Taken down because of insults and the FACT that people can't f_cking read.

[dank69]

Listen...for the last time, I never said a fucking thing about using taxes to break this cycle. Get that through your thick fucking head. I don't have an answer to get things flowing and I certainly never said taxes were the answer. Damn, some people are fucking hard headed.....

Yes, yes they are. I especially like this example because now you know what it is like to argue with a fucking conservative.

 

[Darwin333]

Yes, yes they are. I especially like this example because now you know what it is like to argue with a fucking conservative.

How does raising their taxes slightly do anything but bring the deficit down a few percent? They are still going to "horde" the rest if they don't think they have a profitable place to invest it. Its not like they are going to decide to invest it in something they previously thought a bad idea because uncle sam is going to take a few more percent.

 

[yllus]

A lot of people say this hoarding is due to uncertainty. This is absolute rubbish. The reason the money hoarding is going on is because there is nothing viable to invest that money in to grow the business. The economy is mediocre and getting worse because of the idiots over in Europe and businesses are certain of this. It's just like how the Japanese companies in japan can be certain that the next year is going to be more just treading water. They are certain of this because the last 20 years were just treading water.

Pretty much. There are a few companies wise enough and with a balance sheet healthy enough that they can take risks right now (moving forward while everyone else is standing still opens a big gap), but most companies are run in a very mediocre fashion. That leads to those corps sitting on their cash until consumers are sending clear signals that they're looking to spend once again.

So, due to the mediocrity and lack of imagination of the average CEO, corporate board and company, we wait.

 

[dank69]

How does raising their taxes slightly do anything but bring the deficit down a few percent? They are still going to "horde" the rest if they don't think they have a profitable place to invest it. Its not like they are going to decide to invest it in something they previously thought a bad idea because uncle sam is going to take a few more percent.

Clarified for you:

... Damn, some people are fucking hard headed.....

Yes, yes they are. ...

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Clarified for you:

There is a lot of uncertainty in the economy that will be settled in the next several years. Until then no one is sure how things will shake out and in those times cash is built up as a reserve. To increase taxes doesn't remedy that in any way. Companies will cut expenses to compensate, which means outsource and cut workforces.

Somehow I fail to see the upside in this scenario.

 

[Engineer]

........

 

[yllus]

There is a lot of uncertainty in the economy that will be settled in the next several years. Until then no one is sure how things will shake out and in those times cash is built up as a reserve. To increase taxes doesn't remedy that in any way. Companies will cut expenses to compensate, which means outsource and cut workforces.

Somehow I fail to see the upside in this scenario.

I disagree to a certain extent. A fair amount of the trepidation that consumers and corporations are feeling is due to the shaky fiscal state of the American government. If they felt that it was on more solid footing by going back to Clinton era taxation levels, due to the rise in confidence that would result that would be an overall win despite the hike in tax rates.

It seems clear that Americans are not willing to have their services cut - including the expanded Medicare program. A tax hike is the only other option to pursue.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/companies-sitting-more-cash-ever-182240351.html

Seems like the fiscal cliff is the biggest blame. Seems also that investor are getting riled up over the fact that so much cash is being built up and not invested or given back in dividends.

If business isn't going to give wages, hire people and invest, how do they expect growth in their business?

It's a vicious cycle.

For someone whose handle is engineer, you would expect a little more intelligence? Maybe the state of the economy isn't one where companies want to invest in. If they see opportunities for growth wouldn't they have already invested? Who doesn't want to turn money into more money?

The fact is who are YOU to say they need to invest? Maybe they can invest in a lot of new facilities and R&D projects and new products. They create products with no demand and perform research in fields no one cares about. What do you get in the end? Wasted effort. Ever heard of non value added work? I think that's what you're suggesting.

 

[Engineer]

For someone whose handle is engineer, you would expect a little more intelligence? Maybe the state of the economy isn't one where companies want to invest in. If they see opportunities for growth wouldn't they have already invested? Who doesn't want to turn money into more money?

The fact is who are YOU to say they need to invest? Maybe they can invest in a lot of new facilities and R&D projects and new products. They create products with no demand and perform research in fields no one cares about. What do you get in the end? Wasted effort. Ever heard of non value added work? I think that's what you're suggesting.

Aside from your insults that aren't welcome, I'm suggesting that if something doesn't break the cycle of wages in this country for the middle class folks, the US economy is going down the shitter.

I'm through with this. We reap what we sew and we have been sewing seeds of shit for decades.

/thread

As for your personal comments toward me, I'm not an economist so you can shove the holier than thou comments up your backside. I gave an opinion on what it will take to break the vicious cycle and I have every right to give that opinion. Who the fuck are you to tell me that I can't say that they should not invest? What a bunch of fucking assholes around here. You mother fuckers can sit around and cry about the 47% not paying incomes taxes and welfare rising all the fuck you want. It's because of shit like the OP and sending jobs out that's doing and we are getting exactly what we, all of us, deserve.

+1 for another asshole going on the ignore list.

/thread #2

 

[Fern]

A lot of people say this hoarding is due to uncertainty. This is absolute rubbish. The reason the money hoarding is going on is because there is nothing viable to invest that money in to grow the business.
-snip-

And why is there nothing viable to invest in?

It just circles back to "uncertainty".

The outlook for the economy is uncertain. That means uncertainty in job growth and economic growth, meaning uncertainty or doubts about demand.

Regulatory uncertainty, whether it be the costs under Obamacare or the possibility of cap-n-trade, results in the same thing. If we're spending more on those there's less remaining for demand for other products. You're right back to uncertainty regarding demand.

Problems in Europe mean more uncertainty. Will credit continue to be tight? Will it get tighter? US businesses wonder how will that affect their overseas suppliers and demand. If you place an order with an overseas supplier how do they finance it? Will they require the US business to pay up front so the foreign supplier can finance it that way? Do they really want to do that? What if they can't perform or go bankrupt, how do sue to get your money back? A lawsuit in a foreign country? That's sounds 'fun'.

Uncertainty = less demand = less viable investment opportunities.

I don't understand this opposition to the idea of "uncertainty". There are plenty of surveys by universities asking questions of CEOs/ and CFOs. The issue of uncertainty is manifold and undeniable. Maybe people don't know what "uncertainty" means or understand it's effects?

Fern

 

[Engineer]

Would a mod kindly lock this mother fvcker up?

 

[SagaLore]

They should just pool all that money and build a city on mars. :O