Steam page shows 3 announcements coming

[smackababy]

I used to work a lot with Linux at my last job. Unfortunately I was met with the same attitude on most 'nix forums.

I know how to RTFM, and I do, but these guys are part of the reason people get scared off from Linux.

Which is exactly why Steam OS isn't called Steam Linux and Android isn't called Google Linux.

 

[hoorah]

If someone can't plug in their Tv via HDMI how do they plug in a Blu-Ray player or a Playstation? You just literally plug it in and change the input and see a picture. Or do you mean they don't know you can do that? When many monitors hook up via HDMI it never occurs to them, "woah I can just plug into the TV."?

I dunno...I simply can't fathom that.

You connect a blu-ray player to the TV using HDMI. You connect the monitor to the computer using the computer-monitor cord-thingey. Its different right? I think its a USB port.

Oh, wait, you're telling me that I can hook up my laptop to the TV with the same connector as the blu-ray player? Wow, thats neat. Can you show me where the HDMI plug is on my windows XP laptop? It has a lot of viruses so I hope the viruses don't go to the TV.

I'm with you. Its easy and it hurts your brain to think that people don't get this, but they really don't. Technology is dominated by the lowest common denominator now. Theres a reason that HTPCs never sold, but Apple TVs and Roku boxes do.

So yeah, it is pretty easy to connect a gaming PC to the TV, but I still think thats a very small segment of the market that will do that, and Valve is trying to think big.

 

[smackababy]

Like I already said multiple times. This SteamOS is not aimed at ANY person in this thread. Not a single person here should care about it. We all have gaming PCs, we aren't buying a SteamBox to play games or worrying about the cost of windows on our 1k+ PCs.

This is a LONG TERM thing, just like Steam itself was on Windows when it was first released. Valve is simply launching it's own linux platform which yes has existed for awhile and is free. It's a gesture to further encourage people to code for Linux as well.

SteamOS is not for the 1k+ PC market. It's for the Sub $500 SteamBox market when they announce steam this week. Steam knows full well they'll never move a majority of the true PCGamers to SteamOS it's nto possible. Too many people have Windows applications that can't be used on Linux. But, if I want to build a PURE gaming or buy a Steam Box and be able to game on it without having to worry about buying a windows license SteamOS exists.

Like you said, people will NEVER stop developing for Windows first so trust me, VAlve isn't dumb enough to convince people to switch to Linux. They just want to be able to compete IN THE LIVING room. It's OBVIOUS from annoucnement, to interviews, etc. that this is a direct assault on consoles and trying to get into the living room. This is what companies care about. The LIVING ROOM.

And they won't get anywhere. The living room isn't going to just accept some new console because Valve made it. 99% of the living room doesn't know who Valve is, nor do they care. "Half Life? Oh, that is like Black Ops 2, but with stupid aliens, worse graphics, and no multiplayer. Who cares?" If Gabe is foolish enough to think his console will compete with actual consoles, then he is in for a huge surprise. If getting into the console market was so easy, we'd have a lot more than the big 3.

 

[postmortemIA]

steam for cats based on original link

 

[ImpulsE69]

And they won't get anywhere. The living room isn't going to just accept some new console because Valve made it. 99% of the living room doesn't know who Valve is, nor do they care. "Half Life? Oh, that is like Black Ops 2, but with stupid aliens, worse graphics, and no multiplayer. Who cares?" If Gabe is foolish enough to think his console will compete with actual consoles, then he is in for a huge surprise. If getting into the console market was so easy, we'd have a lot more than the big 3.

You know I find it hilarious how much you went against EVERYONE's "rumored speculations" about the Xbone (which 99% of those 'rumors were right) yet here you are here railing against this with speculations as if it impacts you. Funny.

I honestly do not know what their end goal here is other than wanting to get out from under Windows. The difference here is everyone will still have a choice (unlike what MS tried to pull). I don't think everyone is just going to up and say "guess I can't play my 200+ Steam games anymore" without throwing a fit.

These aren't consoles therefore the only thing that impacts "generations" is OS (for the most part). Everything else can be gone around in some manner as well as the OS. I don't see any of this as an attempt to replace anything, only add on to existing. Not sure that it will take off, but people are still clamoring over the next gen consoles as if they are something special so anything is possible. At the end of the day even the Steambox is still a PC and due to it being a PC will come with PC ways around things.

I have a feeling this would be more like what the Oyua was supposed to be...

 

[Red Storm]

It is funny that everyone is talking about MS being the bad guy here. What if Valve does the same thing? Aren't they essentially saying "hey everyone that is selling through Steam, either do what we want or find some other digital distribution outlet that has this many users." What happens when Gabe just says "I hate Windows! Steam is Linux only!"? You lose everything on your Steam profile that ported at that point, but MS is the bad guy.

If Valve goes evil mode on us then people will switch to another platform. This is gaming not some essential function of life. Nothing is stopping another distribution service from taking off. Remember MySpace?

Valve is simply protecting itself from the possibility of Microsoft going evil. It's really as simple as that. I don't get why this is so hard for some to understand.

 

[tential]

And they won't get anywhere. The living room isn't going to just accept some new console because Valve made it. 99% of the living room doesn't know who Valve is, nor do they care. "Half Life? Oh, that is like Black Ops 2, but with stupid aliens, worse graphics, and no multiplayer. Who cares?" If Gabe is foolish enough to think his console will compete with actual consoles, then he is in for a huge surprise. If getting into the console market was so easy, we'd have a lot more than the big 3.

I guess we just completely IGNORED the word "Long Term".

Tons of people thought steam itself would fail when it first came out. Hell, I did too. It was TERRIBLE. The thing with this strategy smackababy is that the Steam platform is VASTLY different than "The Big 3". The big 3 control the hardware aspect. That's a HUGE amount of investment that goes into it. Gabe is taking what has already been there, the PC market, and deciding to let them use that for it.

The MAJOR hurdle Gabe has to make is getting good drivers, and getting game developers to program for it. Just like how Steam used CS 1.6 (And other games I can't even remember), to get people to start using Steam, He's going to use the new Source Engine games on SteamOS to get some interest in the SteamOS/SteamBox.

Is it going to be easy? No. Hell, he might even fail. But I can see what he is envisioning just like I saw what he envisioned when he released Steam.

Comparing SteamOS/Steam Box as the same model as the Big 3 though is purposely ignoring the major differences.

The hurdles are major, I see it as a long term move, one that will pay off 5-10 years from now. But considering how impatient people are and how our world works today where if people don't see instant results in things they are annoyed it's no wonder people don't see the potential of SteamOS/SteamBox.

Edit: As for people saying "Linux has been here awhile it hasn't worked before why now?" This is a platform built for gaming to be used WITH a controller for the couch. As a gamer who doesn't use keyboard now, it's ANNOYING to have to grab my mouse/keyboard to launch games, or make changes when I'm gaming. It's why I switched to XBMC/AdvancedLauncher and put all my games to launch through it so that I can use an Xbox 360 controller but it's not perfect. Steam OS/BigPictureMode is an attempt to make this whole process easier and appeal to a larger audience.
It is NOT for people who are sitting at a desk gaming although you can use it that way. It's definitely meant to be at a HDTV though hence the TV aspect of SteamOS.

 

[BD2003]

How exactly would steam boxes do that? You talk about underpowered but I assure you, none of these boxes will run GTX 770/HD 7970 level cards and overclocked i7 CPUs. Home theater/living room hardware is much smaller form factor than a typical gaming PC. I saw someone say Tegra on another forum and I had to laugh...tegra, and you expect to play Witcher 3 on this thing? Plus with everyone under the sun making them you'll have to get support for it somehow. I know Asus isn't exactly known as having the best tech support in the industry for example. If it uses Nvidia hardware I can see Nvidia referring you to the OEM that builds it.

Because you can build your own, silly.

I'm sure the same players like alienware that are still making high end gaming PCs will jump on board this as well.

 

[hoorah]

99% of the living room doesn't know who Valve is, nor do they care. .

Sadly agreed there. Microsoft had Xboxs in millions of homes and couldn't touch the living room TV as a main source of content until netflix came along. When netflix DID come along, MS was in a better spot than anyone else (aside from WII or PS3) because their console was already there.

Will Valve succeed next to the big 3? I don't know. I would say no, but then again, when Steam first came out no one thought it would succeed.

The big three consoles are definitely the gorillas in the market, but what happens when some kid wants a game system for his birthday to play Call of Duty and his parents say "Hmm, look at that. This steam thing looks like it will work and all of the games are cheaper on it. We'll get him that".

Its not a guaranteed key to success, but its not a bad shot if you're valve.

 

[BD2003]

And they won't get anywhere. The living room isn't going to just accept some new console because Valve made it. 99% of the living room doesn't know who Valve is, nor do they care. "Half Life? Oh, that is like Black Ops 2, but with stupid aliens, worse graphics, and no multiplayer. Who cares?" If Gabe is foolish enough to think his console will compete with actual consoles, then he is in for a huge surprise. If getting into the console market was so easy, we'd have a lot more than the big 3.

Back when the xbox first came out, people laughed at that too. People also doubted the PS1 when it first came out as well. And the last remaining member of the early days of consoles (Nintendo) has been circling the drain for the past 4-5 years when it comes to the living room.

The industry is totally ready for a shakeup.

 

[ImpulsE69]

One thing that many people aren't really mentioning is that even if Steam was trying to compete in the same market as the consoles, it is still a PC which would mean all the ports may or may not come to it and/or would be 6months-year or more down the road and/or bad w/o modding etc.

So what you end up with is a system that gets games later if at all, may not work correctly w/o patching that may or may not even come and/or mods which would put a bad taste in many non-pc gamers mouths and send them right back to their consoles.

Games that are PC only are not usually suited to TV gaming (due to small details etc) so you can't really even say PC exclusives would drive it.

So..again, I do not think that is Steams ultimate goal here...I think it is ultimately just an expansion of the market.

 

[smackababy]

Back when the xbox first came out, people laughed at that too. People also doubted the PS1 when it first came out as well. And the last remaining member of the early days of consoles (Nintendo) has been circling the drain for the past 4-5 years when it comes to the living room.

The industry is totally ready for a shakeup.

You know why the Xbox stayed around? Billions of dollars on Microsoft's part. Valve is valued at less than MS spent on the Xbox in like the first 3 years. I don't remember very much doubt about the PS1, but I didn't follow the launch very closely. I know there was doubt about the loading times, which is why Nintendo backed off. Sega shot themselves in the foot like Nintendo is doing now.

A shakeup, at this point, is about as likely as a new graphics card company coming into the picture I feel. Especially, if it is someone as, well I can't think of the right word so stubborn will have to do, as Gabe.

A Steambox with real support sounds like a great idea, sadly Valve just isn't big enough to get that support. Console games are about COD, Madden, Fifa, and exclusives. Valve has one of those, maybe: hint it isn't made by EA, nor is it Half Life. Activision has some support for Mac / Linux (with Blizzard).

 

[BD2003]

If Valve goes evil mode on us then people will switch to another platform. This is gaming not some essential function of life. Nothing is stopping another distribution service from taking off. Remember MySpace?

Valve is simply protecting itself from the possibility of Microsoft going evil. It's really as simple as that. I don't get why this is so hard for some to understand.

I think that was what sparked the concept, seeing Microsoft start to move towards the walled garden model with Win 8. That initiative will ultimately fail anyway, but regardless, at some point they must have taken a look around, and saw that the gaping hole in the market. Everyone focused on building up walls around their little garden, and the one OS that's legitimately taking the world by storm is android.

Microsoft claims to have sold 100 million Windows 8 licenses in roughly a year, but android shipped on 480 million smartphones last year. A bit of a shaky comparison for sure, but android is BY FAR the fastest selling OS right now. And it's an open, free platform that's completely dominating it's competition.

So I'm sure valve took a step back from their fear of microsoft shutting the doors on them and noticed the opening in the market in the living room for something that's more open and configurable than the traditional consoles, more capable than a bluray player or media streamer, and can appeal to the dozens of hardware manufacturers that are being snubbed by MS with Win8, Surface and Xbox, as well as all the game publishers that don't want to cede all their control to the whims of the "big three".

 

[frozentundra123456]

It may not be an instant hit, or even a hit at all, but I still think its a move they have to make.

I see this as really similar to the Windows tablets. Microsoft didn't build a tablet because they had fantastic vision and thought they could do something really special to meet an unmet marketplace need. They did it because something (market research, trends, sales data, whatever those marketing people use) said "This is the next marketplace. Its app stores, in-app purchases, and locked-in ecosystems on portable devices. This is where we need to have a presence to succeed in the future". So they forced the tablet OS on everyone. Everyone complained that windows was fine the way it was - why did they mess with it? Because its not about whats working right now, its about whats going to work in the future. Of course, theres a big difference between a parallel product allowed to succeed or fail of its own right and forcing a product as the only option in an attempt to boost market share. I guess we will have to see which path Valve takes.




Sort of. Remember to think lowest common denominator here. Yes, you can 'easily' attach a PC to the TV via HDMI, but I would say more people don't know that than do. On top of that, I think there are a lot of 10 year old Xbox gamers that, if they dragged their PC out into the living room to hook up to the TV, would be told by their fathers to put it back and quit cluttering up the house. My age and grumpiness are showing

I agree about perhaps not being allowed/want to move the computer close enough to run a HDMI to a TV, but OTOH, I dont think steambox is a more simple solution. Do you really think that someone who cant figure out how to run a simple cable from a PC to a TV will want to deal with streaming or adding another piece of hardware altogether (steambox)?

 

[BD2003]

You know why the Xbox stayed around? Billions of dollars on Microsoft's part. Valve is valued at less than MS spent on the Xbox in like the first 3 years. I don't remember very much doubt about the PS1, but I didn't follow the launch very closely. I know there was doubt about the loading times, which is why Nintendo backed off. Sega shot themselves in the foot like Nintendo is doing now.

A shakeup, at this point, is about as likely as a new graphics card company coming into the picture I feel. Especially, if it is someone as, well I can't think of the right word so stubborn will have to do, as Gabe.

A Steambox with real support sounds like a great idea, sadly Valve just isn't big enough to get that support. Console games are about COD, Madden, Fifa, and exclusives. Valve has one of those, maybe: hint it isn't made by EA, nor is it Half Life. Activision has some support for Mac / Linux (with Blizzard).

They needed to spend those billions to support the hardware design, taking a loss on hardware sales to build the install base, tons of red ringed xboxes, etc. I don't see valve's own "steambox" as anything more than a proof of concept, I get the impression that once it's off the ground they'll cease to make hardware. All they'll need to support is the OS and the storefront, and that's a much smaller task. HP, Asus and the like will need to bear the burden of console design, Intel/AMD/Nvidia will handle the internals, publishers will handle the games. They're just the ones bringing it all together, not trying to run the entire show on their own.

 

[ImpulsE69]

It could be all this runs as a VM inside another OS as well....there really are many approaches to this that don't include a locked down linux box that only sits next to your television.

 

[frozentundra123456]

No no, this isn't about making Linux a gaming platform. This is about what hoorah and I said, Valve securing their future against potential lock-in from Apple, Google, and most importantly Microsoft. They can't tie their multi-billion dollar business to another company's decisions.

And what is to prevent Valve from locking in their own platform just like any of the other companies you mentioned?

 

[BD2003]

And what is to prevent Valve from locking in their own platform just like any of the other companies you mentioned?

Will never happen. They can't build the platform without being open, and it could take 4-5 years for them to build up enough steam (yeah, I know) to even be in a place to consider locking it down. At that point, any walled gardens that remain will be withering and dying, to the point that anyone with half a brain could see it would be nothing short of suicide to try and lock it down.

I know that sounds crazy now, given that everyone is trying to erect their own walled garden, but mark my words...the days of "closed ecosystems" are almost over. The only services and applications that will be relevant will be cross-platform and ubiquitous, and the only platforms that will be relevant are the open ones that allow everyone else in.

 

[hoorah]

I agree about perhaps not being allowed/want to move the computer close enough to run a HDMI to a TV, but OTOH, I dont think steambox is a more simple solution. Do you really think that someone who cant figure out how to run a simple cable from a PC to a TV will want to deal with streaming or adding another piece of hardware altogether (steambox)?

Maybe. Like I said - HTPCs never sold, but Apple TVs and Rokus did.

Also, there's connecting it, and then theres using it. Power + HDMI to a small box, then using a remove is in the realm of what people can handle.

PC (that doesn't fit into the cabinet easily) + keyboard/mouse, add IR reciever + remote/game controller...I guess I'm just cynical about the whole thing.

I've had HTPCs since 2004. I've watched over the years as people have seen the capability, asked 'hey, how can I do that?' and tune out right at "you need a computer and a WMC remote".

"If you want to record shows, you need a cablecard tuner. Theyre around $200"
"Nope".
"What do you spend on DVRs?"
"$25/month"
"an HTPC will pay for itself in 10-12 months"
"Yeah, but $200 is a lot of money!"

"How do I put my computer on the TV like you do?"
"Well the easy way would be to connect your laptop via HDMI and see if thats useful for you before you buy a full blown setup. Does your laptop have HDMI?"
"I think so yeah"
"Okay, so this laptop doesn't have HDMI because you bought the cheapest one they had. Do you have an older desktop that might have HDMI? Or would you want to buy a newer low end computer?"
"um.....how do I put the computer on the TV like you do?"

"Your cousin wants to play the gun game that everyone plays. How do we get that app on the Samsung SMART TV store?"

I can do these examples all day....unfortunately.

 

[Lonyo]

Will never happen. They can't build the platform without being open, and it could take 4-5 years for them to build up enough steam (yeah, I know) to even be in a place to consider locking it down. At that point, any walled gardens that remain will be withering and dying, to the point that anyone with half a brain could see it would be nothing short of suicide to try and lock it down.

I know that sounds crazy now, given that everyone is trying to erect their own walled garden, but mark my words...the days of "closed ecosystems" are almost over. The only services and applications that will be relevant will be cross-platform and ubiquitous, and the only platforms that will be relevant are the open ones that allow everyone else in.

Will never happen?
So I can go to Valve right now and get my game on Steam?
Oh, no, I can't... because it's locked down.

 

[hoorah]

And what is to prevent Valve from locking in their own platform just like any of the other companies you mentioned?

In that sense, it already is locked down. You can't take a game purchased through steam and move the license over to the microsoft app store, or the apple app store, or your xbox.

Or are you talking about only allowing SteamOS to run on certain hardware configs from certain vendors? If so, I doubt that will happen because it doesn't matter. Valve (and for that matter, microsoft and Sony) are not making money off of the hardware nor have anything to gain by forcing you to a certain setup. They want to make money off of the content licenses.

 

[lilrayray69]

How is this much different than the Ouya idea? Other than coming from Valve and being backed by Steam.

 

[Kalmah]

Maybe. Like I said - HTPCs never sold, but Apple TVs and Rokus did.

Also, there's connecting it, and then theres using it. Power + HDMI to a small box, then using a remove is in the realm of what people can handle.

PC (that doesn't fit into the cabinet easily) + keyboard/mouse, add IR reciever + remote/game controller...I guess I'm just cynical about the whole thing.

I've had HTPCs since 2004. I've watched over the years as people have seen the capability, asked 'hey, how can I do that?' and tune out right at "you need a computer and a WMC remote".

"If you want to record shows, you need a cablecard tuner. Theyre around $200"
"Nope".
"What do you spend on DVRs?"
"$25/month"
"an HTPC will pay for itself in 10-12 months"
"Yeah, but $200 is a lot of money!"

"How do I put my computer on the TV like you do?"
"Well the easy way would be to connect your laptop via HDMI and see if thats useful for you before you buy a full blown setup. Does your laptop have HDMI?"
"I think so yeah"
"Okay, so this laptop doesn't have HDMI because you bought the cheapest one they had. Do you have an older desktop that might have HDMI? Or would you want to buy a newer low end computer?"
"um.....how do I put the computer on the TV like you do?"

"Your cousin wants to play the gun game that everyone plays. How do we get that app on the Samsung SMART TV store?"

I can do these examples all day....unfortunately.

This is where places like Best Buy can pull in some extra money. I'm sure that they would love to send Geeksquad out to your house to hook this stuff up. By selling whatever Valve is about to sell, places like Best Buy are adding new channels of revenue for themselves.

But, I agree with you anyways. So many people duck behind a wall of ignorance if they are fronted with something they already don't know about.

 

[BD2003]

Will never happen?
So I can go to Valve right now and get my game on Steam?
Oh, no, I can't... because it's locked down.

According to valve, on SteamOS, you wouldn't have to go through them.

 

[BD2003]

How is this much different than the Ouya idea? Other than coming from Valve and being backed by Steam.

Ouya was primarily a hardware platform, SteamOS is primarily software. The steam box is just a proof of concept, the ouya box was the entire concept.