Still need a GPU, with an Intel i7 4770 for VIDEO EDITING?

[rivbyte]

Hello,

After seven years using a Q6600, with 8GB DDR2 RAM, and a Nvidia 8600GT on a MSI P35 Platinum, I now have the parts for the rebuild, so I am not yet convinced I would need a Nvidia GPU, if I mostly do Photoshop and edit,render, and encode videos using Pinnacle studio 15 HD Software, if I am NOT aa gamer, nore would i ever overclock. I'm still getting the all too familiar, "YES. get the GPU, anyway!"


MY NEW BUILD LIST~
CPU - intel i7 4770 3.4GHz
MEMORY - Crucial Ballistix 2x 8GB DDR3 (PC3-12800) 1600
MoBo - MSI B85-G41 PC Mate (LGA 1150)
PSU - Seasonic 550w S12G Gold
CPU Heatsink - CoolerMaster Hyper 212EVO
Boot SSD - Samsung 840EVO 250GB

I already have WIN7 64, my Coolermaster 690 ATX case, and two internal HDD's,(500GB, 2TB, for storage.

On my last 7 year old build, I installed a 700W, and it turns out people are telling me that's an overkill, so this around I decided on only a 550w, so as long as I don't do a SLI double Hi-End GPU's, I hope this will he sufficient enough.
I've heard from others that because the i7 Haswell CPU has the built in HD Graphics, I may not actually need a GPS, but someone mentioned having a card, like the GTX-650 Ti for instance, would be an improvement for watching YouTube and Video editing.
Will I be at a loss if I don't get a GPU to supplement this build? I could afford one, but not the more expensive,upper level gaming GPU.
I guess I could always try it first with Pinnacle, then decide, and install it later, but again, while I'm putting this all in now, it would be easier, and faster.

From all the different suggestions on whether to get a GPU, or stick with the i7 HD 4600, it gets a little confusing, and the bottom line, which most everyone can agree on, is for video editing, the two most important components are the CPU, and the onboard RAM memory, and not so much the GPU, which now is very necessary for gaming.

I wanted a type of media PC, but concentrating primarily on the JPG'S, MPG2,4, AVI, MOV, MP3's, Photo & Video editing", and streaming, AND NOT for gaming or overclocking.

These newer parts I will see, will be exponentially an improvement......(Fingers Crossed) Thanks again!

 

[escrow4]

I run 4770's in both my boxes and I'd agree, the difference will be substantial. Personally in this work box I run no GPU. You don't really need one unless the programs you use actually take advantage of the CUDA cores. I'd run without one for now; you can always add one in at your leisure.

I'd get a better quality mobo than MSI:

https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/VANGUARD_B85/

That is built to last and would be a better choice. There is also the consideration of a scratch disk, I use a 1TB EVO SSD to heavily speed things up compared to a HDD.

 

[nwo]

Depends on the program you use. Some of them only use CPU for encoding while others can use the GPU as well in order to accelerate the process.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Depends on the program you use. Some of them only use CPU for encoding while others can use the GPU as well in order to accelerate the process.

Here, I'm not going to make rave claims about "hybrid graphics." People here had taken positions back in 2011 with advent of the Z68 chipset that HD 3000 iGPU plus [any] dGPU using the Lucid Virtu software -- "graphics virtualization" -- was "no advantage." Reviewers noted that the performance advantage didn't seem significant. But some reviewers including Maximum PC Magazine seemed to tout it as vaguely advantageous. Further, there were supposed to be power savings enabled through using Lucid in "iGPU" mode, and there were questions about that, too.

But "instability" problems and other problems for which we (or I) were cautioned never occurred. You can switch the virtualization on and off in the Lucid (Windows) software in the middle of applications without a hitch. It gives you multi-monitor options both ways that you might not have with a dated NVidia card. For instance, I think I may have been pushing things a bit, following "dGPU mode" and having my desktop monitor and HDTV connected to my GTX 570.

What I DO notice about iGPU mode: game graphics on the desktop monitor (lucid-enabled) seem faster than they did with lucid enabled in dGPU mode. The system is rock-stable. Certain minor difficulties I'd been troubleshooting seemed to have disappeared.

So you might want to enable your Intel HD 4000 (or whatever the newer iGPU graphics model bundled with the I7-4770K) to work in "multi-monitor" iGPU-mode with your old Geforce 8600 card and see how that works for you. Save your money and get a really good card when and if you think you need it.

 

[videogames101]

depends on the application, it really does - look up what parts of photoshop are accelerated for example and decide if you use those aspects of the program, and do the same for your other software

 

[Makaveli]

Agreed it will come down to the app.

Some apps will prefer cuda.
Others like Sony Vegas Pro runs best on radeons.
While most encoders run best on cpus.

 

[rivbyte]

escrow4,
Thanks, too late to the party, because I already have ordered and received the new board via newegg, have the MSI B85-G41 1150.

My very first DYI PC was an Eliteboard (total crap) and it failed in only a few months, so I wanted to check out a simple board like the MSI P35 Platinum Socket 775, and after seven years, I've had no issues whatsoever with this board. I hope that this new board will also bring me another seven years!

I posted numerous times here about any suggestions for a Mobo that would be a Video geared PC, and found that ASUS, and GIGABYTE are made mostly for gamers. That's all you see on those mobo boxes, and also a lot of GPU's are aimed at gaming and their graphics. I thought I'd be ahead and get one now, in case the Intel 4600 HD doesn't work out. Heck, I'm even keeping my viewsonic VX2035wm, which is only a 1280x1024 Monitor that I paid $300.00 seven years ago. Which I know a full HD Monitor is the way to go, they cost too much. Someone suggested a Z79PRO, but was told it was too much, for what I needed.
To afford the new HD monitor, first, I'd have to sell off the present monitor, the 2x4GB DDR2, my existing MSI P-35, and my Intel Q6600 2.4 GHz CPU, "IF" I can actually sell them to someone, then I could afford the HD monitor.

Does anyone think that anyone would be interested in buying the as-is board? it would come with Q6600 2.4GHz Quad Core Duo cpu,ram, which is maxed out at 8GB, with this board, a Zalman CPU cooler, Nvidia GeForce 8600GT, and a 700W Thermaltake PSU...they would only need a mid/full ATX case, a HDD, and an O.S., ......OR do I scrap recycle these parts?

 

[nwo]

I definitely think you can find a buyer for your Q6600 config, even if the board is sold as-is.

 

[mindless1]

As others already mentioned for video editing it depends on the app, BUT at the same time, you might opt to use a different software for only video playback that is DXVA capable and benefits from a video card. In the coming years you might also find that the intel video can't do some 4K resolution and/or 50+FPS video acceleration at acceptable realtime rates, for example.

Photoshop and flash/youtube/etc can also benefit. Note that it does not have to be a powerhouse high performance video card. Even something $30 after rebate is substantially more assistance. It need not necessarily be a choice of integrated video or something costing over $100.

Then there is that "need" factor. It may not be necessary, the i7 can do it, but it seems a mismatch to not have *anything* better than integrated video on a build like that.

However, I would have upgraded the monitor to a 24"+, minimum 1080p, IPS or MVA LONG before upgrading the rest to your listed new rig. A TN paneled 1280x1024 monitor as the user interface is the larger bottleneck for HD video editing, as well as many other uses these days. Further, at the 7 year point it is due to die of old age, capacitor rot and dimming of the fluorescent tubes.

Regarding motherboards, without overclocking there is no specific board that's going to matter for video editing. Since the CPU seems to have a 84W spec'd TDP, you don't want a super low end board spec'd for less than 120W TDP, but otherwise you have a lot of options.

Pick one with other useful features like a few USB3 ports integrated, as surely it would be nice to have the ability to put some of that video on external HDDs a lot faster for backup or transportation... or of course use eSATA instead. Having at least a 2nd PCIe slot capable of 4x (lanes) or better is a good move but the MSI board already has that. It seems like a good value oriented choice.

 

[tweakboy]

If your doing video editing. That is what Hexacore 12 threads for Photoshop and adobe Premiere and Sonar are for. That is a 8 thread haswell. imagine 12 threads high OC..

 

[BonzaiDuck]

escrow4,
Thanks, too late to the party, because I already have ordered and received the new board via newegg, have the MSI B85-G41 1150.

My very first DYI PC was an Eliteboard (total crap) and it failed in only a few months, so I wanted to check out a simple board like the MSI P35 Platinum Socket 775, and after seven years, I've had no issues whatsoever with this board. I hope that this new board will also bring me another seven years!

I posted numerous times here about any suggestions for a Mobo that would be a Video geared PC, and found that ASUS, and GIGABYTE are made mostly for gamers. That's all you see on those mobo boxes, and also a lot of GPU's are aimed at gaming and their graphics. I thought I'd be ahead and get one now, in case the Intel 4600 HD doesn't work out. Heck, I'm even keeping my viewsonic VX2035wm, which is only a 1280x1024 Monitor that I paid $300.00 seven years ago. Which I know a full HD Monitor is the way to go, they cost too much. Someone suggested a Z79PRO, but was told it was too much, for what I needed.
To afford the new HD monitor, first, I'd have to sell off the present monitor, the 2x4GB DDR2, my existing MSI P-35, and my Intel Q6600 2.4 GHz CPU, "IF" I can actually sell them to someone, then I could afford the HD monitor.

Does anyone think that anyone would be interested in buying the as-is board? it would come with Q6600 2.4GHz Quad Core Duo cpu,ram, which is maxed out at 8GB, with this board, a Zalman CPU cooler, Nvidia GeForce 8600GT, and a 700W Thermaltake PSU...they would only need a mid/full ATX case, a HDD, and an O.S., ......OR do I scrap recycle these parts?

Well, this is a breath of fresh air. Someone who wants to enforce his own budget, and pick parts sufficient for his needs without closing his savings account.

So you had the Q6600 in the MSI P35 board? I was a bit stupid for picking the NVidia 680i Striker for use with that Kentsfield. I gave my system to my brother, and secretly wish I could get the case back -- which I built out of a '95 Compaq Proliant server case. [I always have to get a low-key boast about this in posts.] Five months of disturbing the peace of my neighbors, even with an acoustically enhanced garage -- the dremeling, the drilling, filing and the safety glasses and sparks. For sweating in the So-Cal heat, it was probably my last big weight-loss success.

Helluva case, though. It was just very big.

 

[mindless1]

Depending on your luck and location you can sometimes find used OEM ATX cases at local mom 'n pop computer shops for dirt cheap. Usually the power supplies are gone or near end of life already and you might have to ask at the counter as that sort of stuff often ends up in the dumpster rather than for sale in the front after too many build up (hint).

Ideally pick one that has a standard rather than proprietary front case hookup/connector so there is no rewiring needed... was more of a problem with early OEM ATX cases than later ones.

 

[beginner99]

Agreed it will come down to the app.

Some apps will prefer cuda.
Others like Sony Vegas Pro runs best on radeons.
While most encoders run best on cpus.

Most of them also support quicksync for encoding which is a lot faster than any other solution.

 

[tweakboy]

Grab a 770 video card. Then SLI later on if your not satisfied. gl

 

[Makaveli]

Most of them also support quicksync for encoding which is a lot faster than any other solution.

Also true.

Whats the verdict on quicksync now last I heard the quality is still inferior to cpu encoding even if its faster has this changed?

 

[beginner99]

Also true.

Whats the verdict on quicksync now last I heard the quality is still inferior to cpu encoding even if its faster has this changed?

No but quality is better than GPU encoding and also faster. AFAIK a dedicated GPU is mostly useless for home user video editing.

 

[Makaveli]

No but quality is better than GPU encoding and also faster. AFAIK a dedicated GPU is mostly useless for home user video editing.

I've edited some video with sony vegas pro version 12 and rendering is faster on my GPU compared to my overclocked processor by quite a bit that is one area its noticeable.

 

[rivbyte]

Hi,
Sorry we have to keep going down this road to my decision about whether to solely use my onboard HD 4600 i7's IGPU, or buy a dedicated GPU...Just don't want to step in anything by making the wrong decisions, when I can take the money that I would have spent on a decent new GPU, then instead, buy a new IPS 22-24 HD Monitor instead.

I am serious now about a new monitor, and I went to Fry's to look at the IPS 1920x1200. I saw an ASUS IPS 22" 1980x1200, for $150.00. Looks pretty awesome. They had others too, but I will delve deeper into this after I'm done with the build. While I was there, I also bought a Raidmax Inter Connect 4 Port USB Hub.(2x2.0 USB/2x3.0 USB) Got home and did not notice it's only 4" wide, so I have to either go back and return it, then use the USB 3.0 in the rear I/0, or buy the front bay 5.25" adaptor, and use the fronts.

I realize that Pinnacle studio is frowned upon when there are so many better video editing programs out there,( Adobe Premeire, Sony Vegas, etc, which are more expensive than what I paid for my Studio 15HD, and although it can be very problematic at times, it's all I can afford to burn family videos of sports, B-Days, and Holidays. So now, it works for me.

Please let me understand this further....I've heard that the IGPU on the CPU, and also the GPU can share memory? i7's HD 4600 works better for some programs, where the dGPU can do other functions better, in others.

DOES THE BOARD USE BOTH IPGU, and the GPU AT THE SAME TIME? EITHER, OR?

I thought when you install a GPU, like for instance, a GTX 650, GTX 770, etc., one would have to change which graphics to use in the BIOS?

I still think if I get the Nvidia GTX 650, (2GB, GDDR5) it would be better served
than my i7 graphics, even if I don't overclock, or game, but at this point, I still have no idea.

Heck, someone even mentioned to me, to still use my old Nvidia 8600GT, until I get a new one. really? Also added this 8600GT might even be better than my IGPU HD 4600, on the i7...another REALLY? ( But I would step up to the newer cards anyway, if I need one)

Thank you for your patience!

 

[crazzy.heartz]

Even with a dedicaed Gpu, one should keep the iGpu enabled to utilize "intel clear video technology" [http://www.intel.com/content/www/us...eo-hd/clear-video-hd-technology-general.html]

According to Anand's tests, intel iGpus offers blistering transcoding capability that even trounces dedicated Gpus.

You'd be fine with the latest iteration of their igpu (it's almost 30% of the CPU's die space) and 3.9 Ghz (effective speed) cores in 4770 are overkill for any cpu bound application..

Check out the softwares on the right tab here: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us...uick-sync-video/quick-sync-video-general.html

If you feel dissatisfied with the performance; then & only then, get the dedicated GPU... not beforehand..

Invest in a new LED instead.

PS. as you keep your pc, monitor for 5+ years, would suggest you to go for a 1440p or higher display..

 

[rivbyte]

Thanks,
1440, or higher LED Display?
I saw a a 2560x1440 IPS LED on Monoprice for $400.00 and up! Although this looks tempting, It's way out of my price range. So my choice would be either a REG. LED 1980x1080, or a IPS 1980x1200....I'll but the 2560x1440, after I win the lottery...(fingers crossed)

 

[Phynaz]

No but quality is better than GPU encoding and also faster. AFAIK a dedicated GPU is mostly useless for home user video editing.

Not with the right software. For example TMPEGEnc will use CUDA for pre-processing only, so you get performance increases without the quality degradation of GPU encoding.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

You don't need it. It'll be a big upgrade even without it, and you'll probably never realize what you're missing.

 

[escrow4]

Even with a dedicaed Gpu, one should keep the iGpu enabled to utilize "intel clear video technology" [http://www.intel.com/content/www/us...eo-hd/clear-video-hd-technology-general.html]

According to Anand's tests, intel iGpus offers blistering transcoding capability that even trounces dedicated Gpus.

You'd be fine with the latest iteration of their igpu (it's almost 30% of the CPU's die space) and 3.9 Ghz (effective speed) cores in 4770 are overkill for any cpu bound application..

Check out the softwares on the right tab here: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us...uick-sync-video/quick-sync-video-general.html

If you feel dissatisfied with the performance; then & only then, get the dedicated GPU... not beforehand..

Invest in a new LED instead.

PS. as you keep your pc, monitor for 5+ years, would suggest you to go for a 1440p or higher display..

Technically, 3.9GHz is single core boost only. The bins drop the more cores are active unless you have Multi Core Enhancement enabled in your BIOS which forces the maximum at all loads. That being said, I've never seen my 4770 hit over 3.8GHz, and gaming wise it loads to around 3.7GHz.

 

[cytg111]

Video editing ... if your software stack utilizes avx/avx2 then i'd get a better cooler.

I have a i7 4770 running the stock cooler and it throttles under avx2 loads (prime95) after ~10-15 minutes at 3.4 no turbo, with turbo faster and multicore turbo withing a minute. (idle temps 35-40).

 

[rivbyte]

I already have this 3rd party Coolermaster EVO Tower 212, which a lot of peeps told me that I could have used the supplied stock CPU cooler, but even with this CM 212, your telling me I would still need a better Cooler?

If anything, I think if I go with a GPU at all, it might be between the GTX-650, or the GTX-770 but no SLI, or double GPUS.