System Can't Boot After Partitioning In Prep for Linux Install

[Zadillo]

Hi all,

I have a home-built computer with an MSI K8T Neo2 FISR motherboard and an Athlon 64 3400+.

I have three hard drives in this system, a DVD burner and a DVD/CD combo drive.

I had used PartitionMagic to create some partitions to prepare for doing a Linux install. I used PartitionMagic's option designed for installing a new OS, including the option to do the install immediately (which I think it said sets the new partition as "active"). I created the main Linux partition as a 7 gig partition on my 120 gig HD, and I created a swap partition on my 80GB HD, which also contains my Windows OS.

After the system rebooted, PartitionMagic went to work creating the partitions, and then moving things for the swap portion (which I set to be at the beginning of my HD, so I think it made it take a while).

However, after doing this, even with the Fedora DVD in my DVD drive, it just gives a generic error saying it can't load the operating system.

I have been trying to get into my BIOS using either F11 (the option the manual says to use to just select the boot device) and using DEL (the option to actually enter the BIOS), but it doesn't work. I have a USB keyboard, and I notice that it seems like the keyboard isn't getting power except for a few seconds during bootup (it's one of those saitek eclipse gaming keyboards with the keys that light up).

I have been able to get into the BIOS before, but this is a new problem. It just doesn't seem to recognize when I press or hold down F11 or DEL, and just keeps going back to that generic error saying it can't load the OS.

I'm assuming this is because it's stuck in this mode of trying to boot from the newly prepared Linux partition. At this point, I'm kind of stuck though, since I can't seem to force it to boot from the Linux DVD (or even my Windows install CD).

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions on what I can do? It seems to be pretty much completely stuck at this point, and I've exhausted the various ideas I have. I'm also a bit baffled about not being able to even get into the BIOS (and this seeming problem where the keyboard doesn't seem to be getting power except for a few brief seconds during the bootup).

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

If I've left out any important details, please let me know. I'm willing to try anything at this point.

 

[Fern]

Yup, I'd say you need to get into BIOS and change boot sequence to the Optical drive.

I've got the same saitek keyboard. Although its great for gaming at night, I have the same problem getiing into BIOS with it. Sorry to say I haven't bothered to figure it out yet. I have a regular old keyboard I put on there when doing OS installs etc. See if you can use another KB to get things going.

EDIT: BTW, this prob happened to me again this weekend. Even with a dongle (USB > PS2) it still wouldn't work.

Fern

 

[Zadillo]

Thanks. Yeah, I had actually tried the same thing, using a USB to PS/2 dongle (I did think it was interesting that the saitek lit up when I plugged it in that way). No luck.

Thanks for the confirmation though, I wasn't sure if it would be a problem or not (I've had other USB keyboards, even a logitech wireless usb keyboard, that still worked fine for getting to BIOS, etc.).

I will try and borrow a cheap old PS/2 keyboard or something for this purpose, or just buy one for $5. Hopefully that will do the trick.

 

[Zadillo]

Hi all,

I managed to borrow a PS/2 keyboard, and this allowed me to get into the BIOS to get it properly set to boot from the CD/DVD drive.

I was able to run the Fedora Core Linux 4 installer, and installed it onto the Linux partition I had created for this purpose. I did also set it up for multiboot, and specified the other hard drive which has Windows XP on it.

Now my system does boot into Linux, but it doesn't even seem to give the option of choosing which OS to boot from.

When I do get into Linux, it is only showing the Linux "file system", the partition which has Linux on it. It doesn't show any of the other hard drives or partitions in the system. I will admit I'm completely new to Linux so I'm not sure if this is normal or not. I am thinking that the partitions should still be there (when I ran the Linux installer it did recognize the other partitions..... they are NTFS though, which I think I read it might not recognize properly or something).

Anyway, at this point, I'm still stuck in trying to get it so I can also boot back into Windows, or even get Linux to recognize the other partitions/drives on the system.

Is there anything else I can try?

-Zadillo

 

[xstarseedx]

If worst comes to worst you can use your windows xp cd to enter recovery mode and reset the mbr. I believe the command is called Fixmbr. On the linux side of things, When you're doing the Linux install, you should make sure that you specify where you're installing. I believe FC4 uses LVM partitions for it's automatic installation.

The other thing I would suggest is to keep all of your linux partitions on the same hard drive. Or at least keep the Swap on the same hd as the / partition.

Hope that helps.

 

[Zadillo]

Thanks. When I installed Linux I did specify the partition I created to install Linux on. I think it used ext3 though.

Actually, I had created the swap partition on another HD (I think this was because there was something in Partition Magic that mentioned better performance if the swap partition was on another HD).

I guess my bigger question is still why the only thing that shows up in Linux itself is the partition I created for it, but not the other drives (someone told me it should support NTFS, so I'm not sure if that's the problem). As far as I can tell the HD's are still there and recognized.

 

[xstarseedx]

FC4 does support NTFS. Do you get a Graphical Interface at all? Or is it just text? I would suggest doing a clean install of FC4 and using the automatic installation. I've been using FC since FC1 and I've found it can be picky unless it's done right. I've just started using the Automatic installation and it works fine.

 

[Zadillo]

Yeah, I'm not having any trouble booting into FC4 itself. I get the full GUI (Gnome I guess), and everything seems to be working properly (although I haven't been able to figure out how to use my Linksys Wireless-G USB adaptor). It's just that when I view the Computer, it shows my two CD-ROM drives and a "File System", which seems to just be the Linux file system. It doesn't seem to show the other drives.

 

[xstarseedx]

Ahh okay. I see what's happening. The File System shows up on all Linux installations. Your other drives are more than likely mounted under /windows or /mnt/ somewhere in there. If not you can google for the commands to mount them. But it is recognizing it I believe. But addressing the not being able to boot into windows.... Which bootloader did you install? Grub or Lilo? If you just selected the default, you chose Grub.

 

[Zadillo]

Ahh, doh.... You're probably right, I will check /mnt/. I think I poked around in there but didn't see anything right away. That's probably it.

For the bootloader, I chose Grub. When I chose that it actually did give me a list with two drives (the Linux one, and another one labeled "Other") which I am pretty sure matched up with my Windows drive. I think I set it so that Linux was checked.

It occurs to me I didn't click the checkbox during the install next to the other partition. I think I might have misread it to think that the checkbox was to select what the default was. Not sure if that's a problem or not. But it was in the list at least.

When I do boot up though, it just seems to go straight into Linux, I don't get a multiboot option or anything like that.

 

[xstarseedx]

Okay, the other partition is your XP partition. And you didn't misread it, the checkbox was to select the default boot target. However, I think you're just missing the screen to multiboot. If you didn't change the default time to boot the default target, it's probably only a couple of seconds. But There should only be a small screen that says that it's booting it. It should be blue and says Press any key to select boot... or something like that. If it's not there you should google a bit to see how to edit the grub configuration so that it is there.

Also, you may not have installed it, I don't believe it's one of the default options, but there is a graphical configuration for the boot loader. It's very minimalistic but it will at least tell you if it's there. I believe it's called "system-config-bootloader"... either way, if you did install it, it shoudl be under System -> Administration or Applications -> System Tools.

 

[Zadillo]

Thanks, I'll give that a shot. I don't think I'm seeing any screen where it seems to give me an option of what to boot. It at least doesn't sound familiar, but I'll try and keep a closer eye on it. If not I'll try and edit the grub configuration.

Until I figure out how to get it to use my Wireless-G USB adaptor, is it possible for me to get that graphical bootloader config and put it on a disk on another computer and install it?

 

[xstarseedx]

I'm not sure about reinstalling the boot loader. I've never had to. Probably something that can be answered w/ google. As for your Wireless adapter, it most likely won't work under linux, your best bet is to get something called ndiswrapper. It uses Windows wireless drivers to use a wireless card. It's a sourceforge project.

As for the bootloader, you can probably still install the graphical package if you go to add/remove packages. Just search through it. I think it's under Administration tools.

Good Luck

 

[nweaver]

just edit grub.conf

change the timeout to 600 so you have pleanty of time to check. Post your grub.conf here and we can tell you if it LOOKS ok to boot windows.


I use a thumbdrive to transfer stuff to/from linux boxes without network. Not sure on Fedora, but I just mount /dev/sd(1,2,3, depending)1 /mnt/usb and then I have access. FC may automount it for you.

 

[Zadillo]

OK, thanks, I did see what the grub bootloader was (it's only shown for 2 seconds, but that's enough for me now that I know to look for it).

When I do try and use this to select the Windows partition, it seems to hang up though. At this point, I'm thinking it's because the Windows install is corrupt somehow.

I popped in my Windows XP CD to boot from and used the Recovery Mode in it, but I'm not sure exactly what to do. I tried running fixboot (which looked like a good choice from running Help to see the list of available commands), and it gave a warning about the Target Partition being G: (Windows itself is installed on the hard drive identified as C, which I think is one of the new partitions I had created for installing Linux on.

It does seem to give the impression that it thinks the boot config is corrupted or something, but I don't want to mess around with it too much. I did go ahead and run fixboot, which said it fixed something, but it doesn't seem to have made any noticeable change.

At this point, I do still have Fedora Core running (although I need to go ahead and try that driver to use the Windows driver for the linksys usb adaptor, or break down and buy a PCI card). I tried going to the /mnt/ directory, but it's empty.

For what it's worth, when I use the Knoppix 3.9 liveCD, it does mount all three hard drives, so at least they do seem to be there. It seems like I just need some help in getting things configured and fixed so I can boot Windows again, and use Linux properly.

Sorry, I imagine a lot of these questions are really stupid.... I'm trying to learn...

Thanks!

-Zadillo

 

[Zadillo]

OK, I think things might be a bit odder than I thought after all. It occurred to me that the Windows installation it is finding is on drive C:. Actually, I had been using another drive (which was identified as D) with the active Windows OS on it. This was due to a reinstall I had had to do previously.

Anyway, I loaded Knoppix again, and I noticed that it was actually not automountin everything. To explain, I have three hard drives in my computer (an 80 gig hard drive, a 120 gig hard drive and a 160 gig hard drive). It seems that it is only recognizing two of the drives, and not the third one. I think perhaps the drive I had created a new partition for swap on might be the problem. So basically, in Knoppix at least, it shows me two of my hd's, and it shows the Linux partition, but that's it. There is a whole other drive that it doesn't seem to be showing.

I'm a bit stuck now on what to do to get things running properly again.

EDIT: Just to add some more details. From the BIOS, it's the 120 gig hard drive that is IDE primary 1, and the 80 gig hard drive that is IDE slave 1.

I am pretty sure that my 160 hard drive is installed on IDE3 (another IDE connector on the motherboard). I'm actually not sure why it isn't showing up though. When I repartitioned to add Linux, I added the Linux partition to the 120 gig HD, and I put the swap on the 80 gig HD.

I'm not sure if this is related or not. Either way, the 80 gig HD is also the one that I had had Windows installed on. But it seems like it isn't recognizing that as a Windows HD any more, or something.

I just booted up with the Fedora Core Linux 4 DVD again to get to the Disk Druid partition manager, and actualoly it does show up properly there..... here is the following info:

Drive /dev/hda (114471 MB) (WD1200JB)
/dev/hda1 ntfs 106956mb
/dev/hda2 ext3 7515mb (this is where I installed Linux)

Drive /dev/hdb (78160 MB) (Maxtor 4D080H4)
/dev/hdb2 swap 1506mb
/dev/hdb1 ntfs 76654mb (I am pretty sure this is the Windows install)
When I do try and boot from this drive I get an "Error loading operating system" error).

It seems like Windows doesn't recognize this as a valid OS install or something though, as when I tried to run my Windows XP CD (which is an upgrade CD), it said it didn't detect any valid Windows installs)

Drive /dev/sda (156328 MB) ATA Maxtor 6Y160P0
/dev/sda1 ntfs 156328mb (this is the one that doesn't seem to be showing up in knoppix). I do see a message about it being detected when the system boots though. There isn't anything OS-related on this drive either way, it's just for apps and media files.

Not sure if this information helps or not.

 

[Zadillo]

Here is what grub.conf looks like. In the comments, it says "YOu do not have a /boot partition".....

default=0
timeout=5
splashimage=(hd0,1)/boot/grub/splash.xpm.gz
hiddenmenu
title Fedora Core (2.6.11-1.1369_FC4)
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.11-1.1369_FC4 ro root=LABEL=LINUX rhgb quiet
initrd /boot/initrd-2.6.11-1.1369_FC4.img
title Windows
rootnoverify (hd1,0)
chainloader +1

------------

Just from looking at this, it strikes me that this is way off, as my Windows drive is on hdb1, and it seems like this wasn't what I set up when I installed Fedora Core and Grub (I just chose the other partition that was made available).

Not quite sure what to do from here.

 

[xstarseedx]

If you want to get into your windows partition I would suggest running fixmbr from the winxp cd. However, I should warn you. If that doesn't work, you may need to reinstall the linux. As for the rest of your stuff.... well... it seems like it's all pretty messed up. Another question I have for you, since you reinstalled your windows before, when you reinstalled it, did you reinstall it onto a logical partition by chance? or are they all on primary?

Cause if it's a logical partition that could be your problem. I had an issue like that before.

 

[Zadillo]

Thanks. I was a bit nervous about running fixmbr because of the warnings it gives.

Could that be what is giving the "Error loading operating system" error when I do try to choose that hard drive (with the Windows OS installed on it)?

I am thinking that it must have gotten messed up because I chose that drive to create the SWAP partition, and I choose the option to make the swap partition at the beginning of the disk. In hindsight it seems like it was a bad idea to even mess with the drive that had Windows on it.

When I reinstalled Windows before, I believe it was on a primary partition (I didn't have any of my hard drives specifically partitioned). I just installed it onto the drive as a whole.

 

[xstarseedx]

Ya, fixmbr should bring it back to the windows bootloader. That could be what the problem is. My suggestion again would be to do either that first, or just reinstall FC4 with the automatic install. Hopefully that works.

 

[Zadillo]

OK, thanks. I'll give that a shot. It sounds like going back to the Windows bootloader with fixmbr is really what I'll need to do (and if I can get that working I'll start from scratch on doing a proper Linux install). I don't know if installing FC4 again will fix it, since I think that problem is different.

 

[xstarseedx]

Cool I hope that works. Another installation that works pretty well and is a pretty easy install is Ubuntu. It's based on Debian instead of Red Hat like FC. hope you get it to work.

 

[Zadillo]

OK, I just booted from the Windows XP Recovery CD and ran FIXMBR, then rebooted.

It gives an error saying NTLDR Missing. Press any key to restart.

Any ideas what I can do now?

 

[Zadillo]

I tried copying NTLDR to my C: drive, but no luck (I tried copying it to the F: drive as well). It still says NTLDR is missing, Press any key to restart. I did some google searching on this but the fixes don't seem to apply in my case.

At this point I'd be glad to just do a completely fresh reinstall, but it won't even let me do that. Even though the XP recovery CD seems to recognize my Windows directory when I go into the recovery mode, and lets me login to it, it says it can't find any valid Windows installations to install (I have an XP Home Upgrade CD).

I'm really not sure where to go from here......

 

[xstarseedx]

Your problem is probably that your linux partition is still your active partition. Do you happen to have a Windows 98 cd around? Or just something with fdisk? That's the only way I know of to switch the active partition, but there may be another way. Not sure. If you want you can also google for fdisk too. You might be able to download it onto a boot disk.