Starting Strength Experiences

[ZOOYUKA]

What kind of experiences have you guys had with Starting Strength? Any feedback is appreciated.

 

[brikis98]

It works. I personally know ~10 people who have done it - many of them used it to build strength before starting Crossfit - and literally every single one saw massive gains. The closer they stuck with the routine - that is, not changing/adding exercises, not doing lots of cardio, eating everything in sight - the more impressive were their results. If you are a beginner going for strength and/or size, it's hard to do much better than this routine.

 

[Lamont Burns]

Mar 09

Deadlift
1x5x135

Squat
3x5x85

OHP
3x5x60

Bench
3x5x75

I don't power clean, I did Pendlay Rows. My weight was 188. I have run the program twice with about a 2 month period of just haze.

Today

Deadlift
1x5x345

Squat
3x5x265

OHP
3x5x125

Bench
3x5x185

I weigh 225 atm. All these lifts as of today are my LAST workout, b/c each new one it's higher. I gained fat, I have no six pack. I have tons of muscle everywhere I did not have before, but more importantly strength. So, no back pain, knee pains are gone from an ACL repair. Everything I do is easier.

I loved the program. I'm getting close to the end of linear progression I think, but I found it fantastic.

 

[ZOOYUKA]

Thanks for the info guys. I plan on starting the program next week. I am getting the book in the mail tomorrow. Is it necessary to read the book cover to cover before starting?

 

[brikis98]

Thanks for the info guys. I plan on starting the program next week. I am getting the book in the mail tomorrow. Is it necessary to read the book cover to cover before starting?

Yes. If you are going to spend the next several months doing the routine, take a few hours and read the entire book to make sure you are doing it properly. In fact, you'll probably end up re-reading parts of it as you go along.

 

[Lamont Burns]

I bought starting strength volume 2, and it's more of a reference material book. I found tweaks to my form that have helped quite a bit.

 

[ZOOYUKA]

When you guys did the program, did you have a spotter?

 

[katank]

Just used a power rack for squats and benching. Spotter would be better for benching though.

 

[brikis98]

When you guys did the program, did you have a spotter?

Only exercise that you may need a (human) spotter for is the bench press. For all others, a spotter is not helpful and likely to get in the way. I posted this in another thread, so I'm just copy/pasting it here:

* Squat: should be done in a power rack with safety rails set-up just below full squat depth. If you get in trouble, just leave the bar on the rails. Alternatively, if you have bumper plates, you can also easily dump the weight on the floor. Spotting the squat is very difficult and most people do it wrong, which actually makes things more dangerous. If you train in a PL gym with trained spotters, they can be helpful, but that isn't the case for 99.9% of the population.

* Bench: this is the one exercise where a spotter is very helpful. Alternatives are a power rack with safety rails just below your chest, doing DB bench press, or leaving the collars off and letting the weights slide off (worst case scenario, but still better than being caught under the bar).

* OH press: if you can't finish a rep, just lower the weight back to your shoulders.

* Deadlift, rows, and most slow lifts from the ground: if you can't finish a rep, just set the bar back down.

* Any o-lift (clean, snatch, jerk): best done with bumper plates so you can dump the weight if you miss a rep. At any rate, there is *nothing* a spotter could do to help any of these exercises.

 

[ZOOYUKA]

Only exercise that you may need a (human) spotter for is the bench press. For all others, a spotter is not helpful and likely to get in the way. I posted this in another thread, so I'm just copy/pasting it here:

* Squat: should be done in a power rack with safety rails set-up just below full squat depth. If you get in trouble, just leave the bar on the rails. Alternatively, if you have bumper plates, you can also easily dump the weight on the floor. Spotting the squat is very difficult and most people do it wrong, which actually makes things more dangerous. If you train in a PL gym with trained spotters, they can be helpful, but that isn't the case for 99.9% of the population.

* Bench: this is the one exercise where a spotter is very helpful. Alternatives are a power rack with safety rails just below your chest, doing DB bench press, or leaving the collars off and letting the weights slide off (worst case scenario, but still better than being caught under the bar).

* OH press: if you can't finish a rep, just lower the weight back to your shoulders.

* Deadlift, rows, and most slow lifts from the ground: if you can't finish a rep, just set the bar back down.

* Any o-lift (clean, snatch, jerk): best done with bumper plates so you can dump the weight if you miss a rep. At any rate, there is *nothing* a spotter could do to help any of these exercises.

Thanks for the info. How long have you been on the program? What kind of gains have you made?

 

[brikis98]

Thanks for the info.

No problem. It's worth noting all of this info is in the book and is one of the many reasons you should read it cover to cover

How long have you been on the program? What kind of gains have you made?

Unfortunately, I discovered SS too late in the game. Up until some ~3 years ago, I had spent a few years doing inefficient bodybuilding style split routines. Only when I read SS did I have an epiphany about working out for performance rather than appearance and ended up changing all my training methods. Of course, by then I had burned through all my beginner gains, so I needed an intermediate level routine. I ended up doing Bill Starr 5x5 which is very similar to SS, but is built for the trainee who can only make progress on a weekly basis (rather than daily like in SS). I made great gains on Bill Starr 5x5 (squat + 50lbs, deadlift + 80lbs, bench + 30lbs, bw + 20lbs) and since then, have moved onto Crossfit, which works towards fitness in not only strength, but also power, speed, endurance, stamina, agility, etc. I wish I had known about SS in the beginning, as I would've been stronger now and avoided the imbalances I got from BB style routines (anterior deltoid way stronger than posterior, quads way stronger than hamstrings, abs way stronger than lower back, etc) that I've spent the last few years remedying.

 

[Deeko]

I never did the Starting Strength program - by the time I read the book, I had already been lifting for several years. Its a good resource - I recommend the book more for its reference materials than for its lifting program. So yes - I would say you should read the book if you're buying it.

 

[BlackTigers]

From November, 2009, to end of January, 2010.

Weight: 157ish, like 18% (Not sure if these were my maxes, but I struggled with them)
Squat: 165x5
Dead: 245?x5
Bench: 95x5 (lol...)

to

Weight: 170, 14%
Squat: 275x5, 315x1
Deadlift: 335x5, 405x1.
Bench: 155x7 (Too scared to max)

Diet consisted of about 220g of protein a day, separated into 6 meals. Minimal cardio, massive strength gains. My whole body changes massively in two months, losing fat and gaining size everywhere (especially the quads, dear god, I was ripping once-loose jeans).

Unfortunately my knees couldn't take the stresses of squatting 3x a week, so I'm taking a few weeks off to re-coop. The program worked miracles for me, but your diet must be in order. You NEED protein on this, it's a pure raw strength builder. I did the GOMAD for some of this, and that helped a lot. I had to eat about 600 calories over maintenance to see any gains, and about 800-900 for acceptable ones. When in the gym, hit it hard.

I had a mindset everytime, especially for squats. If I didn't come close to failing the last reps of the last set, I'd up the weight and go until my body couldn't physically move the bar anymore. It was kind of an all out, animal mentality. Before my mil pressing, I'd get myself pissed off, and run up to the bar and just start beasting reps out, using every ounce of energy in me. It worked for me, the only downside is, I was always sore, always drained, and always tired.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

From November, 2009, to end of January, 2010.

Weight: 157ish, like 18% (Not sure if these were my maxes, but I struggled with them)
Squat: 165x5
Dead: 245?x5
Bench: 95x5 (lol...)

to

Weight: 170, 14%
Squat: 275x5, 315x1
Deadlift: 335x5, 405x1.
Bench: 155x7 (Too scared to max)

Diet consisted of about 220g of protein a day, separated into 6 meals. Minimal cardio, massive strength gains. My whole body changes massively in two months, losing fat and gaining size everywhere (especially the quads, dear god, I was ripping once-loose jeans).

Unfortunately my knees couldn't take the stresses of squatting 3x a week, so I'm taking a few weeks off to re-coop. The program worked miracles for me, but your diet must be in order. You NEED protein on this, it's a pure raw strength builder. I did the GOMAD for some of this, and that helped a lot. I had to eat about 600 calories over maintenance to see any gains, and about 800-900 for acceptable ones. When in the gym, hit it hard.

I had a mindset everytime, especially for squats. If I didn't come close to failing the last reps of the last set, I'd up the weight and go until my body couldn't physically move the bar anymore. It was kind of an all out, animal mentality. Before my mil pressing, I'd get myself pissed off, and run up to the bar and just start beasting reps out, using every ounce of energy in me. It worked for me, the only downside is, I was always sore, always drained, and always tired.

If squatting is seriously bothering your knees, you need to reconsider and revamp your form. Squatting really shouldn't be that hard on them. If you're squatting low, you may be sensitive to hyperflexion and might want to reduce your squat's ROM just to parallel. If that's not the prob, then I bet you're shifting your weight forward and it's putting too much stress on your knee during a particular glide movement.

 

[BlackTigers]

If squatting is seriously bothering your knees, you need to reconsider and revamp your form. Squatting really shouldn't be that hard on them. If you're squatting low, you may be sensitive to hyperflexion and might want to reduce your squat's ROM just to parallel. If that's not the prob, then I bet you're shifting your weight forward and it's putting too much stress on your knee during a particular glide movement.

I tore my left ACL twice and my right MCL, and I have this osgood schlatters BS that makes my knees swell up randomly and I lose flexibility because of that.

I keep my weight back as far as possible (GHR and box squats helped get my posterior chain strong enough to do this), and I go ATG - parallel hurts me even more when they flare up.

They just get worn out sometimes, nothing I can do about them, really. My doctors told me I have the knees of a 50 year old . Fuck football. I just need a while to let the swelling go down, and I can start working them again. I still try to do things like lunges, GHR's, reverse GHR's (I made these up, lol) to keep my legs in shape while my knees take a break. Not making excuses, just saying why they hurt like they do.

And my form on squats is not perfect, I actually had a few trainers look me over and they gave me some tips, and I worked on it accordingly. Form can always be tweaked,

 

[brikis98]

I had a mindset everytime, especially for squats. If I didn't come close to failing the last reps of the last set, I'd up the weight and go until my body couldn't physically move the bar anymore. It was kind of an all out, animal mentality. Before my mil pressing, I'd get myself pissed off, and run up to the bar and just start beasting reps out, using every ounce of energy in me. It worked for me, the only downside is, I was always sore, always drained, and always tired.

Although working out with intensity is a good thing, constantly going to failure is not a good idea and not the intention of SS. It is much harder for the body to recover from going to absolute failure, so if you are doing it multiple times per week with heavy weight, you'll actually be slowing your progress. Keep it up long enough and you'll start to see symptoms of overtraining, which is probably why you were so sore, drained and tired. In other words, consistently adding in those extra sets/reps until your body "couldn't physically move the bar" probably limited your strength gains, rather than maxing them out.

 

[BlackTigers]

Although working out with intensity is a good thing, constantly going to failure is not a good idea and not the intention of SS. It is much harder for the body to recover from going to absolute failure, so if you are doing it multiple times per week with heavy weight, you'll actually be slowing your progress. Keep it up long enough and you'll start to see symptoms of overtraining, which is probably why you were so sore, drained and tired. In other words, consistently adding in those extra sets/reps until your body "couldn't physically move the bar" probably limited your strength gains, rather than maxing them out.

With the gains I made, I can promise that it didn't limit anything.

My body trains so much better if I'm in a mental state like that, I can physically move more weight. I taxed the hell out of my CNS, and I know that's exactly why I felt like that. Nothing a de-load week can't fix. =] I might lost 5-10 pounds on my lifts over a week or two, but I'll accept that.

And it's not like I went to complete failure. If I hit my 5 reps in my last set of squats, then I'd keep going until I knew my body couldn't push one more out. I probably went to complete failure maybe 3 times throughout the course of the program, the rest of the time it just may have ended with a 7 or 8 rep set instead of a 5-rep set. I never failed on bench, once on dead lift, and on military press, if I couldn't get it, I just made it into a push press for a rep.

I just know how my body responds to things, and it worked for me. I NEVER got enough rest either, so that contributed to a lot of issues as well.

 

[brikis98]

With the gains I made, I can promise that it didn't limit anything.

My body trains so much better if I'm in a mental state like that, I can physically move more weight. I taxed the hell out of my CNS, and I know that's exactly why I felt like that. Nothing a de-load week can't fix. =] I might lost 5-10 pounds on my lifts over a week or two, but I'll accept that.

If your CNS was thrashed the entire time, there is a good chance you did limit your gains. That doesn't mean you didn't see impressive improvement but it's possible you could've ended up even stronger without the constant soreness/exhaustion/etc.

And it's not like I went to complete failure. If I hit my 5 reps in my last set of squats, then I'd keep going until I knew my body couldn't push one more out.

Uh, that is the definition of going to failure. It's not that you lift until you literally collapse (that's just reckless) - it is when you work up until the point where you are sure you could not squeeze out another rep. It is ok to do it occasionally, but doing it consistently can absolutely maul the CNS and contribute to overtraining.

At any rate, I'm glad SS worked out for you, but I wanted to make sure the OP didn't have the misconception that he should train to failure all the time.

 

[NAC]

I love SS. I'll repeat what is written most often in the SS forum: drink the milk!!! In my case, at 35 I wasn't interested in max gains and I can't grow as fast as a teenager, so I drank about 1/3 gallon for a few months. I've never been able to gain weight before - had been at 160-165 since age 25. I easily put on 5lb per month to hit about 185. So easy. Plus I ate a lot, but I've always eaten a lot without gaining.

My second feedback is:
I've had chronic, but minor back pain for about a decade. When I started SS, I would occasionally ignore a small back pain, and after squats or deadlifts it would get much worse. Then I changed - instead when I get a minor ache I'll cut out the squats/deads, and only work on bench & press & some accessory exercises as I felt up to it. That was clearly a good decision. I've tried to manage problems with stretching with only some success. Needless to say, my progress has been much slower because of my back.

Also, my back has been giving me more problems since I began SS as compared to before SS. May be coincidence as I get older. Maybe more stress. Or maybe it was at least partially because of SS. My latest optimistic theory is: because of SS my back has visibly gotten a lot stronger. But I don't think my abs have. I've done very few ab-specific exercises. I'm currently taking time off from my latest back incident which was quite severe (couldn't move for a day) and am going to be building up ab strength and making it a regular part of the program. I'll see if this helps to prevent back problems.

(And FYI - I see a chiropractor regularly, and was at an orthopedist this week. I have no major structural problems in my spine like a herniated disc. Just "normal" pains.)

 

[ZOOYUKA]

I've had the book for 2 days now. So far I am really enjoying the read. I am thoroughly impressed with the amount of details and illustrations.

 

[StepUp]

How much variation is there between SS and Stronglift's 5x5? I just started working out this week, and am curious which one is going to give me the best results?

I'm 6'1 140. Shooting for 200-220. Doing gomad + 3-4K calories/day.

 

[ZOOYUKA]

How much variation is there between SS and Stronglift's 5x5? I just started working out this week, and am curious which one is going to give me the best results?

I'm 6'1 140. Shooting for 200-220. Doing gomad + 3-4K calories/day.

I am not completely familiar with Stronglifts, but I am pretty sure it is just a modified version of Starting Strength.

Also, Starting Strength has some great explanations on how to do each exercise properly. What I have seen of Stronglifts it does not go anywhere close to the amount of detail.

 

[rasczak]

I didn't have the book, but followed the basic principles behind it by asking on different forums. I followed the 3x5 m-w-f every week for almost a year and found my gains to be tremendous. i worked with what I had thouhg as far as squats were concerned (smith machine) and so my gains my not have been so much had i been using a squat rack. nevertheless I absolutely loved the system. I haven't been to the gym much lately as my focus has been taken away by basketball, but i hope to get back in and will be using the starting strength routines one more. afterwards i think i'll want to focus more on bodybuilding, but until i reach my goals strength wise, i'll go with SS.

 

[rasczak]

How much variation is there between SS and Stronglift's 5x5? I just started working out this week, and am curious which one is going to give me the best results?

I'm 6'1 140. Shooting for 200-220. Doing gomad + 3-4K calories/day.

stronglifts iirc is more of an intermediate program. if you are just starting out, stick with SS set your strength goals and when you reach them, then think about converting to stonglifts.

 

[rasczak]

I love SS. I'll repeat what is written most often in the SS forum: drink the milk!!! In my case, at 35 I wasn't interested in max gains and I can't grow as fast as a teenager, so I drank about 1/3 gallon for a few months. I've never been able to gain weight before - had been at 160-165 since age 25. I easily put on 5lb per month to hit about 185. So easy. Plus I ate a lot, but I've always eaten a lot without gaining.

My second feedback is:
I've had chronic, but minor back pain for about a decade. When I started SS, I would occasionally ignore a small back pain, and after squats or deadlifts it would get much worse. Then I changed - instead when I get a minor ache I'll cut out the squats/deads, and only work on bench & press & some accessory exercises as I felt up to it. That was clearly a good decision. I've tried to manage problems with stretching with only some success. Needless to say, my progress has been much slower because of my back.

Also, my back has been giving me more problems since I began SS as compared to before SS. May be coincidence as I get older. Maybe more stress. Or maybe it was at least partially because of SS. My latest optimistic theory is: because of SS my back has visibly gotten a lot stronger. But I don't think my abs have. I've done very few ab-specific exercises. I'm currently taking time off from my latest back incident which was quite severe (couldn't move for a day) and am going to be building up ab strength and making it a regular part of the program. I'll see if this helps to prevent back problems.

(And FYI - I see a chiropractor regularly, and was at an orthopedist this week. I have no major structural problems in my spine like a herniated disc. Just "normal" pains.)

if these the "normal" pains a 35y/o like me has, then it's possible you're not warming up properly and stretching?

[chastise]considering how you've had back pain prior you should have known you need to do some extra warmups and stretching/cool downs to take care of your self. [/chastise]