suggestions for budget upgrade?

[TheInternal]

Current Core Components:
======================

Motherboard: ASUS A8N32-SLI Deluxe
Processor: AMD Athlon 64 4400+
RAM: 4GB Corsair XMS DDR 400
Video: two XFX Geforce 7950 GT eXtreme 512 MB (in SLI)
Case: Antec p180b

Short version:
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I want to upgrade my SLI capable motherboard with a graphics solution that costs $100 or less and gives me a significant performance boost over my current setup. I want it to be silent or damn near close to it and able to run Starcraft 2 nicely at 1920x1200. I'll not be upgrading any other parts of the computer, just the graphics solution.

Long version:
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I really need not be spending money on my computer, but my graphics cards are starting to show their age. For $100 or less (after rebates), what would be the best graphics card option for my aging gaming computer?

I don't think I'll be incredibly CPU limited if I get a $100 graphics card solution, and since I can't afford a new system, I feel $100 would be justifiable.

I play games periodically, and would like to be able to run StarCraft 2 and World of Warcraft at max detail settings at 1920x1200 (I have other games like GTA IV and Mass Effect 2 that I'd like to run at high settings). I have a number of high wattage PSUs, so power won't be a concern.

One of my major concerns is noise. I hate noisy computers. My current system is quieter than ambient room noise at full load, with the optical, HD, and 120 mm case fans being the only moving parts.

Since I can do SLI, I'm wondering if my best option is to get two 9800 GT cards on sale.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130535

Is there a more powerful single card solution at this price point? Will the combined 1 GB of RAM from the 9800 GT cards in SLI be adequate? Would a single 9800 GT be as powerful as my two 7950 GT cards?

Thanks!

 

[toyota]

your cpu is horribly slow for newer more cpu intensive games but yes a 9800gt would be a bit faster than your 7950gt sli. 9800gt sli would be laughably wasteful on a 4400 X2 due to all the cpu overhead. a $100 video card will help in many games but is really just a band aid for your pc in many newer games while using that slow X2. really any decent card is going to be severely limited with your cpu and games like GTA 4 are not going to improve no matter what gpu that you get.

really its time to ditch that socket 939 pc if you want top play games like GTA 4. I mean your cpu does not even meet the MINIMUM requirements for that game and upgrading the cpu on that mobo is not really an option.

 

[TheInternal]

I've been hearing that newer games are getting less CPU-bound due to advances and optimization in GPU utilization. I figured I'd maybe take a 10-20 percent hit on the GPU's max performance due to my CPU, but if I get an 80 percent performance increase overall, I think it'd be worth it. You seem to imply that going to 9800 GT in SLI will not be a significant upgrade (around 2 times faster in some games or more). Am I misreading you on this?

 

[toyota]

I've been hearing that newer games are getting less CPU-bound due to advances and optimization in GPU utilization. I figured I'd maybe take a 10-20 percent hit on the GPU's max performance due to my CPU, but if I get an 80% performance increase overall, I think it'd be worth it. You seem to imply that going to 9800 GT in SLI will not be a significant upgrade (around 2 times faster in some games or more). Am I misreading you on this?

if anything many games have become more cpu bound than before. a gpu can never make up for a slow cpu and to say yours is slow for modern games would be an understatement. really its time to ditch that socket 939 pc if you want top play games like GTA 4. I mean your cpu does not even meet the MINIMUM requirements for that game and upgrading the cpu on that mobo is not really an option.

 

[TheInternal]

so, you're saying an old graphics card like the 9800 GT will give negligible performance gains to my old system? Can you at least give me a reasonable estimate as to overall performance gain, or are you suggesting that I'm already at or near being CPU bound on an old 9800 GT?

The core GPU that would eventually become the 9800 GT was released back in 2006... less than two years after I built the computer. Socket 939 was released in June 2004 and lasted through 2006, when it was phased out with the launch of AM2. It just strikes me as odd that I'd be that bottlenecked by a CPU from a similar era.

I'd never spend over $200 on a new card for this system since I do think I'd not get nearly the performance out of the card as I would an older one... but your comments have really lowered my confidence about if there'd be any real performance gain

 

[toyota]

so, you're saying an old graphics card like the 9800 GT will give negligible performance gains to my old system? Can you at least give me a reasonable estimate as to overall performance gain, or are you suggesting that I'm already at or near being CPU bound on an old 9800 GT?

yes a 9800gt would help in many games. I am also saying I would not waste the money though. you are wanting to play game like GTA 4 and your cpu is the limitation there because it doesn't even meet the requirements to play the game.

 

[TheInternal]

I can run GTIV at really low settings already

I'm more concerned about SC2, L4D2, WoW, and other online games more, frankly.

 

[TemjinGold]

I can run GTIV at really low settings already

And that's all you'll ever be able to do with that cpu. A lot of newer games really need more cores. Running high settings at 19X12 on those games is impossible on that cpu no matter the gpu upgrade you do.

 

[cusideabelincoln]

What settings do you use in GTA4? And what kind of performance do you get (in context)?

After rebates those 9800GTs look good. Your next best option would be a single HD4850. Next would just be a single 9800GT.

You should be able to nearly max out L4D2 with either setup.

 

[superccs]

Check slickdeals.et I saw a HD4870 on there for $100.

 

[Leyawiin]

I built a PC in late 2006 with an X2 5200+ and the 8800 GTX I have now. It played games released at that time decently on a 22" monitor. It wasn't until I finally built a new PC with an X4 955 that the CPU bottleneck was finally lifted off the 8800 GTX. I was shocked how much better the three year old GPU performed. My FPS is about 50 percent greater in those same old games than it was with the X2 5200+ and the 8800 GTX.

Long story short, upgrading to a better GPU setup isn't going to help much. I had a better Athlon X2 than yours and a card not tremendously faster than a single 9800 GT and it still choked it quite a lot. Your current CPU is pretty well matched with your SLI'd 7950 GT set up. I'd just leave it at that and start saving for a new mobo/CPU/RAM combo before worrying about a better video card.

 

[Rifter]

you need a new CPU, period. As stated many times above.

 

[TheInternal]

Thanks for a more concrete response, Leyawiin.

I was taken aback by how some of the replies seemed to be attacks / telling me my CPU was junk rather than answering my question I didn't expect to encounter some of the word choices on this forum.

cusidea: I'm pretty sure I had the game set to damn low resolution and lowest everything. it was still choppy. Ran... but choppy and barely playable.

Still wish I could find some numerical indicators of how much an older/slower CPU will degrade the GPU performance... if the CPU bottlenecked a 9800 GT so much that it was only 20% faster than my current setup, then it definitely would be a waste of money. if the net result of the bottleneck still resulted in a 80% improvement over my current setup in StarCraft 2, WoW, and L4D2, then it would be worth it. Alas, I can't find numbers to confirm or deny these quantities... only vague speculations without numbers or percentages. I saw some bottleneck indicators of CPUs closer to the 3GHz range, and then the choke point was maybe 2-5%.

Alas, the Google gods don't seem to like me today.

 

[toyota]

perhaps you just don't want to accept the fact the your cpu is too slow to justify buying a new video card but it is. gpu wise, what you have now is about like a 9600gt and you will never see the difference in most games by going to a 9800gt with your cpu. they don't even test cpus like yours in most cases because they too are slow to even fool with for a modern day game. it would be like asking why a video card such as the 6600gt isn't used in benchmarks anymore. bottom line is that any game that isn't very playable on your current setup is not going to be any better with a 9800gt.

 

[tweakboy]

Your gonna bottleneck with anything higher then a 4830. or Geforce 7800GT

If thats a old Athlon 64 I see on your sig then best thing is to save up and do a complete proper upgrade. Up to you. thanks

gg and gb and tc as always

 

[tweakboy]

the card you have right now is good for that system youll get all your frame rates.. Keep that no reason to upgrade to another 7900GT type card but ATI. Soo your fine my friend.

A upgarde wont do you any good youll see same performance because your CPU is holding you back and is the bottleneck my brother.

 

[toyota]

tweakboy there is an edit button so no need to double post like that.

 

[RussianSensation]

I'm more concerned about SC2, L4D2, WoW, and other online games more, frankly.

Well you just listed about some of the most CPU limited games!

http://www.techspot.com/review/305-starcraft2-performance/page13.html

A used 9800GT will still provide a boost in performance though. There is no way I would consider 2x 9800GTs when you can get a single 4870 1GB for $105: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-376-_-Product

You can upgrade your CPU+mobo if the performance is not sufficient for your needs. Just keep in mind, you will lose a lot more than 20 percent of the performance with that CPU (esp. minimum frames).

 

[cusideabelincoln]

You can see what kind of performance to expect without a CPU bottleneck, comparing 7950s to an 8800GT and 4850:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-charts-2008-q3/compare,737.html?prod[2116]=on&prod[2072]=on&prod[2091]=on&prod[2092]=on

A second 8800GT would show it's worth in your system in a few cases, but most of the games you mentioned are pretty heavy on the CPU.