Taken down because of insults and the FACT that people can't f_cking read.

[Lithium381]

I responded with some ideas about the wealthiest people before, but it may also apply to corporations:





You have to do something to stop the hoarding.

For corporations, instead of just taxing "property" at 10%, you can tax total assets including cash. So it is in their best interest to turn that cash into something useful or it just erodes.

how convenient for the government. . . .create a terrible economic environment then punish those who don't spend on terrible investments. . . maybe if the government stopped baseline budgeting and the notion of "spend it this year or you will get less next year" budgeting . . . ..

 

[Jhhnn]

lol @ "saving money is part of the problem" seriously? Maybe it's not part of the problem, maybe your understanding of how things work is the problem. Saving is a good thing, it's called thinking about the fucking future.

There's a difference between saving & hoarding. There's also a difference between uncertainty that's driven by economics and that driven by politics.

It's also important to remember that current situations are based on what's come before. Bubble aftermaths are always periods of low demand because of deleveraging, and the "Ownership Society" was the biggest credit bubble ever devised. So when we combine that with a tax system that enables & encourages hoarding by the financial elite & fiscal hostage taking by Repubs, we arrive at the situation of today.

If Repubs had been successful with their contrived debt ceiling fracas, there wouldn't be any uncertainty- there'd be rightful certainty that things would be getting much worse much faster, and people would act accordingly.

Debt deflation spirals advantage the wealthy, which is the goal & the whole point of Repub policy. It's the Party of the Rich, for the Rich, and by the Rich, so don't be surprised when they advantage themselves all they can. The more they hoard, the more valuable each dollar in that hoard becomes.

Well, they do have legions of delusional hangers-on... willing to accept emotionally appealing lies as gospel.

 

[dank69]

Increased demand comes generally from increased wages from a very large segment of the population. You're being "one company" specific when I'm more or less talking about all companies as a group.

An individual company doing something (hording cash, offshoring, etc) does little....but it's when they are are doing it, they are literally cutting their very customers off and don't even realize it. It's all about the "quick bang for the buck" with very little thought about where are your future customers and revenue going to come from.

 

[EagleKeeper]

What is stopping those that want to be becoming the Party of the rich.

Opportunities exist; most are just to comfortable to take chances to reach for the brass ring.

 

[dank69]

What is stopping those that want to be becoming the Party of the rich.

Opportunities exist; most are just to comfortable to take chances to reach for the brass ring.

What's stopping you?

 

[soulcougher73]

Savings are actually way up thanks to Obama. Americans and their families are saving as much as they can to weather the obama nightmare. Americans are holding onto their wallet, weathering this nightmare that will soon be over.

So savings are good, but a nightmare?

Conflicted much?

 

[soulcougher73]

Sale of goods is not very good, demand is low and people are limiting their purchases to necessities. Then even all the big corps are having lower than forecast earnings. Prices keep going up. Food is high, gas is high and prices on everything keeps increasing. I think it is to the point that there is no profit from putting it in a bank account or even in purchasing govt backed bonds. They dont even trust govt bonds anymore.

That is because tricke down does not work. Pay your people a decent salary and they will create the demand and not just purchase the necessities of which to just stay alive.

 

[Atreus21]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/companies-sitting-more-cash-ever-182240351.html

Seems like the fiscal cliff is the biggest blame. Seems also that investor are getting riled up over the fact that so much cash is being built up and not invested or given back in dividends.

If business isn't going to give wages, hire people and invest, how do they expect growth in their business?

It's a vicious cycle.

A very good argument against stimulus.

And when articles like this say things like, "sitting on hoards of cash", what do they mean? Where does that money physically reside? In mattresses?

 

[HomerJS]

The simple truth is that the rich aren't job creators, they're wealth consumers. The people who create jobs are the people who create demand. Trickle down hasn't ever worked, trickle up always does.

I've been saying that also for some time. It falls on deaf ears.

You can be the best widget maker in the country, if noone is buying them you are not going to hire workers. It doesn't matter if you tax rate goes from 25 to 20%

 

[K1052]

Mostly the election combined with the 'fiscal cliff' though many companies increased their cash cushions after the 2008 crisis when even healthy corps struggled to pay their bills due to short term lending vaporizing, which also caused them to become much more risk averse and expand slowly if at all. There also isn't a lot out there promising the ROIs of the good old 2000s...though there probably won't be again anytime soon. Even the banks have to accept middling returns these days with their I-bank arms investing in less risky but less potentially profitable ventures.A combination of factors.

Eventually the shareholders are going to make them do something with the money as their stock prices languish. What good is sitting on billions that you're aren't using for anything and not giving the shareholders value for their investment.

 

[spidey07]

Mostly the election combined with the 'fiscal cliff' though many companies increased their cash cushions after the 2008 crisis when even healthy corps struggled to pay their bills due to short term lending vaporizing, which also caused them to become much more risk averse and expand slowly if at all. There also isn't a lot out there promising the ROIs of the good old 2000s...though there probably won't be again anytime soon. Even the banks have to accept middling returns these days with their I-bank arms investing in less risky but less potentially profitable ventures.A combination of factors.

Eventually the shareholders are going to make them do something with the money as their stock prices languish. What good is sitting on billions that you're aren't using for anything and not giving the shareholders value for their investment.

Like I said, and many CEOs and business leaders have been saying for a while now. They are trying to weather the Obama economic nightmare. Once Romney is elected watch our economy explode.

 

[K1052]

Like I said, and many CEOs and business leaders have been saying for a while now. They are trying to weather the Obama economic nightmare. Once Romney is elected watch our economy explode.

The fiscal cliff came from the sequester required by the republicans in the debt deal when they took the debt ceiling hostage combined with nearly concurrent sunset of the extended Bush tax cuts. Without any assurance that these issues will be resolved in a timely manner everyone is hoarding cash assuming the worst.

ACA implementation is an issue but not the coming of the apocalypse that conservatives are claiming and is a relatively minor issue in this.

 

[Double Trouble]

I work fairly high up in finance in a fortune 100 company, so I frequently get to chat with the people who make the strategic and capital allocation decisions. The prevailing sentiment is that the combination of gridlock and the "fiscal cliff" has many of them very nervous. Obamacare definitely plays a big part in it as well, many of the finance honchos are telling me they're expecting a major hit which could lead them to drop coverage where possible.

I don't buy into the "Obama boogeyman" theory that the companies are hoarding cash because of Obama, they are hoarding cash because of a relative lack of projects with promising ROI and a lot of economic uncertainty. They don't really care who is the president, other than they want to know what the rules of the game are and plan accordingly.

 

[spidey07]

I work fairly high up in finance in a fortune 100 company, so I frequently get to chat with the people who make the strategic and capital allocation decisions. The prevailing sentiment is that the combination of gridlock and the "fiscal cliff" has many of them very nervous. Obamacare definitely plays a big part in it as well, many of the finance honchos are telling me they're expecting a major hit which could lead them to drop coverage where possible.

I don't buy into the "Obama boogeyman" theory that the companies are hoarding cash because of Obama, they are hoarding cash because of a relative lack of projects with promising ROI and a lot of economic uncertainty. They don't really care who is the president, other than they want to know what the rules of the game are and plan accordingly.

And who created all this uncertainty and rising cost?

NOBAMA! And he's doing it on purpose and willfully.

 

[bfdd]

There's a difference between saving & hoarding. There's also a difference between uncertainty that's driven by economics and that driven by politics.

It's also important to remember that current situations are based on what's come before. Bubble aftermaths are always periods of low demand because of deleveraging, and the "Ownership Society" was the biggest credit bubble ever devised. So when we combine that with a tax system that enables & encourages hoarding by the financial elite & fiscal hostage taking by Repubs, we arrive at the situation of today.

If Repubs had been successful with their contrived debt ceiling fracas, there wouldn't be any uncertainty- there'd be rightful certainty that things would be getting much worse much faster, and people would act accordingly.

Debt deflation spirals advantage the wealthy, which is the goal & the whole point of Repub policy. It's the Party of the Rich, for the Rich, and by the Rich, so don't be surprised when they advantage themselves all they can. The more they hoard, the more valuable each dollar in that hoard becomes.

Well, they do have legions of delusional hangers-on... willing to accept emotionally appealing lies as gospel.

You say they are hoarding I say they are saving as there is nothing worth investing in. I think you're wrong, they just aren't doing what you would like so you spin it into something else. Jealousy is a bitch.

 

[Double Trouble]

Blaming people or companies for hoarding or saving cash is asinine. People and companies are not obligated to waste their money to satisfy someones agenda, they invest it or use the way they think brings them to most benefit. In the face of uncertainty, saving money and having a lot of cash is the best strategy.

 

[zephyrprime]

A lot of people say this hoarding is due to uncertainty. This is absolute rubbish. The reason the money hoarding is going on is because there is nothing viable to invest that money in to grow the business. The economy is mediocre and getting worse because of the idiots over in Europe and businesses are certain of this. It's just like how the Japanese companies in japan can be certain that the next year is going to be more just treading water. They are certain of this because the last 20 years were just treading water.

 

[QuantumPion]

The evil baby boomers have around a trillion dollars locked up in their 401k's, JUST HOARDING IT AND NOT SPENDING IT ALL. We should confiscate it and use it for stimulus because everyone knows government spending is what drives economic growth.

 

[Engineer]

........

 

[Darwin333]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/companies-sitting-more-cash-ever-182240351.html

Seems like the fiscal cliff is the biggest blame. Seems also that investor are getting riled up over the fact that so much cash is being built up and not invested or given back in dividends.

If business isn't going to give wages, hire people and invest, how do they expect growth in their business?

It's a vicious cycle.

I think this is an indication that they do not expect growth anytime soon in which case a large amount of reserve capital can mean the difference between weathering the storm or not.

 

[drebo]

Nobody said it's illegal but it's part of the problem, especially those companies sucking on government stimulus and banking it. Until the US middle class moves forward with wage increases, the US is doomed to fall and this is not helping one darn bit.

That's why I've said all along that "stimulus" shouldn't have been given to businesses, but rather to as rebates to tax payers (i.e. those who actually pay taxes.)

 

[QuantumPion]

LOL. Yes, we can take the average of just over $13,000 of the baby boomers and do great things with it.

I never said anything about average. Al Gore called for confiscating a flat 10% out of everyone's 401k to balance the budget (back in 2000). Today you'd have to bump that up to around 100% to balance the budget but whatever, what's a few trillion here and there.

That's not what this is about and you know it.

That is exactly what this is about - using greed, envy, and class warfare to strangle whatever tax revenue you can wherever you can. What's the difference between people hoarding their savings and corporations hoarding their capital?

 

[Engineer]

........

 

[QuantumPion]

I never said anything about taxing so if you're pointing toward me, the finger is in the wrong direction. The "average" is the 1 trillion you mentioned divided by 76,000,000 baby boomers + a LOL for effect.

Ya, sure buddy. How are you planning on "getting cash flowing into the economy" from the evil hoarding corporations without confiscating it through taxation?

A certain amount of saving is good. When it gets to the "hording" level, we get what we have now and that's a shitty economy. Again, it's a vicious cycle....what's going to break that?

Ok genius what exactly is the amount of saving is officially bad and hoarding? We need an exact figure here since you are the one advocating taxes on the "bad" savings but not the "good" savings.

To me, it's getting cash flowing into the economy which will bring benefits to everyone, both business and individuals alike. If both business and individuals are hording cash, there is only one entity left to get things moving and that the evul-gubment and with enough people screaming, they'll do things not so good because they like the voting public to think that they are happy.

When companies go out of business because you took away their savings they needed to remain open during bad economic times, and all of the employees of those companies lose their jobs, that will not be benefiting everyone.

 

[Engineer]

........