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Suggestions Anyone?

F

Fides

Member
Im in my last year of CEGEP (or last year of high school for anyone not from quebec) and in interested in going into computer science. The thing is id really like to pick up a computer language to see what its like before I devote 4-5 years to it to get a degree.
Question:
What?s the most common language(s) used and what?s the best way for a beginner to start (preferably free)?
 
I'd recommend Java. Java and C++ are very similar syntactically, and Java is more and more replacing C++ in the classroom. Either way, if you learn Java, you would have a fairly easy time transitioning to C++.
 
Actually, I consider the converse to be true. If you have a C++ background, JAVA is fairly straightforward to pickup. OTOH, if you have a JAVA background, you have to learn all about memory management (allocating memory, deleting it, dealing with pointers to memory locations, etc.)

I don't consider C++ a beginner's language; however, JAVA would IMO be a safe way to go. Even easier would be something like Visual Basic.
 
Originally posted by: johnnytightlips
I'd recommend Java. Java and C++ are very similar syntactically, and Java is more and more replacing C++ in the classroom. Either way, if you learn Java, you would have a fairly easy time transitioning to C++.
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Good advice. C/C++ is what most developers use for applications and systems programming but java is popular with teachers and will give still you a good idea of what coding is like.

Once you learn the concepts of programming picking up additional languages is easy, so even if you never use java outside of classes the time learning it won't be wasted.
 
Even easier would be something like Visual Basic.
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VB does let you dive into visual / UI programming quickly but isn't good preparation for college classes. And for console programming (which might make more sense when learning what "a = a + 1" does) VB isn't really any easier than C++.

I'm not knocking VB, BASIC was my first language (on a TRS-80 model 1) and VB is much nicer than the DOS Basic PDS I used at my first job.
 
Originally posted by: Fides
Im in my last year of CEGEP (or last year of high school for anyone not from quebec) and in interested in going into computer science. The thing is id really like to pick up a computer language to see what its like before I devote 4-5 years to it to get a degree.
Question:
What?s the most common language(s) used and what?s the best way for a beginner to start (preferably free)?
Click to expand...

I would start with either Java or C++. Hmmm, the best non-free way to start would be getting a book (not Deital & Deital). The best free way to start is at programmer's heaven.
 
I would definately suggest that you consider this option long and hard. I say this because I'm at the end of a computer science degree and having a very difficult time in finding a job in Ottawa. Of course, this will hopefully change by the time you have your degree. It may affect possible Co-Op positions though, or maybe because of your location, it won't affect you at all. I'm a little bitter. 🙂

As for languages, I know first year students at University of Ottawa were originally taught Pascal when I started. Once I got to second year they switched to Java. Essentially they use the languages to teach the same concepts, which are far from those mentioned already in this thread. Computer Science courses at a university are more geared towards teaching you actual concepts than language specific elements. For instance, you can learn data structures in any language, even if the implementation changes from one to the other.

If you want a quick overview of what it is to solve problems with code, try something very simple, like Visual Basic. C++ Builder and Delphi will offer similar experiences to Visual Basic, just based on C++ and Pascal, and slightly more complicated. If you want to get a head start on what you'll need for your university experience, ask a student at your prospective university and see what they say. If they teach java in first year, give java a try.

Hopefully that helps a little... My opinions are a little biased given my experience and background.
 
The most common language really depends on what kind of programming you are doing. Most commercial software is written in C++ because it is powerful and fast. But without any programming background, it can be a little overwhelming. Java is very similar but handles a lot of the nasty stuff(like memory allocation, pointers, and garbage collection) for you.
VB is probably the most common language used for custom business apps because it is so fast and easy to create GUI's (Graphical User Interfaces). So if you want to get an idea of what it's like to build a form with textboxes and buttons, etc. VB is a good choice.

VB.Net and C# are the 2 main languages Microsoft is pushing. C# is very similar to Java. And VB.Net has similar syntax to VB6 but is really a completely new, true object oriented language with all the power of languages like C++.

If you are looking for a free way to start, go with Java. It will help you get a good idea of programming fundamentals. As others have pointed out, once you know how to program, learning a new language is fairly easy. Buy yourself a good beginners book (I like the Wrox books) and download the latest JDK (java development kit) or it might be included with the book.

You could also just take a programming class. You dont' have to devote 4 years before you know what it's like. Enroll in college, and take a beginning programming class your first term. Then you can decide if you want to pursue it or not. You can always change your major. Just keep in mind that at least in the U.S., there is not nearly as much demand for programmers now as there was a few years ago. 4 or 5 years ago, companies were throwing money at anybody with a CS degree. It's still a great profession with good opportunities, just not like it was.
 
Originally posted by: Fides
Im in my last year of CEGEP (or last year of high school for anyone not from quebec) and in interested in going into computer science. The thing is id really like to pick up a computer language to see what its like before I devote 4-5 years to it to get a degree.
Question:
What?s the most common language(s) used and what?s the best way for a beginner to start (preferably free)?
Click to expand...

IT is stress. Tons and tons of stress. And thankless users and stress and abuse and lots of really cool toys to play with and stress and political bullsh*t and long wierd hours and stress and responsibility for millions of company dollars and stress and rude people and a constant need to learn and stress and stuff. It's kindof like being a doctor on call all the time except every four years the human anatomy changes and you have to constantly self teach yourself through med school over and over.

I know I'm not the only IT guy who's dream job would be the drive-thru guy at McDonalds. God, that guy's got it made...and lawn mowing..ah that would be the job too. No stress there...just make that checkerboard pattern in the lawn and take some pride in your work and get some rays on sunny days.

Oh, and learn C++

If you get stressed learning it, switch majors asap.


 
I know I'm not the only IT guy who's dream job would be the drive-thru guy at McDonalds. God, that guy's got it made...and lawn mowing..ah that would be the job too. No stress there...just make that checkerboard pattern in the lawn and take some pride in your work and get some rays on sunny days.
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LOL, there has been a time or two when I've dreamed of a boring 9-to-5 programming job at a bank instead of writing application software for consumers. Or maybe a quiet job at a library. But after a few months the boredom would drive me mad 🙂

Hmm... so it's a java vs. C++ world out there eh?
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People do tend to specialize, but don't assume you'll only ever need to learn one language. I spend 90%+ of my time writing C++/MFC windows code but I also use HTML, Perl and ASP for server-side code and have used VB6 for some moonlighting work. I also write a little InstallShield script code for setups now and then. I may also finally be doing a little client-side java coding for an upcoming project.

None of which helps you decide whether to learn C++ or Java first, but it should tell you that picking either of them won't be a "wrong" decision even if your school ends up using the other in classes.
 
Yeah, it can be very stressful, but I've been a programmer for the last couple of years and I can't imagine doing anything else. I really enjoy my job. Of course, I would never want to be a system, network, or db administrator. They would have to at least triple my salary for me to even consider a job like that. I work long hours sometimes when project deadlines are approaching, but it's the administrators who are on call pretty much 24 hours a day. If a system goes down, its the admins who get called and are expected to fix it right away. Of course if it's my code that broke, I will take the blame and be called in for a fix. Where I work, a down system can translate into a loss of $50,000 an hour.
 
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