen to work for less than $7.25 an hour, so it goes to someone else.

I was reading a book about the great depression. One example in the book was that elevator operators made X amount of money operating the elevators. Then FDR passed minimum wage. At that point the owners had to pay their operators Y. Well, when paying them Y it became cheaper to automate the job. The elevator operators begged to keep their jobs and wanted to be paid X but legally the owner couldn't pay them that. Well, the jobs were eliminated and automated elevators were installed.

What we really need is to allow Americans to complete with wages.

 

[Zebo]

I don't see a problem with this. Joe blow is not set up to get i9's and everything else required of a real employer. Businesses are.

you do realize we have different business regs on all sorts of things depending on your size/number of employees?

If we didn't no small business could ever start. The costs would be too prohibitive.

 

[Phokus]

I was reading a book about the great depression. One example in the book was that elevator operators made X amount of money operating the elevators. Then FDR passed minimum wage. At that point the owners had to pay their operators Y. Well, when paying them Y it became cheaper to automate the job. The elevator operators begged to keep their jobs and wanted to be paid X but legally the owner couldn't pay them that. Well, the jobs were eliminated and automated elevators were installed.

What we really need is to allow Americans to complete with wages.

Yes, lets compete with countries that a) Subsidize their businesses b) Manipulate their currencies c) Socialize the cost of doing business (i.e. heavy pollution), and d) pay their workers peanuts.

 

[Zebo]

What if someone can afford to hire someone for $5/hour but not $7.25 an hour (minimum wage)? The crime is that it is illegal for an American citizen to work for less than $7.25 an hour, so it goes to someone else.

Anyone who pays that is a GD fool and destined to fail. You don't want your employees spending 40 hours a week thinking about working someplace else. Too bad, let real employers go into business.

 

[Patranus]

Yes, lets compete with countries that a) Subsidize their businesses b) Manipulate their currencies c) Socialize the cost of doing business (i.e. heavy pollution), and d) pay their workers peanuts.

So then we end up with 0 jobs, even if people are willing to work them.

Sounds like a great plan.

 

[Brovane]

So how much time did Meg Whitman spend in jail?

People with the money for their own personal Mexican to do housework and watch their kids don't do jail time. Their lawyers provide cover.

Why would Whitman spend time in jail? She went through a agency that was supposeed to provide employees that could legally work in the US. The maid used forged documents to get through the vetting process with the agency. If Whitman should be looking at the jail time then the agency that provided the maid should also be looking at jail time. That is why it is important to start more widely using e-verify.

 

[Zebo]

Nah you just charge for standards we require, a 400% tariff should work.

 

[CycloWizard]

Anyone who pays that is a GD fool and destined to fail. You don't want your employees spending 40 hours a week thinking about working someplace else. Too bad, let real employers go into business.

You seem to have lost touch with reality. I would wager that most people think about working somewhere else, regardless of how much money they make. If you're only paying someone $5/hour, you're obviously not worried that they're irreplaceable. There are plenty of other people out there sitting on their couches who would rather just be doing something rather than nothing, but they are legally required to continue doing nothing rather than take a job with a low wage.

 

[Brovane]

DesiPower

Spin my ass! If you can afford to hire a maid or gardener you surely have the means to copy a person's ID. Ask the prospective employee for proper ID and tell them you will make copies of it. An illegal may decline. Even if he/she agrees and is later exposed as an illegal, the State should accept your copies of ID as a good faith attempt to comply with the law.

Sorry you couldn't figure that out.

I think the question also comes down to should a citizen be required to check everyone's citizenship that they hire to do work? Really you are not hiring the person, you are hiring the company. Would you make a copy of the plumber ID, or the electrician? Most people do not hire maid's , gardener's directly. You would call up a maid service and they come out every couple of weeks and clean your house. You have no idea the legality of the person that the maid service is sending out. You shouldn't be expected to check if they are legal or not. It would only be the wealthy that would hire someone directly and that person would be working for them under a W-2 arrangement. What I am trying to figure out if the law only cover's instances where somebody is hired directly under a W-2 or 1099 arragement.

 

[soulcougher73]

Yea we have so much free money we should just lock up millions more people.

You dont lock them up. You put them to work building the best wall ever made by man but when the last brick is laid you make sure they are on the other side

 

[Brovane]

Pretty true. In most cases they assimilate to a point you can't even tell who's been here for generations and who just came over. I can count on one hand how many times I've talked to a Latino that couldn't speak English here in the 3 years I've been here.

Come by my Daughters school in South Orange County. They have a Spanish translator in her kindergarten class. Everything sent home, is printed in both Spanish and English.

 

[Phokus]

So then we end up with 0 jobs, even if people are willing to work them.

Sounds like a great plan.

Or how about we admit that free trade is a farce?

 

[actuarial]

I think the question also comes down to should a citizen be required to check everyone's citizenship that they hire to do work? Really you are not hiring the person, you are hiring the company. Would you make a copy of the plumber ID, or the electrician? Most people do not hire maid's , gardener's directly. You would call up a maid service and they come out every couple of weeks and clean your house. You have no idea the legality of the person that the maid service is sending out. You shouldn't be expected to check if they are legal or not. It would only be the wealthy that would hire someone directly and that person would be working for them under a W-2 arrangement. What I am trying to figure out if the law only cover's instances where somebody is hired directly under a W-2 or 1099 arragement.

You're not hiring anyone then, which is right in your post.

Obviously the standard of what would be considered 'reckless' could be hashed out in regulation. If payment is to an agency - no identification needed as the agency has the responsibility. If a non-business hires a worker on a continuous basis - driver's license / other ID. If a business hires a worker for any reason - higher burden of proof.

The reason that illegals are in America is because people want them to fill jobs. Cut off the jobs cut out the illegals.

 

[DaveSimmons]

If you are hiring someone for long-term employment as a gardener or maid, all you would need to do is:

1. Copy their ID
2. Mail it to some immigration enforcement agency

It's one simple extra step. If you can afford to hire employees and are already doing the paperwork to pay them, you can do this one time extra step.

It's hypocrisy for Republican state Rep. Debbie Riddle (who proposed this exemption) and other Republications who support it, to criminalize hiring illegals except for their own gardeners and maids.

As already mentioned above, removing this exemption would not put anyone in danger if they get services from companies instead of hiring people directly.

 

[JTsyo]

I think we're at the same point with illegal immigration as we are with the budget. We're too far down the hole to recover anytime soon. There are too many already here for us to deport everyone. The best we can do is slow the tide, deport those we catch and wait for the current ones to die. Their children will be US citizens and hopefully better integrated.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

The rich control our country.

Since this is the typical response you give, show me a country where the rich don't rule?

 

[Deeko]

Why is it that people who hire illegals can go to jail for 2 years and face a $10,000 fine but actually BEING here illegal gets you NOTHING? No jail, no fine, and often not even deported! Something in wrong with our system.

WRONG. Completely wrong.

The absolute best way to stop the illegal problem is to go after the source. The people hiring the illegals are the problem - I'm not saying they should be excused for doing it, but they wouldn't come here if they couldn't get jobs.

If you leave food laying out, and you get ants...you can kill the ants, but more will take their place. You have to take out the damn trash to fix the problem. And yes - the likely-conservative-wealthy-hypocrite-asshole that is exempt from this new law that hires illegals as their maid/lawn worker is absolutely the trash and the source of the problem.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Well when the person gets out of prison after those 2 years, will they be sent to the Congressman's house along with the illegal ( as perposed in another bill).

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

WRONG. Completely wrong.

The absolute best way to stop the illegal problem is to go after the source. The people hiring the illegals are the problem - I'm not saying they should be excused for doing it, but they wouldn't come here if they couldn't get jobs.

If you leave food laying out, and you get ants...you can kill the ants, but more will take their place. You have to take out the damn trash to fix the problem. And yes - the likely-conservative-wealthy-hypocrite-asshole that is exempt from this new law that hires illegals as their maid/lawn worker is absolutely the trash and the source of the problem.

Really?
I'm not rich by any stretch of the imagination, but I can get a mexican with a lawn mower to cut my grass and trim my trees for $20.
Am I the problem or is the problem the lazy liberals that would rather hand out cash to the unemployed instead of making them work the problem?

 

[Deeko]

Really?
I'm not rich by any stretch of the imagination, but I can get a mexican with a lawn mower to cut my grass and trim my trees for $20.
Am I the problem or is the problem the lazy liberals that would rather hand out cash to the unemployed instead of making them work the problem?

Haha of COURSE you're the problem. Why wouldn't you be? Illegals are here to work. You're giving them work. Therefore, you are the problem. Sure - they are also the problem - but you are more the problem than they are.

 

[Brovane]

Really?
I'm not rich by any stretch of the imagination, but I can get a mexican with a lawn mower to cut my grass and trim my trees for $20.
Am I the problem or is the problem the lazy liberals that would rather hand out cash to the unemployed instead of making them work the problem?

Are you employing the mexican directly our are you hiring a service? I have a service that comes every week and it costs me between 65-85/month depending on if it is a 4-week or 5-week month. I have no idea about the legality of the people that actually perform the service.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Haha of COURSE you're the problem. Why wouldn't you be? Illegals are here to work. You're giving them work. Therefore, you are the problem. Sure - they are also the problem - but you are more the problem than they are.

Again, why aren't we then going after teachers who knowingly allow illegal students in their class, city officials who declare their cities sanctuary cities, etc? Oh, thats right, because this is just about punishing the rich and wealth transfer.. nothing about actually solving the problem.

 

[Deeko]

Again, why aren't we then going after teachers who knowingly allow illegal students in their class, city officials who declare their cities sanctuary cities, etc? Oh, thats right, because this is just about punishing the rich and wealth transfer.. nothing about actually solving the problem.

I didn't say we shouldn't. The issue here is that you are also attempting to shirk responsibility too. This law specifically exempts some of the absolute biggest reasons we have an illegal immigration problem. It will not help anything as it stands.

For the record, I am definitely for tougher treatment for illegals that are here - but far more important is the question of "how do we stop them from coming", and the painfully obvious answer that you're trying to avoid is "eliminate their reason for being here".

 

[Phokus]

Are you employing the mexican directly our are you hiring a service? I have a service that comes every week and it costs me between 65-85/month depending on if it is a 4-week or 5-week month. I have no idea about the legality of the people that actually perform the service.

You don't know and you don't want to know.