Ted Stevens : All charges dropped? Conviction Voided?

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jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
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Originally posted by: LTC8K6
the only real instance of potentially politically-motivated misconduct in the Bush Justice Department that has come to light

Did you miss that line?

Never mind, I'm sorry I started the thread.

No I didn't miss that line, but it appears to be the opinion of the Powerline blogger, as the Fox article he links makes no mention of political bias or motivation. Care to point out where such bias or motivation is established by any news article or other report?

No reason to run away. We're just talking here.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,908
6,790
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D S F: "The retrial was going to be "ugly"...that's why the Justice Department dropped charges. It appears that there's more to this story than meets the eye. Holder essentially admits prosecutorial misconduct here ---> "Justice Department officials say Holder wants to send a message to prosecutors throughout the department that actions he regards as misconduct will not be tolerated." Favorable evidence withheld, FBI agent complaints about of improper conduct by a fellow agent and prosecutors...this isn't about Steven's age...it's about the Justice Department screwing up and not wanting their dirty laundry aired."

Really? Where did you get this? I think it's about just what Holder said it's about. Stevens is getting a pass, but the investigation of the offending lawyers and the ethics folk who oversaw them will continue. This is an exposure and a threat to all justice dept lawyers that this behavior will not be swept under the rug. What I think I am hearing is are paranoid conspiratorial theories and your projecting onto others some personally psychopathology of your own. I hear a mindset that fosters delusions.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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No I didn't miss that line, but it appears to be the opinion of the Powerline blogger

Who else's opinion would it be?

Surprisingly, when I write about something, it's ususally my opinion. Much of what is written in the media is someone's opinion, of course.

The decision to void the case was someone's opinion.

Potentially.

In any event.

Those are pretty clear in the opinion, regarding political motivation.

The idea that such prosecutorial misconduct seems to be acceptable, has really stunned me.

The idea that Ted Stevens somehow lost his presumption of innocence is also stunning.

What happened to this country?

I just went through the local Duke LAX case with Nifong, a DA who should have been given a long prison sentence. What an eye opener that was to what prosecutors do on a daily basis...

 
Nov 30, 2006
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Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan
Originally posted by: Marlin1975
Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan
Originally posted by: Marlin1975
Originally posted by: jman19
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
If you follow the story of the trial, the case just doesn't exist.

The state withheld evidence favorable to Stevens and a prosecutor had a relationship with a state witness, etc.

Stevens never would have been convicted if not for the prosecutorial misconduct, which is why the whole thing is being dropped.

You don't think the conviction had an effect on the election?

The story didn't say there is no case, it said the Justice Department is dropping the charges.

And not due to lack of evidance but his age. I bet if he was still a senator they would go after him. But he lost his power and is old so they threw him this one get out of jail free card.
Bullshit.

Stevens has said he never sought gifts and wouldn't even accept a free lunch, much less expensive remodeling services. But prosecutors say he had a history of accepting gifts ?including an expensive massage chair from a friend ? and omitting them from the financial disclosure forms.

He said he considered that chair a loan.

"And the chair is still at your house?" prosecutor Brenda Morris asked.

"Yes," Stevens said.

"How is that not a gift?"

"He bought that chair as a gift, but I refused it as a gift," Stevens said. "He put it there and said it was my chair. I told him I would not accept it as a gift. We have lots of things in our house that don't belong to us."

Playing to the jury, Morris appeared confused.

"So, if you say it's not a gift, it's not a gift?" she said.

"I refused it as a gift," Stevens replied. "I let him put it in our basement at his request."



Yea poor Ted Stevens, so innocent. :laugh:
Judge says prosecutor misconduct...but you 'know' the 'real' reason...age and the fact that he's no longer a Senator...you're so wallowing in bullshit. How do you stand the odor?

RTFA:
Holder's decision is said to be based on Stevens' age ? he's 85 ? and the fact that Stevens is no longer in the Senate.

No one said the judge was influenced by his age or his losing the election. The justice department decided to stop pursuing the case for those reasons.
"After careful review, I have concluded that certain information should have been provided to the defense for use at trial," Holder said in a statement Wednesday. "In light of this conclusion, and in consideration of the totality of the circumstances of this particular case, I have determined that it is in the interest of justice to dismiss the indictment and not proceed with a new trial."

"The judge in the Stevens case has repeatedly delayed sentencing and criticized trial prosecutors for what he has called prosecutorial misconduct. At one point, prosecutors were held in contempt. Things got so bad that the Justice Department finally replaced the trial team, including top-ranking officials in Public Integrity Section, which is charged with prosecuting public corruption cases."

The retrial was going to be "ugly"...that's why the Justice Department dropped charges. It appears that there's more to this story than meets the eye. Holder essentially admits prosecutorial misconduct here ---> "Justice Department officials say Holder wants to send a message to prosecutors throughout the department that actions he regards as misconduct will not be tolerated." Favorable evidence withheld, FBI agent complaints about of improper conduct by a fellow agent and prosecutors...this isn't about Steven's age...it's about the Justice Department screwing up and not wanting their dirty laundry aired.

Really? Where did you get this? I think it's about just what Holder said it's about. Stevens is getting a pass, but the investigation of the offending lawyers and the ethics folk who oversaw them will continue. This is an exposure and a threat to all justice dept lawyers that this behavior will not be swept under the rug. What I think I am hearing is are paranoid conspiratorial theories and your projecting onto others some personally psychopathology of your own. I hear a mindset that fosters delusions.
Thanks for exposing my delusional nature and setting me straight Moonbeam...I'll try to do better. :roll:
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
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Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan

"After careful review, I have concluded that certain information should have been provided to the defense for use at trial," Holder said in a statement Wednesday. "In light of this conclusion, and in consideration of the totality of the circumstances of this particular case, I have determined that it is in the interest of justice to dismiss the indictment and not proceed with a new trial."

"The judge in the Stevens case has repeatedly delayed sentencing and criticized trial prosecutors for what he has called prosecutorial misconduct. At one point, prosecutors were held in contempt. Things got so bad that the Justice Department finally replaced the trial team, including top-ranking officials in Public Integrity Section, which is charged with prosecuting public corruption cases."

The retrial was going to be "ugly"...that's why the Justice Department dropped charges. It appears that there's more to this story than meets the eye. Holder essentially admits prosecutorial misconduct here ---> "Justice Department officials say Holder wants to send a message to prosecutors throughout the department that actions he regards as misconduct will not be tolerated." Favorable evidence withheld, FBI agent complaints about of improper conduct by a fellow agent and prosecutors...this isn't about Steven's age...it's about the Justice Department screwing up and not wanting their dirty laundry aired.

How do you not get this? Yes, there was misconduct. Faced with having to try the case again, the attorney general decided that it wasn't worthwhile because Stevens is old and no longer a senator. You can be sure that if Stevens won the election, he'd have been tried again.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
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Originally posted by: LTC8K6
No I didn't miss that line, but it appears to be the opinion of the Powerline blogger

Who else's opinion would it be?

Surprisingly, when I write about something, it's ususally my opinion. Much of what is written in the media is someone's opinion, of course.

The decision to void the case was someone's opinion.

Potentially.

In any event.

Those are pretty clear in the opinion, regarding political motivation.

The idea that such prosecutorial misconduct seems to be acceptable, has really stunned me.

The idea that Ted Stevens somehow lost his presumption of innocence is also stunning.

I'll ask it another way. What is the basis for HIS or anyone else's opinion that Republicans in the DOJ and Atty Generals office conspired against Republican Senator Ted Stevens for political reasons? Maybe they just wanted to win their case and played dirty, and didn't have anything to do with party politics?

EVERYTHING is "potential." What is his opinion based on besides unsupported speculation? He may very well be correct, but at this point it's purely a guess based on no evidence.

Do you usually voice your opinion when you have no information on which to base it? That doesn't sound like a smart thing to do. Holder isn't dropping the case b/c of some uninformed opinion or speculation as to motives of the prosecutors. He has all the info in front of him and is making an informed decision based on facts.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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Holder also said that further trials would be embarrassing to the state, meaning more misconduct would be revealed.

Exculpatory evidence was withheld from the jury. Meaning the jury did not get to see some evidence that was favorable to Stevens.

The state can spin this as if they had a case, but it's not going to work.

You don't over rule a jury without great cause.

We will see what moves Stevens' attorneys make. What thet do will be the next sign of waht went on in that trial.

 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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What is the basis for HIS or anyone else's opinion that Republicans in the DOJ and Atty Generals office conspired against Republican Senator Ted Stevens for political reasons?

Why ask me? I didn't write it and it's irrelevant.

The case was either real, or trumped up.

Do you usually voice your opinion when you have no information on which to base it?

That would be speculation, and most people do it, as do I.

However, I did none of it in this thread.

Stevens is now, in fact, innocent of any and all charges. That's a fact. Just like he was before the trial started. Just like every person is who has not been convicted of a crime.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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I had no idea the presumption of innocence had disappeared here, or I wouldn't have started the thread.

I am literally stunned by the support of this prosecution in this thread.

I really don't know what to say about it anymore.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
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Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Holder also said that further trials would be embarrassing to the state, meaning more misconduct would be revealed.

Where did he say that?
 
Nov 30, 2006
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Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan

"After careful review, I have concluded that certain information should have been provided to the defense for use at trial," Holder said in a statement Wednesday. "In light of this conclusion, and in consideration of the totality of the circumstances of this particular case, I have determined that it is in the interest of justice to dismiss the indictment and not proceed with a new trial."

"The judge in the Stevens case has repeatedly delayed sentencing and criticized trial prosecutors for what he has called prosecutorial misconduct. At one point, prosecutors were held in contempt. Things got so bad that the Justice Department finally replaced the trial team, including top-ranking officials in Public Integrity Section, which is charged with prosecuting public corruption cases."

The retrial was going to be "ugly"...that's why the Justice Department dropped charges. It appears that there's more to this story than meets the eye. Holder essentially admits prosecutorial misconduct here ---> "Justice Department officials say Holder wants to send a message to prosecutors throughout the department that actions he regards as misconduct will not be tolerated." Favorable evidence withheld, FBI agent complaints about of improper conduct by a fellow agent and prosecutors...this isn't about Steven's age...it's about the Justice Department screwing up and not wanting their dirty laundry aired.

How do you not get this? Yes, there was misconduct. Faced with having to try the case again, the attorney general decided that it wasn't worthwhile because Stevens is old and no longer a senator. You can be sure that if Stevens won the election, he'd have been tried again.
The more I think about this, the more I agree. Personally I wish they would have pursued to uphold the conviction and let the chips fall where they may...this whole misconduct thing smells and the full extent of this breach should be exposed to the light of day. I'm neutral on Stevens (justice should always prevail regardless of political persuasion) but would like to know if Steven's was wrongfully convicted or not. But, I do think the chair thing humorous....but not nearly as funny as all the tax cheats currently filling high level offices and passing it off as 'honest' mistakes.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
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Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I had no idea the presumption of innocence had disappeared here, or I wouldn't have started the thread.

I am literally stunned by the support of this prosecution in this thread.

I really don't know what to say about it anymore.

I won't bother with the hyperbole which must have proceeded your post, but Stevens once said after being convicted that he was never convicted. Kind of an odd logic on his part. He was found guilty, and there isn't evidence to the contrary. What there IS though is prosecutorial malfeasance which caused the judge to dismiss the case (along with his age and his no longer being in the Senate).

The effect is that the judge punished the prosecutors by freeing Stevens regardless of facts which pointed to his guilt.

Presumption of innocence really isn't involved in this case. It's about a judge seeing bad behavior and punishing the prosecution.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
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Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I had no idea the presumption of innocence had disappeared here, or I wouldn't have started the thread.

I am literally stunned by the support of this prosecution in this thread.

I really don't know what to say about it anymore.

I don't think you understand what 'presumption of innocence' means. It is solely for the jury and the courts, that they not have a preconceived determination of the guilt of the accused, and that the prosecution has the burden of proving guilt. A defendant may rest without calling a single witness and if the prosecutor hasn't proven guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, the defendant is acquitted. He need not prove his innocence. That's what presumption of innocence means.

Presumption of Innocence most certainly does NOT mean that private citizens following the story in the press or court papers cannot form an opinion as to Stevens degree of culpability. It does not mean private citizens cannot opine publicly their beliefs as to a defendant's guilt or innocence.

Nothing has happened to the presumption of innocence, it's alive and well.

And this thread certainly appears to favor prosecution, but I don't see anyone supporting the prosecutors in question whose malfeasance is at issue.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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I don't think you understand what 'presumption of innocence' means.

Okay. The public is where jurors are pulled from. If the public has suspended the idea that the accused are innocent until proven guilty, it doesn't bode well.

In this case, it was the prosecutors who suspended it, and that's what I am talking about. Posters in this thread don't seem to care that the state dropped the idea of the presumption if innocence by withholding strong evidence of Steven's innocence.

In Allen's interview, that was withheld from the defense, Ted Stevens apparently asked for a bill for the repairs. If that's true, then there is no case, and the prosecution knew there was no case.

http://www.foxnews.com/politic...ed-ex-sen-ted-stevens/

**********

Holder said he would not seek a new trial.

"After careful review, I have concluded that certain information should have been provided to the defense for use at trial. In light of this conclusion, and in consideration of the totality of the circumstances of this particular case, I have determined that it is in the interest of justice to dismiss the indictment and not proceed with a new trial," Holder said in a statement released shortly after the motion was filed Wednesday.

Holder reportedly decided Tuesday to dismiss the original indictment rather than proceed to more hearings that might embarrass the department.

"Given what has happened in this case, it's not surprising" that charges against Stevens are being dropped, a source close to the case told FOX News.

Stevens' attorneys claimed the government "disregarded the Constitution" by going through with the prosecution but praised both Holder, the new prosecutorial team and Judge Emmett G. Sullivan for demonstrating integrity in the case.

"The misconduct of government prosecutors, and one or more FBI agents, was stunning. Not only did the government fail to disclose evidence of innocence, but instead intentionally hid that evidence and created false evidence that they provided to the defense," said attorneys Brendan V. Sullivan Jr. and Robert M. Cary.

"Had Judge Sullivan accepted the word of government prosecutors as is done often in our courts, the extraordinary misconduct would never have been uncovered, and the trial verdict might have survived appellate review. Judge Sullivan prevented such a tragic outcome. ...

Attorney General Eric Holder, too, should be commended. He is a pillar of integrity in the legal community, and his actions today prove it," they said.

The motion says the Department of Justice only "recently" discovered that Bill Allen -- the prosecution's star witness and an oil executive whose former company, Veco Corp., paid for some of the improvements to Stevens' home in Alaska -- was interviewed on April 15, 2008, but the defense never knew about it.

The motion states that "no memorandum of interview or agent notes" were written after the interview and that a response from Allen regarding a note dated Oct. 6, 2002, was inconsistent with his testimony during trial.

Thus, the motion says, "this information could have been used by the defendant [during trial] to cross-examine Bill Allen and in arguments to the jury."

In the motion, the Justice Department says: "Given the facts of this particular case, the government believes that granting a new trial is in the interest of justice," but, "the government has further determined that, based on the totality of circumstances and in the interest of justice, it will not seek a new trial."

Alaska Sen. Lisa Murkowski said she was happy with the news, but troubled by the implication.

"I was pleased with the news that the Justice Department will drop all charges against Senator Ted Stevens, but I am deeply disturbed that the government can ruin a man's career and then say 'never mind.' There is nothing that will ever compensate for the loss of his reputation or leadership to the State of Alaska," she said.

 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
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The trial judge was quite correct in holding the prosecution in contempt. On appeal, Stevens would have had the conviction vacated on the grounds of
prosecution misconduct.

In terms of the decision not to retry Stevens on the original charges again, it may have been quite doable, and I somewhat question Holder's decision not to. But at the end of the day, we all have to realize that a very corrupt member of the Senate is now out of office, and that is the bottom line. And retrying a
85 year old man while getting a unbiased jury is somewhat unfair and difficult.

It may serve the interests of partisan politics to say, hooray, we now have a Democrat, but in terms of justice, a non corrupt Republican would have done as well.

And to that other extent, the GWB justice department closes out its tenure, as not getting anything right, with Fitzpatrick's conviction of Scotter Libby being almost the lone exception.

And that other message is being sent by Holder, the people's justice department is back, we will not tolerate corrupt politicians or corrupt prosecutors. We are going to get things right.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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Well, it's over now in any event, and it's a good sign that Holder has done this.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,908
6,790
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Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I had no idea the presumption of innocence had disappeared here, or I wouldn't have started the thread.

I am literally stunned by the support of this prosecution in this thread.

I really don't know what to say about it anymore.

I won't bother with the hyperbole which must have proceeded your post, but Stevens once said after being convicted that he was never convicted. Kind of an odd logic on his part. He was found guilty, and there isn't evidence to the contrary. What there IS though is prosecutorial malfeasance which caused the judge to dismiss the case (along with his age and his no longer being in the Senate).

The effect is that the judge punished the prosecutors by freeing Stevens regardless of facts which pointed to his guilt.

Presumption of innocence really isn't involved in this case. It's about a judge seeing bad behavior and punishing the prosecution.

The judge and Holder worked together in the same ethics review board within the justice department that failed to reign in this case of bad prosecution before going different paths and Holder has great respect for that judge. He is said to be appalled at the lack of judgment and supervision supplied by the current ethics people. Nice post.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,908
6,790
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D S F: Thanks for exposing my delusional nature and setting me straight Moonbeam...I'll try to do better. :roll:[/quote]

Any time. Glad to see you're coming into the light. :thumbsup:
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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Stevens asked for a bill, that is a fact.

At trial, Allen claimed he spok to Parsons, and Parsons told him not to bother sending a bill, that Ted was just covering his ass by asking for the bill.

In an April 2008 interview, Allen did not recall even speaking to Parsons about the bill. This interview was not given to the defense untill well after the trial was over.

Allen radically changed his story on a point that is the crux of the case, imo.
Allen was the porosecution's star witness.
Allen had a relationship with lead FBI agent in charge of the prosecution.

This shows there was no case and that Stevens was almost certainly innocent of the charges, imo. Stevens asked for a bill for the repairs, and that fact is now uncontested.

From NPR:

He also said the lead FBI agent in charge of the investigation, Mary Beth Kepner, had an inappropriate relationship with witness Bill Allen, the Alaska millionaire at the center of the investigation. Joy said he once saw Kepner entering Allen's hotel room alone and that Kepner told Joy that she wore a skirt during her appearance at the Stevens trial as a "surprise/present" for Allen.

 
Nov 30, 2006
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Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Stevens asked for a bill, that is a fact.

At trial, Allen claimed he spok to Parsons, and Parsons told him not to bother sending a bill, that Ted was just covering his ass by asking for the bill.

In an April 2008 interview, Allen did not recall even speaking to Parsons about the bill. This interview was not given to the defense untill well after the trial was over.

Allen radically changed his story on a point that is the crux of the case, imo.
Allen was the porosecution's star witness.
Allen had a relationship with lead FBI agent in charge of the prosecution.

This shows there was no case and that Stevens was almost certainly innocent of the charges, imo. Stevens asked for a bill for the repairs, and that fact is now uncontested.

From NPR:

He also said the lead FBI agent in charge of the investigation, Mary Beth Kepner, had an inappropriate relationship with witness Bill Allen, the Alaska millionaire at the center of the investigation. Joy said he once saw Kepner entering Allen's hotel room alone and that Kepner told Joy that she wore a skirt during her appearance at the Stevens trial as a "surprise/present" for Allen.
The plot thickens.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,908
6,790
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Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Stevens asked for a bill, that is a fact.

At trial, Allen claimed he spok to Parsons, and Parsons told him not to bother sending a bill, that Ted was just covering his ass by asking for the bill.

In an April 2008 interview, Allen did not recall even speaking to Parsons about the bill. This interview was not given to the defense untill well after the trial was over.

Allen radically changed his story on a point that is the crux of the case, imo.
Allen was the porosecution's star witness.
Allen had a relationship with lead FBI agent in charge of the prosecution.

This shows there was no case and that Stevens was almost certainly innocent of the charges, imo. Stevens asked for a bill for the repairs, and that fact is now uncontested.

From NPR:

He also said the lead FBI agent in charge of the investigation, Mary Beth Kepner, had an inappropriate relationship with witness Bill Allen, the Alaska millionaire at the center of the investigation. Joy said he once saw Kepner entering Allen's hotel room alone and that Kepner told Joy that she wore a skirt during her appearance at the Stevens trial as a "surprise/present" for Allen.
The plot thickens.

Are you sure that's not blood rushing to your dick?
 
Nov 30, 2006
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Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Originally posted by: Doc Savage Fan
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Stevens asked for a bill, that is a fact.

At trial, Allen claimed he spok to Parsons, and Parsons told him not to bother sending a bill, that Ted was just covering his ass by asking for the bill.

In an April 2008 interview, Allen did not recall even speaking to Parsons about the bill. This interview was not given to the defense untill well after the trial was over.

Allen radically changed his story on a point that is the crux of the case, imo.
Allen was the porosecution's star witness.
Allen had a relationship with lead FBI agent in charge of the prosecution.

This shows there was no case and that Stevens was almost certainly innocent of the charges, imo. Stevens asked for a bill for the repairs, and that fact is now uncontested.

From NPR:

He also said the lead FBI agent in charge of the investigation, Mary Beth Kepner, had an inappropriate relationship with witness Bill Allen, the Alaska millionaire at the center of the investigation. Joy said he once saw Kepner entering Allen's hotel room alone and that Kepner told Joy that she wore a skirt during her appearance at the Stevens trial as a "surprise/present" for Allen.
The plot thickens.

Are you sure that's not blood rushing to your dick?
What is with you? What's your problem?
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I had no idea the presumption of innocence had disappeared here, or I wouldn't have started the thread.

I am literally stunned by the support of this prosecution in this thread.

I really don't know what to say about it anymore.

I won't bother with the hyperbole which must have proceeded your post, but Stevens once said after being convicted that he was never convicted. Kind of an odd logic on his part. He was found guilty, and there isn't evidence to the contrary. What there IS though is prosecutorial malfeasance which caused the judge to dismiss the case (along with his age and his no longer being in the Senate).

The effect is that the judge punished the prosecutors by freeing Stevens regardless of facts which pointed to his guilt.

Presumption of innocence really isn't involved in this case. It's about a judge seeing bad behavior and punishing the prosecution.

The prosecution did not follow the rules. They withheld information/evidence that coiuld have broken their case wide open and caused a not guilty verdict. They are supposed to provide ALL information to the defense, not just what they want to cherry pick for their benefit.

During the trial there was evidence of misconduct; after the trial, so much more became visisble that the conviction would have been overturned on appeal.


Originally posted by: Lemon law
The trial judge was quite correct in holding the prosecution in contempt. On appeal, Stevens would have had the conviction vacated on the grounds of
prosecution misconduct.

In terms of the decision not to retry Stevens on the original charges again, it may have been quite doable, and I somewhat question Holder's decision not to. But at the end of the day, we all have to realize that a very corrupt member of the Senate is now out of office, and that is the bottom line. And retrying a
85 year old man while getting a unbiased jury is somewhat unfair and difficult.

It may serve the interests of partisan politics to say, hooray, we now have a Democrat, but in terms of justice, a non corrupt Republican would have done as well.

And to that other extent, the GWB justice department closes out its tenure, as not getting anything right, with Fitzpatrick's conviction of Scotter Libby being almost the lone exception.

And that other message is being sent by Holder, the people's justice department is back, we will not tolerate corrupt politicians or corrupt prosecutors. We are going to get things right.

You are calling Stevens corrupt; yet the evidence to prove it in court was flawed.
Essentially, you are committing libel.

Everything else in your post is dead on though.



 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
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Originally posted by: mugs
:thumbsdown: to the prosecutors who botched the conviction.

Seconded... now Stevens gets to walk around as if he's innocent.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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Seconded... now Stevens gets to walk around as if he's innocent.

Nicely played bait :D, but he is in fact innocent and doesn't need to act as if.