Starting Strength vs Miltary exercise

[kia75]

My buddy and I recently started going to the gym doing Starting strength. He then joined ROTC and wants us to do the workout they suggested.

ROTC suggested workout

Despite my urging he hasn't read Starting strength. My main issue is that the workout uses a bunch of machines and single muscle exercises. It's also hella long (15 different exercises in one day!). It seems to highlight the look good muscles by doing lots of curls and neglects squats and deadlifts. My main concern is time. I work 12 hour days and Starting strength allows me to do a workout in ~ 45 minutes. Most time I'm out of the gym in less then an hour.

But... on the other hand, it is recommended by the US Government.

Since I'm a newbie at this weightlifting stuff, are my concerns accurate? Anything I can use to help convince my friend to keep on doing Starting strength?

 

[Deeko]

The ROTC workout is kinda terrible

 

[katank]

Starting Strength is the real deal. Forget about the traditional military PT (either BB split like this or some long, slow distance running).

Lots of military organizations are switching over to doing Crossfit-inspired stuff. That's also legit.

Ultimately, it depends on your goals.

If you want strength, then do Starting Strength or Stronglifts 5x5 at start, then switching over to say Wendler 5-3-1, Texas method, or other intermediate programs later on.

If you want general fitness and/or weight loss, something like Crossfit or one of its variants would work well.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Your concerns are well-had. Any program that choose isolation over compound movements and has tons of exercises leans toward bodybuilding. That's not very functional and the military should be the king of functional. Keep doing SS. It's a legitimate program that will continually get you stronger in ways that are very helpful in the field. However, if you do have certain tests where they gauge your strength on an isolation movement and judge you from that, I'd suggest to train those accessory exercises as well. Squat strength doesn't translate well into isolation exercises and vice versa due to the lack of neural coordination. I don't think they'll have you do something like that, but I just wanted to mention it so you can keep it in mind. Also, SS won't help your endurance on movements like situps, pushups, or runs, which I know the military likes to test. If you train those on your off days though, you will be way ahead of the average man in both strength and performance.

 

[brikis98]

If you want strength, then do Starting Strength or Stronglifts 5x5 at start, then switching over to say Wendler 5-3-1, Texas method, or other intermediate programs later on.

If you want general fitness and/or weight loss, something like Crossfit or one of its variants would work well.

This. The routine you linked to is a pile of crap and SS or CF will help you achieve your goals FAR faster.

 

[OptimumSlinky]

+1 for CrossFit.
+1 for Starting Strength.

Coming from a currently serving Army Officer, military PT is terrible (most of it is based on concepts and ideas from the early 1980s that have since been proven to be either inefficient or flat out wrong) and is focused on a single goal: passing a PT test that generally consists of push ups, either sit ups or crunches, and a 2- or 3-mile run. If you go Marines, you can add pull ups to that equation. It's slowly (read: SLOWLY) changing as more and more service members are switching over to CrossFit or CrossFit-inspired regimes and are seeing drastic improvements across the board. The military, however, is very hierarchical which pretty much means as long as their is some crusty old O6 or O7 up there whose idea of a good workout is a 5-mile run followed by some push ups (and nothing more), it will take a while for changes to trickle down, especially in the training commands (TRADOC, ROTC, etc).

The easiest way to get your friend to switch is let him keep doing their crap for 8-weeks while you do a combination of CrossFit and Starting Strength. Then both of you take the Army PFT. Score higher than he does (which you should if you're doing your workouts properly), and hopefully he won't be too proud/stubborn and will see the light.

 

[spamsk8r]

Check out the Crossfit Wichita Falls program if you or your buddy are interested in gaining strength as well as conditioning. It's programmed by Justing Lascek, one of the trainers at Rippetoe's gym, and one of the founders of 70sbig.com.

EDIT: Hmm, looks like the link to the PDF detailing the program is dead now because of the restructuring of Rip's sites. Google Crossfit Strength Bias for a similar approach, or read Brikis98's CF thread for an actual implementation of CF+Strength.

 

[prism]

If you train those on your off days though, you will be way ahead of the average man in both strength and performance.

I read a Rippetoe quote saying that you should not be doing exercises on the rest days between his 3x a week weight-lifting. Maybe I misread it and he meant not doing any more weightlifting on these rest days, but I thought he meant cardio too...

 

[brikis98]

I read a Rippetoe quote saying that you should not be doing exercises on the rest days between his 3x a week weight-lifting. Maybe I misread it and he meant not doing any more weightlifting on these rest days, but I thought he meant cardio too...

Depends on your goals. If you are trying to maximize strength and mass gains, then yes, doing cardio or other exercise on your rest days would be counterproductive. If you are trying to prepare for ROTC, then it is worth maximizing a bit of the strength/mass gains to get better at running (or whatever else you need to work on).

 

[darkxshade]

Just my guess but I assume military exercises were designed to train soldiers in batches efficiently due to lack of equipment. They aren't bad for the purpose it was designed for but it's not practical for individuals. If you and your friend are going to the gym, SS and any other non military regimen for that matter focuses on individual improvement and are way better than any military routines would provide.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Just my guess but I assume military exercises were designed to train soldiers in batches efficiently due to lack of equipment. They aren't bad for the purpose it was designed for but it's not practical for individuals. If you and your friend are going to the gym, SS and any other non military regimen for that matter focuses on individual improvement and are way better than any military routines would provide.

I'm not seeing the lack of equipment here - leg press, leg extensions, seated calf raises. You could circuit in body weight exercises with other individuals using barbells much more efficiently. That would be a serious improvement compared to this POS.

 

[TallBill]

Lots of people commenting here without actually knowing what's in a physical training manual. It's highly flexible and not limited to what's actually in the FM.

www.hooah4health.com/4you/FM2021-20.pdf

That being said, starting strength will beat a good share of military PT programs.

 

[PrinceofWands]

I was in awesome shape before joining the military. Boot camp cost me that, and over the next two years I got very heavy and unhealthy. The food was crap, the exercise pitiable, and the environment far too stressful to aid in being healthy. As soon as I left I started to recover and got much stronger and healthier. Mind you, it was the navy, so take that for what you will.

 

[TallBill]

I was in awesome shape before joining the military. Boot camp cost me that, and over the next two years I got very heavy and unhealthy. The food was crap, the exercise pitiable, and the environment far too stressful to aid in being healthy. As soon as I left I started to recover and got much stronger and healthier. Mind you, it was the navy, so take that for what you will.

Each person's experience is going to be different. When I was in Iraq I took my team to the gym every day for PT or ran. I also ate AWESOME. I gained a ton of strength/size.