Texas Ebola patient dies

[FerrelGeek]

Where the hell has the great Rick Perry been during all this? Doesn't states rights dictate he be in charge of this??

Rail against the federal government until you need them.

Did you criticize Bush and Brownie for the handling of Katrina? I'm betting you did. State's rights has nothing to do with this as it has the potential to affect things on a national level. This is a prime example of when it's totally appropriate for the federal government to get involved. Now, if you can prove that Perry is inhibiting the process ala what state and local officials did during Katrina, you'd have a valid point.

 

[Pens1566]

Also there is this fact of Mr Duncan lying about not being in contact with anyone with Ebola.

Still, with the way things are around here, I won't be too surprised if some jury decides to hand them free cash. Gotta love the legal system.

NYT piece on Duncan's time in Liberia just before he left indicated it was very likely he did not know he came in contact with any Ebola victims.

 

[squarecut1]

NYT piece on Duncan's time in Liberia just before he left indicated it was very likely he did not know he came in contact with any Ebola victims.

He accompanied that woman to the hospital who had very very Ebola like systems. With Ebola raging all around over there, it is inconceivable he did not know. He lied.

 

[Sinsear]

NYT piece on Duncan's time in Liberia just before he left indicated it was very likely he did not know he came in contact with any Ebola victims.

Fuck him, and his family. . His lying ass caused this. Hope he rots in hell.

 

[Brovane]

The WHO protocol that Dr.'s Without Borders follows is more stringent than what the CDC suggests. It's a problem.

Totally agree. Watch this video from Dr. Gupta back in April showing the measure in Guniea for Ebola care worker protection and compare to him showing the CDC standard. I wish the Guniea video showed how they got out but it clearly shows the difference in protection standards.

Guniea protection by Doctors without borders.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKqlSUAFwK8


CDC
http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/hea...rial-suits.cnn

 

[werepossum]

Um, $1M???? Really???? You're gonna pay out the a** in capital gains. And don't you hate rich people? Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.

As with everyone who hates "the rich", that title floats above their own net worth.

The WHO protocol that Dr.'s Without Borders follows is more stringent than what the CDC suggests. It's a problem.

A major problem.

 

[himkhan]

The fact that at least three people who were well aware of the danger of ebola, wearing protective gear in a modern hospital with all precautions and being careful still got infected tells you this stuff is not as hard to transmit from one person to another as the cdc and other talking heads would have us believe.

Wrong. Taking off your PPE in the incorrect order can and will spread disease. Everyone who works in a hospital involved with direct patient care knows this.

 

[himkhan]

We need a few more people to get ebola before the liberals start to take it seriously

But, But, But, But, But Liberals. But, But, But, But Obama. Rinse, wash, repeat. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[Jaskalas]

Fuck him, and his family. . His lying ass caused this. Hope he rots in hell.

He lied? Please explain...

 

[Pens1566]

He accompanied that woman to the hospital who had very very Ebola like systems. With Ebola raging all around over there, it is inconceivable he did not know. He lied.

Fuck him, and his family. . His lying ass caused this. Hope he rots in hell.

She was pregnant with stomach pains in an area that had no previous infections. They took her to the maternity ward.

Inconceivable and lying are strong words for that scenario.

 

[BoberFett]

Yes they have been absolutely wrong every step of the way. Good christ I wonder if they are even doctors. I put in an order to sell ALL of my stock this morning (about a million dollars) after I heard about the 2nd nurse. A pandemic will take the market right back to 2008 levels or lower.

Oh, so you're wealthy?

We should take most of that money away from you, you rich scumbag.

 

[squarecut1]

She was pregnant with stomach pains in an area that had no previous infections. They took her to the maternity ward.

Inconceivable and lying are strong words for that scenario.

I'm sorry. I think you are right. Those are strong words. Only he knew for sure what was the case. I think it was likely he knew, but I can't be hundred percent sure. I should not just assume the worst for someone who just died, that too in such a painful way.

 

[Belegost]

Yes they have been absolutely wrong every step of the way. Good christ I wonder if they are even doctors. I put in an order to sell ALL of my stock this morning (about a million dollars) after I heard about the 2nd nurse. A pandemic will take the market right back to 2008 levels or lower.

Thats a totally untrue. I hate rich people, [...]

Hating rich people while sitting on a million in stock investments? Hmmm...

 

[PokerGuy]

So you mention all these wonderful advantages the US has yet our health outcomes aren't any better. With that in mind, let's discuss efficiency some more?

You're assuming the 'inputs' that lead to those outcomes are the same. What makes you think the average US resident has the same general health, exercise habits and diet as a person from another country? Further, when people look at outcomes, they often fail to consider the time it takes before the outcome is achieved. Yes, the outcome might ultimately be the same, but I can get knee surgery within a couple of weeks, while a relative in Canada has waited more than 3 months to get his knee fixed. Ultimately we'll both have the same outcome from a medical perspective, but I much prefer a system where I'm not waiting that long.

Pros and cons to everything.

 

[fskimospy]

You're assuming the 'inputs' that lead to those outcomes are the same. What makes you think the average US resident has the same general health, exercise habits and diet as a person from another country? Further, when people look at outcomes, they often fail to consider the time it takes before the outcome is achieved. Yes, the outcome might ultimately be the same, but I can get knee surgery within a couple of weeks, while a relative in Canada has waited more than 3 months to get his knee fixed. Ultimately we'll both have the same outcome from a medical perspective, but I much prefer a system where I'm not waiting that long.

Pros and cons to everything.

That's not really how health outcomes are measured. For a ton of info on it I would suggest browsing through this: http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/49105858.pdf (section 5)

In some cases we do better than average, in some cases worse. That's all well and good until you realize to get these fairly generic results we're spending vastly more money each year.

Also, a lot of that doesn't explain our higher costs. For example, while it sounds like obese people should be more expensive to treat, it turns out they have lower lifetime health costs than healthy people because they tend to die young.

 

[PokerGuy]

That's not really how health outcomes are measured.

I know, that's the point. Health outcomes such as life expectancy, mortality and so forth do not measure amount of time I have to wait to be seen and so forth. The measurable ultimate outcomes are not the only things that are important to the medical system.

For a ton of info on it I would suggest browsing through this: http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/49105858.pdf (section 5)

Thanks for the link, I'll take a peek at it later when I get a chance.

In some cases we do better than average, in some cases worse. That's all well and good until you realize to get these fairly generic results we're spending vastly more money each year.

Yes, we spend vastly more for roughly the same outcomes, but that's not necessarily a bad thing depending on what is or is not included in "outcomes" being considered.

Also, a lot of that doesn't explain our higher costs. For example, while it sounds like obese people should be more expensive to treat, it turns out they have lower lifetime health costs than healthy people because they tend to die young.

Yes, that's true, but it's not just obesity, there are also considerable cultural differences, levels of exercise, dietary differences, educational differences that play into it. The "input" side is not the same as, say, Sweden or Germany. We also spend a ton more on R&D and medical equipment, which the rest of the world benefits from without having to pay for it. If the US wasn't essentially subsidizing their R&D, their health care expenditures would be much higher or their outcomes worse.

Thus, All in all I'm not saying the system is wonderful or without flaws, just that the oft thrown about information about spending vastly more for the "same" outcomes should be taken with a giant grain of salt.

 

[bshole]

Oh, so you're wealthy?

We should take most of that money away from you, you rich scumbag.

Why Bober, good to see ya. Are you looking for a hug..... ah come on over here and and we can play hide the sausage together..... would that you make feel better? Gawd I love you so much my brother from another mother.

Did you take my advice and dump your stock? I would like you to note the DJIA today November 15. I am predicting a DJIA of significantly less than 10K one year from today. My buy point is going to be 8K. This advice is my free gift to you because you are so dear to me. You are the only person on this forum who pays any attention to me whatsoever and I certainly do appreciate it.

 

[Fern]

CDC had them up on their website since August. I guess private sector needs to get its sheet together.

The CDC needs to get its "sheet together".

I recall the head of the CDC saying virtually every hospital in the US is capable of handling Ebola. No we find out that was completely wrong. IMO, you don't go on TV claiming something as fact if you haven't confirmed it to be so.

(Also, I doubt the CDC has the ability to force hospitals to follow its protocols. If they're not in charge, they shouldn't be publicly acting as if they are. They should stick to their bona fide purpose and perhaps just be supplying info instead of guarantees they cannot enforce.)

Fern

 

[Fern]

Family of Thomas Duncan is blaming the hospital....

Yea, fuck you too. Good luck finding a jury to give you money.

http://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/l...s-weeks-ebola-didnt-have-to-kill-my-uncle.ece

I've heard lawyers say it is extremely difficult to successfully sue hospitals under Texas law. They don't think the family has much of a chance.

Fern

 

[Jmman]

The CDC needs to get its "sheet together".

I recall the head of the CDC saying virtually every hospital in the US is capable of handling Ebola. No we find out that was completely wrong. IMO, you don't go on TV claiming something as fact if you haven't confirmed it to be so.

(Also, I doubt the CDC has the ability to force hospitals to follow its protocols. If they're not in charge, they shouldn't be publicly acting as if they are. They should stick to their bona fide purpose and perhaps just be supplying info instead of guarantees they cannot enforce.)

Fern

I agree completely. Ebola is a BSL 4 type of virus, and they are a total of 4 facilities in the whole country that can handle that. I recently read that we have at most 19 beds in the whole US that can meet BSL 4 criteria, 19! The guys from the CDC who said that any old hospital is prepared to treat this disease should be fired and someone who has a clue put in place.....

 

[Fern]

I have no idea if that specific individual would have made it in or not, but I do know that plenty of other people would make it in and in those cases we would have no idea as to where they had come from, they would have further incentives to conceal their port of origin upon ending up here, and it would drive people underground once they arrived. All of those things would only make the problem worse.
-snip-

"Conceal their point of origin"? How?

People from those West African countries would be traveling on their home country passports. That cannot be concealed.

People from those West African countries would be travel here on visa's we issued them. That would also show their port/country of origin. That cannot be concealed.

People from other countries who happened to travel through those West African countries would have had their passports stamped. We would therefore know they visited there etc. That cannot be concealed. (Disclaimer: I checked some of those countries to ensure they do the usual passport stamping, but not all.)

I still think the best course of action is to contain the outbreak to its country/point of origin and send in people and supplies to contain or eradicate it. Allowing it to escape was stupid.

Fern

 

[Fern]

Dooh - So does that mean they are going to transfer the health care worker(s) that got infected?

Yep, at least that's what I heard reported. Moving her to Emory.

Fern

 

[Fern]

A travel ban is idiotic because there are multiple modes of transportation. People take buses, trains, planes, etc. How do you propose stopping someone from flying to Canada or El Salvador and taking a bus here?

Simple: Check their passports and visa's like we routinely do upon entry to this country.

Fern

 

[CitizenKain]

Fuck him, and his family. . His lying ass caused this. Hope he rots in hell.

Is that really the best your tiny little dipshit brain could come up with? I know you are poorly educated trash that should be in jail, but try a little harder.

 

[Fern]

At far as the NIH at least they don't have "plenty of money". I'm not a 180 million are gonna die! guy but research in this country is in bad shape and I have pretty good connections in many disciplines. This is once where I agree with many who say we're wasting money on better ways to kill that we don't need.

They receive about $30 Billion every year. I think that's a lot.

Now I hear them complaining that if only they had more money they could have cured Ebola. Really?

The NIH wastes a lot of money. One example is $3.4 million to study backrubs by chiropractors. That is but one of many examples of dubious spending.

When the NIH can explain why they spent that money on backrubs instead of Ebola, and it better be damn persuasive, then maybe we talk more money

But it looks very much to me like they have a 'priority' problem, not a funding problem.

Here are more dubious expenditures of money. Somehow the NIH thought these were better uses of money than Ebola: http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidma...sages-for-rabbits-meditation-for-hot-flashes/

Fern