• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

T3i + Sigma 17-70?

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
DLeRium said:
Honestly, just stick with the kit lens IMO and get a flash. That's been 10x as useful for me than having f/2.8 capabilities.

There honestly aren't that many applications for f/2.8. You can still get nice bokeh shooting f/4 which I shot for my last vacation. And if you do group shots, f/2.8 risks blurring other people.

If you want a fast lens, just grab the 50mm/1.8 and learn from there. I personally have a f/2.8 lineup (11-16 and 17-55), and hope to expand that to telephoto someday....

BTW, regarding the kit lens, it's just as sharp as top notch lenses like the Tammy 17-50, or the $1100 Canon 17-55 f/2.8 lens. The Sigma doesn't even come close at all. The Canon kit lens is top notch and if you don't desperately need low light capabilities, I suggest you learn from there. I could've shot my friend's wedding with my kit lens if I wanted. Most of my 17-55 shooting was done with flash, and when I didn't use flash, it was with the 70-200.
Click to expand...

1. It's very hard to use flash for dancing shots, and there are certainly applications for apertures below 2.8. I regularly shoot at 1.2

2. The kit lens is a decent lens, especially for the price, but it's not all that great optically. Not to mention it's 4x slower than a 2.8 lens at 50mm.

3. If you're not considering any of the Sony/Nikon options, another option to consider a used 1D Mark II. It's a 2004-era pro sports DSLR, and gets you a lot of pro features, like a large viewfinder, reduced shutter lag, 8.5 FPS, a larger sensor (not always a good thing as it locks you out of hot lenses like the 17-50), battery life, build, 100% coverage, weathersealing, dual card slots, top-quality AF system, and a lot more. That said, it's old, with a small screen, limited max-ISO, 'only' 8 megapixels, and unforgiving pro controls. They go for ~600 used. If you're only concerned about shooting pictures, and not concerned at the loss of movie mode/live-view/ease of use, then it's a compelling option.
 
Last edited:
Sp12 said:
1. It's very hard to use flash for dancing shots, and there are certainly applications for apertures below 2.8. I regularly shoot at 1.2

2. The kit lens is a decent lens, especially for the price, but it's not all that great optically. Not to mention it's 4x slower than a 2.8 lens at 50mm.

3. If you're not considering any of the Sony/Nikon options, another option to consider a used 1D Mark II. It's a 2004-era pro sports DSLR, and gets you a lot of pro features, like a large viewfinder, reduced shutter lag, 8.5 FPS, a larger sensor (not always a good thing as it locks you out of hot lenses like the 17-50), battery life, build, 100% coverage, weathersealing, dual card slots, top-quality AF system, and a lot more. That said, it's old, with a small screen, limited max-ISO, 'only' 8 megapixels, and unforgiving pro controls. They go for ~600 used. If you're only concerned about shooting pictures, and not concerned at the loss of movie mode/live-view/ease of use, then it's a compelling option.
Click to expand...

In the link for #2, I am confused. The 50mm from the Sigma looks worse to me... 😵

I doubt I'll get a 1D Mark II. I'll probably stick with the T2i area.
 
If your wanting to shoot low light venues then no f/2.8 lens is going to be all that great. Primes would be a better alternative for this situation. Your only real option that doesnt break the bank is to up the iso and and try to clean up the noise in post processing. The t2i deals with noise fairly well at high iso but you would still do well to get a program that deals with noise, such as noise ninja, portrature, denoise etc etc. But these arent neccesary just nice, you could always just stick with canons dpp (picture editing software). Something that really did help me out was buying a $30 tripod. I bought it used and it defineately isnt top quality, after I tighten the ball head to the tripod there is always a slight movement before it sets but it doesnt bother me. What im saying is if you can find a cheap tripod and its allowed to be used in your dance venues then buy it and that will really help you when shooting low light. Your best bet is always to buy the best lenses you can. With that being said i think for you i would still recommend the 17-70os (or just stick with the kit lens). Its good bang for the buck and I know that im always shooting at 70mm which obviously the 17-50 does not have. Its a great range for just walking around and taking pictures, I dont think the 17-50 would be that good in that department, at least not for me. another consideration which I suggested in my first post was that the 17-70 would pair really well with the tokina 11-16 (which is a phenomenal lens) and a 70-200 of your choice. Buy the 17-70 and see at what end of the spectrum you like to shoot at and then put some money into the next lens purchase. For your first lens just pick up the 17-70. I truly doubt that this lens will really get you the pictures you want from the dance recitals unless you can be right up there in their face (of course the 17-50 would be even worse as you would need to be even closer)but the 17-70 would be a good everyday lens. For the dances Im guessing you will need something in the 200mm range at least.
 
Any suggestions on what to look for specifically if looking at getting a camera/lens on craigslist? Computers are usually pretty easy to figure out. You run it, do some diagnostic tests (memtest) and blah. Cameras... idk?
 
Sp12 said:
1. It's very hard to use flash for dancing shots, and there are certainly applications for apertures below 2.8. I regularly shoot at 1.2

2. The kit lens is a decent lens, especially for the price, but it's not all that great optically. Not to mention it's 4x slower than a 2.8 lens at 50mm.

3. If you're not considering any of the Sony/Nikon options, another option to consider a used 1D Mark II. It's a 2004-era pro sports DSLR, and gets you a lot of pro features, like a large viewfinder, reduced shutter lag, 8.5 FPS, a larger sensor (not always a good thing as it locks you out of hot lenses like the 17-50), battery life, build, 100% coverage, weathersealing, dual card slots, top-quality AF system, and a lot more. That said, it's old, with a small screen, limited max-ISO, 'only' 8 megapixels, and unforgiving pro controls. They go for ~600 used. If you're only concerned about shooting pictures, and not concerned at the loss of movie mode/live-view/ease of use, then it's a compelling option.
Click to expand...

1) You may be right. Flash isn't for everything, but for a lot of indoor photos like if you're having dinner at a relative's? Flash is awesome.

2) I disagree. I've also done shots of the 17-55mm vs 18-55mm. Both are highly regarded lenses on POTM and from a blind test you couldn't tell which one is sharper. Plus all that talk about pop contrast... ehh. I find that to be placebo also. The kit lens is amazing.

mtf.gif


mtf.gif


The $100 18-55 is easily as sharp as the $1000 17-55mm lens.

mtf.png


the Sigma 17-70 is tested on a 10MP sensor and even then it fares worse than the other 2 lenses on a 15MP APS-C sensor.

3) I'd personally recommend just jumping onto the 5D ship first. The 1D brings a lot but its a bulky camera and some of the features are overkill. I find the 5D or 5D2 to be a perfectly good camera for people to start shooting and you could do very well. My friends pushed me to get the 5D2 instead of the T1i, but I got the T1i. Now that I have my 7D, I'm itching to trade my T1i for a FF camera. But probably not 1D series for me.
 
Last edited:
DLeRium said:
1) You may be right. Flash isn't for everything, but for a lot of indoor photos like if you're having dinner at a relative's? Flash is awesome.

2) I disagree. I've also done shots of the 17-55mm vs 18-55mm. Both are highly regarded lenses on POTM and from a blind test you couldn't tell which one is sharper. Plus all that talk about pop contrast... ehh. I find that to be placebo also. The kit lens is amazing.



The $100 18-55 is easily as sharp as the $1000 17-55mm lens.



the Sigma 17-70 is tested on a 10MP sensor and even then it fares worse than the other 2 lenses on a 15MP APS-C sensor.

3) I'd personally recommend just jumping onto the 5D ship first. The 1D brings a lot but its a bulky camera and some of the features are overkill. I find the 5D or 5D2 to be a perfectly good camera for people to start shooting and you could do very well. My friends pushed me to get the 5D2 instead of the T1i, but I got the T1i. Now that I have my 7D, I'm itching to trade my T1i for a FF camera. But probably not 1D series for me.
Click to expand...


I don't have $2000+ to spend on a body.... I don't even have more than probably $600. D:
 
So... the 17-50 2.8 is $650+ where as the 17-70 is $450...

Why would I get the 17-50 when I am going to be shooting photos of dancers mostly? The only reason I could think is if it could capture so much light in so little time that it would dramatically lower blur over similar exposure periods as the 17-70... but I am doubtful---.
 
TridenT said:
So... the 17-50 2.8 is $650+ where as the 17-70 is $450...

Why would I get the 17-50 when I am going to be shooting photos of dancers mostly? The only reason I could think is if it could capture so much light in so little time that it would dramatically lower blur over similar exposure periods as the 17-70... but I am doubtful---.
Click to expand...

are there dancers going to be indoors? you're going to be better off taking pictures of dancers from 50mm @ f/2.8 than 70mm @ f/4.0. did the price of the 17-50mm f/2.8 from either tamron or sigma go up that high? street value on those are around 350-450 on CL.

you could consider a 17-85mm f/4-5.6.
 
AkumaX said:
are there dancers going to be indoors? you're going to be better off taking pictures of dancers from 50mm @ f/2.8 than 70mm @ f/4.0. did the price of the 17-50mm f/2.8 from either tamron or sigma go up that high? street value on those are around 350-450 on CL.

you could consider a 17-85mm f/4-5.6.
Click to expand...

The dancers will be indoors. Usually low light conditions.

Amazon lists it for $650+ for 17-50. $465 for 17-70
 
TridenT said:
The dancers will be indoors. Usually low light conditions.

Amazon lists it for $650+ for 17-50. $465 for 17-70
Click to expand...

Do you have to get it from Amazon? That's REALLY pricy. Are the dancers going to be far? You might want to consider a 85mm f/1.8 instead.
 
AkumaX said:
Do you have to get it from Amazon? That's REALLY pricy. Are the dancers going to be far? You might want to consider a 85mm f/1.8 instead.
Click to expand...

Depends on the shots really. It can be far, really close, all in between.

I don't know of another place that offers it much cheaper for canon cameras...
 
Last edited:
DLeRium said:
1) You may be right. Flash isn't for everything, but for a lot of indoor photos like if you're having dinner at a relative's? Flash is awesome.
Click to expand...

Missed this 😛 Anyhow, for indoor dancing shots most of the time strobes aren't allowed, and when they are you're hard pressed to get a decent looking bounce.

2) I disagree. I've also done shots of the 17-55mm vs 18-55mm. Both are highly regarded lenses on POTM and from a blind test you couldn't tell which one is sharper. Plus all that talk about pop contrast... ehh. I find that to be placebo also. The kit lens is amazing.
Click to expand...
I've used both (extensively), and to be honest the 18-55 is certainly nice (especially at the price point) it's not as sharp, colorful, contrasty, fast focusing, or constant-apertured as the 17-55. I don't think the 17-55 is worth basically 6-8x the 18-55, but it's definitely a nicer lens. Whether it's sharp/fast/focusable enough for your needs is another story. I personally think sharpness is overated anyway, but that's me.
the Sigma 17-70 is tested on a 10MP sensor and even then it fares worse than the other 2 lenses on a 15MP APS-C sensor.
Click to expand...
That's actually one of the big reasons it does so poorly. Maximal MTF (by the way, those charts are pretty lame. I hate photozone's testing methodology) is basically entirely dependent on the resolution of the sensor. You can compare the same lens across multiple bodies over at the digital picture to confirm this if you want. My favorite is the Zeiss 100 Makro on the 5DII vs. on the 30D. On the 30D it looks no better than the kit lens, while on the 5DII it smashes the 24-105L (and outresolves the 21MP sensor).

3) I'd personally recommend just jumping onto the 5D ship first. The 1D brings a lot but its a bulky camera and some of the features are overkill. I find the 5D or 5D2 to be a perfectly good camera for people to start shooting and you could do very well. My friends pushed me to get the 5D2 instead of the T1i, but I got the T1i. Now that I have my 7D, I'm itching to trade my T1i for a FF camera. But probably not 1D series for me.
Click to expand...
But look at what he's asked for -- indoor dance. The autofocus and frame rate (not to mention reach) of a 1D are certainly more valuable than the DoF/ISO flexibility of a full-frame. Though really a T2i is probably the more-user friendly option I would go for. The 1DII will be cheaper and better suited to the task, but it is large and complex.
 
Check this out: http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-New-Tamro...era_Lenses&hash=item4aaad360c1#ht_2520wt_1141

(no I don't have any ties with this seller, except I bought the Nikon version of this lens from them last week). This is the non-VC version which is actually rated sharper than the newer VC version. On top of that, it's made in Japan (a lot of the newer ones are made in Taiwan/China).

I'm very satisfied with my new Tamron 17-50 f/2.8. I have a Nikkor 35mm f/1.8 that I'm actually selling because this Tamron is a better lens overall.
 
CptObvious said:
Check this out: http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-New-Tamro...era_Lenses&hash=item4aaad360c1#ht_2520wt_1141

(no I don't have any ties with this seller, except I bought the Nikon version of this lens from them last week). This is the non-VC version which is actually rated sharper than the newer VC version. On top of that, it's made in Japan (a lot of the newer ones are made in Taiwan/China).

I'm very satisfied with my new Tamron 17-50 f/2.8. I have a Nikkor 35mm f/1.8 that I'm actually selling because this Tamron is a better lens overall.
Click to expand...

Wow, thanks a lot "Captain Obvious" (lol!), now I'm debating on selling my Canon 17-85mm IS f/4-5.6.... will I miss the IS? hahahah
 
IMO it's not a big problem at these focal lengths, especially at the short end. At 50mm just make sure your shutter is fast enough, around 1/60s
 
Not to mention the constant f/2.8 the Tamron has over the Canon. Get the Tamron and don't look back. You won't regret it. If you find yourself being displeased with the images you're probably doing something wrong or trying to shoot in almost total darkness.

Check out these images on POTN.

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=209580

I believe I've been through all 197 pages at least twice. lol
 
DLeRium said:
2) I disagree. I've also done shots of the 17-55mm vs 18-55mm. Both are highly regarded lenses on POTM and from a blind test you couldn't tell which one is sharper. Plus all that talk about pop contrast... ehh. I find that to be placebo also. The kit lens is amazing.
Click to expand...

what is POTM?
Priestest of the Moon? (DOTA hero)
 
TridenT said:
Could be a problem in, you know, low light...
Click to expand...
There's ways around that. Bump up the ISO, use a tripod, and/or use flash. If you're shooting dancers and want to freeze motion, VC/VR isn't going to help you as your shutter speed will probably be higher than 1/60.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Back
Top