Techreport: A note on rumors about gtx 590 issues.

[krumme]

Hey bryanW1995, I'm not allowed to agree with you or appear friendly towards you in any way. I'm going to have to disagree with you now then.
Cheers!

Sorry i dont understand? Am i supposed to be some bryanW1995 or what?

 

[MentalIlness]

This isn't true Mental. I responded full well to Nitromullet. I don't feel comfortable overvolting any of my pc hardware. I am not experienced at this and 1.2v has been shown to be way too high even if I wasn't using 267.91 which disables overvolting.

Thataboy. Edit out most of my post with just you pointing out that you responded to his post. Ok, you did. I missed it.

But...run the test. Don't go to 1.2v. Go to 1v or 1.1. Anything for that matter. You are hell bent on proving it isn't true about what is going on.

I am "sure and positive" there is a test you can run. Why not overclock as far as you can, without voltage increase ? Or barely increase it ?

At least show us something that backs up your claims that the problem is no longer present.

 

[thilanliyan]

i bit the bullet and installed mine before i left for work this morning. i'll play some ghostbusters in 3D and see if my card lives

Ghostbusters...?! Furmark!!

Push that baby!!

I am "sure and positive" there is a test you can run. Why not overclock as far as you can, without voltage increase ? Or barely increase it ?

At least show us something that backs up your claims that the problem is no longer present.

+1

 

[jimbo75]

So wait 4-5 drivers since release, 2 hasty website notices saying only to overvolt a tiny amount then not at all, then a new bios coming out today...but the cards are really fine, honest guv.

 

[Seero]

If you want to attempt to post facts, at least get them straight.

Fact: 8 review cards blew up, 6 independent reviewers, 2 reviewers had 2 cards blow up each and four reviewers had one card blow up...

You need to read more carefully. Read the reason of failure from reviewers.

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/825-...e-gtx-590.html

Wrong driver.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/A...TX_590/27.html
1.2v, almost 300mv extra voltage.

http://tbreak.com/tech/2011/03/zotac-gtx-590-review/3/
125mv extra voltage.

Two cards dead for these reviewers as well
http://www.sweclockers.com/artikel/1...boven-i-dramat
No information about settings. Done in a lab with camera setup, yet without any other information. Maybe they are using 1.2V too.

Two cards dead for these reviewers
http://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=ro&tl=en&u=http://lab501. ro%2Fplaci-video%2Fnvidia-geforce-gtx-590-studiu-de-overclocking%2F12
1.3V was the goal...

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...9&postcount=37
This is a claim about weak VRM, not proof.

Are you even reading what you post?

 

[formulav8]

blah blah blah. the cards, or a batch of cards obviously had some kind of failure.

NVidia most likely pushed these cards to the edge/limit/redline themselves and left no real room for the tweakers to do their normal thing.

 

[Outrage]

Two cards dead for these reviewers as well
http://www.sweclockers.com/artikel/1...boven-i-dramat
No information about settings. Done in a lab with camera setup, yet without any other information. Maybe they are using 1.2V too.

Benchmark running was 3DMark 11. Settings used during card failure:
GPU Clock @ 772 MHz
GPU VCore @ 1,025 V

 

[nanaki333]

You need to read more carefully. Read the reason of failure from reviewers.

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/825-...e-gtx-590.html

Wrong driver.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/A...TX_590/27.html
1.2v, almost 300mv extra voltage.

http://tbreak.com/tech/2011/03/zotac-gtx-590-review/3/
125mv extra voltage.

Two cards dead for these reviewers as well
http://www.sweclockers.com/artikel/1...boven-i-dramat
No information about settings. Done in a lab with camera setup, yet without any other information. Maybe they are using 1.2V too.

Two cards dead for these reviewers
http://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=ro&tl=en&u=http://lab501. ro%2Fplaci-video%2Fnvidia-geforce-gtx-590-studiu-de-overclocking%2F12
1.3V was the goal...

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...9&postcount=37
This is a claim about weak VRM, not proof.

Are you even reading what you post?

i guess nvidia should start putting on the box "using the provided driver may result in phsyical damage to your graphics card. use at your own risk or continue to wait for an update online before use."

 

[psoomah]

From Lab 501:

"Instead of this we have but the failure of the year for that team ready PCB design and the design of the VRM has made a very stupid thing, under the most bleak expectations, and it's impossible for anyone to producing something weaker that at this level."

Pretty obvious cost cutting was the no.1 criteria for component selection when it came to performance ... except for the GPU selection. Very odd. Just doesn't make sense to use the 580 chips and then leave so much performance on the table, especially with the available cooling system headroom ... except maybe to the bean counters.

I see no upside for Nvidia here.

 

[SlowSpyder]

i guess nvidia should start putting on the box "using the provided driver may result in phsyical damage to your graphics card. use at your own risk or continue to wait for an update online before use."

Yea, the terminology is interesting... "wrong driver". I think "another faulty driver" would be more accurate. A wrong driver would be a Matrox driver. A driver provided on a CD in the retail box, well I would think that might be the right driver.

 

[Seero]

i guess nvidia should start putting on the box "using the provided driver may result in phsyical damage to your graphics card. use at your own risk or continue to wait for an update online before use."

Read Ryan's post please.

 

[Seero]

From Lab 501:

"Instead of this we have but the failure of the year for that team ready PCB design and the design of the VRM has made a very stupid thing, under the most bleak expectations, and it's impossible for anyone to producing something weaker that at this level."

Pretty obvious cost cutting was the no.1 criteria for component selection when it came to performance ... except for the GPU selection. Very odd. Just doesn't make sense to use the 580 chips and then leave so much performance on the table, especially with the available cooling system headroom ... except maybe to the bean counters.

I see no upside for Nvidia here.

You missed the part where the author believes that the card should have 2x8Pin+6pin connector, will suck more than 400Watt electricity and requires tower HS for each GPU.

 

[nitromullet]

NVidia most likely pushed these cards to the edge/limit/redline themselves and left no real room for the tweakers to do their normal thing.

I think this is exactly the case. I'm guessing they were trying really hard to meet the 6990 $700 price point, which is probably hard to do with GF110. I imagine the GTX 590 would be a good (or maybe even phenomenal) $900-1000 card.

It's a shame they didn't go true high end with overbuilt power circuitry and massively out of PCIe spec triple 8-pin PCIe power connectors a la the Asus Aries cards. Sure, they would have taken a beating for power draw, heat, etc from the reviewers, but they would have been the darling of enthusiast community. In the end enthusiasts buy cards, not reviewers.

 

[Gikaseixas]

I like Keys but he does pisses me off a bit sometimes. This time Nv made a boo boo, they certainly have a faulty piece of hardware and there's no point in defending it. It just makes te company look worse.

Like i said in another thread, i'm a big fan of the mighty GTX 580... now that's a card with balls.

 

[OCGuy]

Edit: NVM

 

[TerabyteX]

Well, I do think that nVidia pushed the limits of the GTX 590 leaving no overclocking margins, may be it pushed it too far, otherwise they wouldn't had disabled the GTX 590 overclocking abilities with their latest drivers while the HD 6990 overclocks fine. I heard that the issue is because they only used five 32A noname brand voltage regulators while the HD 6990 had four 40A Volterra voltage regulators which gives the HD 6990 more power that it would ever use. Enthusiast class hardware should always have the best in class component quality for the sake of reliability.

While we all know that the GTX 590 GPU's consumes far more power than competitor's equivalent, then why skimp on the power circuitry? While we know that such high end SKU's have very little margins in terms of profits and I'm certainly sure that the GTX 590 is more expensive to manufacture due to its complex PCB memory BUS and bigger chips, they should had invest a bit more in quality parts and increase the price a bit, as it would be faster than the HD 6990 and hence justifiable.

 

[notty22]

End users discussing electrical specifications/tolerances, naming and 2nd guessing component use and design is only so 'helpful'. Most people have no electronic schooling, nor the ability to troubleshoot to the component level. So comparing one board with its components to another design is the proverbial apples to oranges.

 

[Seero]

Well, I do think that nVidia pushed the limits of the GTX 590 leaving no overclocking margins, may be it pushed it too far, otherwise they wouldn't had disabled the GTX 590 overclocking abilities with their latest drivers while the HD 6990 overclocks fine.

This, is a fair and valid claim.

I heard that the issue is because they only used five 32A noname brand voltage regulators while the HD 6990 had four 40A Volterra voltage regulators which gives the HD 6990 more power that it would ever use.

This is less fair, but valid claim.

Enthusiast class hardware should always have the best in class component quality for the sake of reliability.

Define Enthusiast class. Is a hardware Enthusiast class with a factory setting only unleash 1% of its performance, and you can acquire the rest through player sliders?

While we all know that the GTX 590 GPU's consumes far more power than competitor's equivalent,

Really?

then why skimp on the power circuitry?

375 Watt, PCI Express standard.

While we know that such high end SKU's have very little margins in terms of profits and I'm certainly sure that the GTX 590 is more expensive to manufacture due to its complex PCB memory BUS and bigger chips, they should had invest a bit more in quality parts and increase the price a bit, as it would be faster than the HD 6990 and hence justifiable.

What is the warranty on 6990 after flipping the switch? What is the yellow stick said again?

 

[TerabyteX]

End users discussing electrical specifications/tolerances, naming and 2nd guessing component use and design is only so 'helpful'. Most people have no electronic schooling, nor the ability to troubleshoot to the component level. So comparing one board with its components to another design is the proverbial apples to oranges.

But your post proved to be not helpful at all.

Define Enthusiast class. Is a hardware Enthusiast class with a factory setting only unleash 1% of its performance, and you can acquire the rest through player sliders?

Enthusiast class hardware allow for higher quality components, good overclocking margins and very good performance. Unfortunately the GTX 590 is a half class enthusiast hardware as it barely matches the stock HD 6990 and can't be overclocked at all. The HD 6990 can be overclocked up to 960MHz like apoppin did.

Really?

What is the warranty on 6990 after flipping the switch? What is the yellow stick said again?

Well, XFX is giving warranty for those who flip the switch, what warranty can you have with a burnt card? Another swap with a similar card that eventually will die again??

Enthusiast hardware overclocks much better than the GTX 590, so GTX 590 isn't tweakable at all, so player sliders for nothing...., specially when nVidia disabled overclocking, they did for a reason.... :roleyes:

 

[Outrage]

What is the warranty on 6990 after flipping the switch? What is the yellow stick said again?

If you bought the card from amd you are screwed, but you probably know that amd dont sell cards.

 

[Cookie Monster]

I was wondering, and i did post this sometime back. Can one fiddle around with voltages using a HD6990? The TPU review didn't touch the voltage.

 

[Seero]

Enthusiast class hardware allow for higher quality components, good overclocking margins and very good performance. Unfortunately the GTX 590 is a half class enthusiast hardware as it barely matches the stock HD 6990 and can't be overclocked at all. The HD 6990 can be overclocked up to 960MHz like apoppin did.

It is true that it appears that one can put more voltage into 6690 than 590.

Well, XFX is giving warranty for those who flip the switch, what warranty can you have with a burnt card? Another swap with a similar card that eventually will die again??

If the card dies without OC, then you can get a replacement card or refund. I don't think we need to argue about the terms of warranty. If you OC and ended up killing your card, that is another story. Agree? Now isn't it dumb not to max out the slider on 6990? Why do they even put the switch in? What does flipping it means? I means you are putting mobo and PSU on overdrive. I won't be surprise seeing mobo and PSU dying because they are being ran out of spec. Don't you agree?

Enthusiast hardware overclocks much better than the GTX 590, so GTX 590 isn't tweakable at all, so player sliders for nothing...., specially when nVidia disabled overclocking, they did for a reason.... :roleyes:

Well, I prefer a card that doesn't require OC. In fact, since when OC is an requirement? What happens to the plug and play idea?

I am not saying the extra headroom is bad, nor I am saying 6990 is a bad card. To be honest, I will prefer HD6990 over GTX590 (or any single core card if it is an option, SLI/CF is still not ready IMO.) That is different from saying 590 is faulty, just not as good if overclock is my cup of tea. But to this topic, don't you agree that the incidents have be over exaggerated by forums?

Look, at stock, both cards are head to head. One can OC, one not until AIB partners come up with something. It is clear that HD6990 > GTX590 by a bit, but this is when Nvidia's small little candy comes to play. CUDA, PhysX, and 3D vision support. Yes it is old, but it never gets old. We can talking about 2 cards selling at around the same price. Each has something special. May I ask what is wrong?

 

[Seero]

If you bought the card from amd you are screwed, but you probably know that amd dont sell cards.

Define screwed. If I brought a card and it set on fire before I plug it into the PC, and no refund or exchange, then I will be upset and bitch about it. If I brought a card, and killed it because I don't know how to overclock, I will probably STFU and QQ quietly.

What will you do?

Just for the record, I have just fixed a 4870 recently. I asked for help here too if I remember correctly (died fan, which lead to overheat, shutdown etc.) Video card don't last forever you know, and some do fail from day one. That is why it usually comes with warranty.

 

[hdfxst]

I was wondering, and i did post this sometime back. Can one fiddle around with voltages using a HD6990? The TPU review didn't touch the voltage.

there is a beta afterburner that allows you to change the voltage.But other than that i dont think you can change it.But why in the world would anyone want to up the voltage on a 450 watt card?

 

[OCGuy]

Well, I prefer a card that doesn't require OC. In fact, since when OC is an requirement? What happens to the plug and play idea?

Not only overclocking, but overvolting seems to be the new goal-post for reviewing cards, as of last week.

We will see if the reviewers stay honest and over-volt Kepler and SI out of the box on launch day, because this was never standard before.