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Star Citizen Development Discussion (Is Derek Smart Right?)

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Skel

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2001
6,072
362
136
My favorite thing about Star Citizen is that every discussion is either a delusional circle jerk about what the game promises or a circle jerk that the whole thing is a scam.
I think that's one of the things that fascinates me the most about this game. It has such a polarizing vibe to it that almost everyone either loves it or completely hates it. As it truly is something that hasn't been done before (I speak mainly of the crowdsourcing and public dev of it mostly as both are normally done behind close doors) I honestly look forward to how it all ends. The ripples from it regardless of it works or fails will be interesting.. at least to me.

Also, not gonna lie... the Faceware thing pisses me off. More tech / cool features distracting from delivering an actual fucking game.
The faceware thing confuses me more than it impresses me. I'm not sure I get the point of it, it's like the Kinect only less useful. I guess when you have money coming in like they have you can diversify the IP a bit and create things like having your computer's camera mimic your facial expressions onto your game avatar. At least that's what I'm assuming that's it.. if it's more to it, like they've reinvented the computer camera or worse the Kinect then I really don't get the point..
 

aigomorla

Cases and Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
18,290
986
126
Have you seen this rendition of your avatar?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gf31MzNgnNk

In tears.
common storm, i have asked you many times with just a slap on the wrist to not post stupid and pointless video's and gifs and you just had to break your good streak....

That video is completely pointless, you could of just convesation linked him instead of posting it and trying to poke at lurkers from the other camp....


Seriously, take note next time and not post things which have no relavance in topic.
Its already hard enough keeping the barb wire fences from both of your camps.
 

SLU Aequitas

Golden Member
Jul 13, 2007
1,252
26
91
https://clips.twitch.tv/BombasticColorfulShrewUnSane


I wasn't impressed, they added in that useless foip (why?), the fps portions look bad. It's like they take 2 steps back for every step they take forward when they keep adding all these useless things to the game that needlessly complicate things. I also loved the physics when the two space ships collided...so lifelike
Except it's been a planned feature for a while https://youtu.be/OBAb-lska_I. It's also a great feature that adds to immersion when combined with positional, in engine audio. :)
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,402
3,939
126
common storm, i have asked you many times with just a slap on the wrist to not post stupid and pointless video's and gifs and you just had to break your good streak....

That video is completely pointless, you could of just convesation linked him instead of posting it and trying to poke at lurkers from the other camp....


Seriously, take note next time and not post things which have no relavance in topic.
Its already hard enough keeping the barb wire fences from both of your camps.
it was literally his avatar. ok fair enough I could of pmed him.

Anyways that demo was scripted. Their should be laws against that level of subversion.
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,407
44
91
Seeing them wasting resources on face animations for players, at this stage of the game development, when major systems are not yet in place, pissed me off.

They are draining the backer funds on more and more stupid things, while the game progress had slowed to a snail pace.

Who needs a good Flight Model, a proper HUD/CVI, a proper ship radar, a navigation system, non-golf swing scanner, exploration, cargo, mining etc. (while the game only runs with 12 people, with massive frame drops and desync), when you can make funny faces in front of a webcam?
 
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JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,402
3,939
126
Seeing them wasting resources on face animations for players, at this stage of the game development, when major systems are not yet in place, pissed me off.

They are draining the backer funds on more and more stupid things, while the game progress had slowed to a snail pace.

Who needs a good Flight Model, a proper HUD/CVI, a proper ship radar, a navigation system, non-golf swing scanner, exploration, cargo, mining etc. (while the game only runs with 12 people, with massive frame drops and desync), when you can make funny faces in front of a webcam?
In short, the most extreme cart-before-the-horse development the world has ever seen. Chris Roberts paid several A-List Hollywood actors millions of dollars to get on camera next to his unfortunate wife, and paid tens of millions of dollars for motion capture before they had a functioning game engine and before they knew if they could use any of it.

He spent millions more creating, throwing away, recreating, re-throwing away, and creating yet again several spaceship assets before he had a functioning game engine, and with no consideration as to whether or not those assets would work with each other, the engine, or the aforementioned motion capture. Spoiler: it didn't.

He also spend untold millions of dollars building 4 studios around the world, because successful game development studios have that. The fact that real publishers earned them over time by actually creating and releasing games is lost on him.

They also spent millions of dollars creating a real-life Truman Show analogue consisting of constant video feeds, "behind the scenes", "lore", fake world assets, and thousands of hours of complete bullshit video intended to make it look like they're making progress on a "game."

What Chris did not do - what nobody in CIG has ever done - is decide what Star Citizen is. Nobody has created a game design, nobody has proposed a core game loop, nobody has considered even one single moment of gameplay or how any of this will work. It's just Chris Roberts continuing to exist as the genetic error he was born as. Stupidity is expensive.
 

rivethead

Platinum Member
Jan 16, 2005
2,581
90
91
"genetic error he was born as". Your personal attacks on CR are alarming....and probably unhealthy. But I have to admit I laughed at that one........
 

SLU Aequitas

Golden Member
Jul 13, 2007
1,252
26
91
In short, the most extreme cart-before-the-horse development the world has ever seen. Chris Roberts paid several A-List Hollywood actors millions of dollars to get on camera next to his unfortunate wife, and paid tens of millions of dollars for motion capture before they had a functioning game engine and before they knew if they could use any of it.

He spent millions more creating, throwing away, recreating, re-throwing away, and creating yet again several spaceship assets before he had a functioning game engine, and with no consideration as to whether or not those assets would work with each other, the engine, or the aforementioned motion capture. Spoiler: it didn't.

He also spend untold millions of dollars building 4 studios around the world, because successful game development studios have that. The fact that real publishers earned them over time by actually creating and releasing games is lost on him.

They also spent millions of dollars creating a real-life Truman Show analogue consisting of constant video feeds, "behind the scenes", "lore", fake world assets, and thousands of hours of complete bullshit video intended to make it look like they're making progress on a "game."

What Chris did not do - what nobody in CIG has ever done - is decide what Star Citizen is. Nobody has created a game design, nobody has proposed a core game loop, nobody has considered even one single moment of gameplay or how any of this will work. It's just Chris Roberts continuing to exist as the genetic error he was born as. Stupidity is expensive.
Now tell me, where did the bad man touch you? Sounds very personal, poor J. I can understand your need for this FUD campaign now.
 
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KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
20,966
20,080
136
In short, the most extreme cart-before-the-horse development the world has ever seen. Chris Roberts paid several A-List Hollywood actors millions of dollars to get on camera next to his unfortunate wife, and paid tens of millions of dollars for motion capture before they had a functioning game engine and before they knew if they could use any of it.

He spent millions more creating, throwing away, recreating, re-throwing away, and creating yet again several spaceship assets before he had a functioning game engine, and with no consideration as to whether or not those assets would work with each other, the engine, or the aforementioned motion capture. Spoiler: it didn't.

He also spend untold millions of dollars building 4 studios around the world, because successful game development studios have that. The fact that real publishers earned them over time by actually creating and releasing games is lost on him.

They also spent millions of dollars creating a real-life Truman Show analogue consisting of constant video feeds, "behind the scenes", "lore", fake world assets, and thousands of hours of complete bullshit video intended to make it look like they're making progress on a "game."

What Chris did not do - what nobody in CIG has ever done - is decide what Star Citizen is. Nobody has created a game design, nobody has proposed a core game loop, nobody has considered even one single moment of gameplay or how any of this will work. It's just Chris Roberts continuing to exist as the genetic error he was born as. Stupidity is expensive.
I've heard plenty of people say that they got enough entertainment out of the videos and the tech demo to make their investment worth it ;)
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,402
3,939
126
I've heard plenty of people say that they got enough entertainment out of the videos and the tech demo to make their investment worth it ;)

Croberts tricked them into thinking he knew about game development. Its like working in photoshop 1 and then taking a break for 20 years and coming back to photoshop cc.
 
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Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
5,445
146
106
The faceware thing confuses me more than it impresses me. I'm not sure I get the point of it, it's like the Kinect only less useful. I guess when you have money coming in like they have you can diversify the IP a bit and create things like having your computer's camera mimic your facial expressions onto your game avatar. At least that's what I'm assuming that's it.. if it's more to it, like they've reinvented the computer camera or worse the Kinect then I really don't get the point..
They had this a couple years back. This is simply refinement on the inital working prototype that they showed off like 4 years ago (I forget the guy's name now, but he hosted the original weekly update type videos, and ran around the office with a camera rig at times... and did a demo of it once). If you remember, Chris wanted people to have little avatars of their characters in the coms windows/overlay and wanted to sync voice with animations of lips and facial expressions. I mean, it is a great idea, but just a little pie in the sky for current network and compute requirements...
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
5,445
146
106
I wasn't impressed, they added in that useless foip (why?), the fps portions look bad. It's like they take 2 steps back for every step they take forward when they keep adding all these useless things to the game that needlessly complicate things. I also loved the physics when the two space ships collided...so lifelike
This isn't something just "added in". Chris has been talking about this feature for several years. He has wanted the game to be in charge of voice communications so that the game engine can take care of voice effects, like dealing with talking near players that anyone within hearing range will hear what is being said, or simulating COMs failure/damage/atmospheric interference/jamming etc....

Reality is we all know people will still use out of game COMs, but the intent was to be more immersive.
 

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
20,966
20,080
136
This isn't something just "added in". Chris has been talking about this feature for several years. He has wanted the game to be in charge of voice communications so that the game engine can take care of voice effects, like dealing with talking near players that anyone within hearing range will hear what is being said, or simulating COMS failure/damage/atmospheric interference/jamming etc....
it's just added in as in it's the first time they've shown it
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,407
44
91
CIG talked about a lot of things in the past. A lot. Just because there is a 2013 video about their intention of doing FoIP does not means much.

Until the Gamescom 2017 presentation day, I believe there was not a single thread about Face over IP in Spectrum. There were discussions about VoIP and CIG talked about that over the last few months.

I certainly never saw anyone asking about FoIP, not only in Spectrum, but also in the old forums in the last two years. For sure there was nothing in AtVs during the same last two years period.

Now some backers are acting as if FoIP was the most requested feature ever.
 
Last edited:

rivethead

Platinum Member
Jan 16, 2005
2,581
90
91
CIG talked about a lot of things in the past. A lot. Just because there is a 2013 video about their intention of doing FoIP does not means much.

Until the Gamescom 2017 presentation day, I believe there was not a single thread about Face over IP in Spectrum. There were discussions about VoIP and CIG talked about that over the last few months.

I certainly never saw anyone asking about such thing not only in Spectrum, but in the last two years. For sure there was nothing in AtVs from the same last two years period.

Now some backers are acting as if FoIP was the most requested feature ever.
Some backers, sure. But most (like me) had forgotten about this tech and CIG's plans. I think most people (like me) are pissed that it was a focal point of the Gamescom presentation when so many other basic, fundamental needs have been left unmentioned (i.e. we've yet to see a cargo mission.....a profession promised to come with the 3.0 build).
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,407
44
91
Yeah. Same here. Show me an Aurora with a Stor-All doing a cargo mission, not scripted combat and a ship that won't be in 3.0, nor in a lot of patches to follow 3.0 (Idris frigate).
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,407
44
91
And in the meantime, the 3.0 they told us about (at last year's Gamescom) that we'll have by December 19th 2016 has a delay after delay after delay. After delay. And another delay for good measure.
 

SLU Aequitas

Golden Member
Jul 13, 2007
1,252
26
91
the bad man touched my wallet.
I heard there's an entire SA run reddit that's dedicated to getting your money back.

plus that mission was horrible. Go get x box and bring to y place.
Mostly agree, I generally hate cargo/Euro Truck Simulator runs, although I get they're probably never going to be completely done away with.

Out of curiosity, what are some missions that stick in everyone's heads as good design within the space combat realm? I think back and could point at most of Freespace 2's campaign, but would highlight the mission where you explore Shivan space (i.e. "DIVE DIVE DIVE, HIT YOUR AFTERBURNERS PILOT"). Another one would be Starlancer's mission where you're in a captured bomber with stolen codes and manage to sneak up to within the shields of the enemy carrier before lighting off torpedoes at point blank range.

Obviously the caveat to the above is these are campaign missions, whereas we're talking about MMO fare.

And in the meantime, the 3.0 they told us about (at last year's Gamescom) that we'll have by December 19th 2016 has a delay after delay after delay. After delay. And another delay for good measure.
Did they promise it? Actually, I seem to recall CR explicitly saying he wasn't making a promise and it was just what he hoped. Totally get that it sucks waiting though, if only there were other things to do or play in the meantime...
 

Seba

Golden Member
Sep 17, 2000
1,407
44
91
Did they promise it? Actually, I seem to recall CR explicitly saying he wasn't making a promise and it was just what he hoped. Totally get that it sucks waiting though, if only there were other things to do or play in the meantime...
The "hope" part was that he hoped to not be as late as December 19th. Meaning it should come earlier than December 19th. December 19th was the worst case scenario, as presented by Chris Roberts himself.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,402
3,939
126
the code doesnt work. Its as I posted earlier. The cart before the horse game development.
 

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