SPLC admits it was wrong about Maajid Nawaz. Donates $3.375 million to his foundation.

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realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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Why "kid"? Does it trouble you that I'm an adult?
Do you need to infantilize people that disagree with how you conduct yourself so you can avoid any self-examination?

You seem fun.

No, I honestly feel like you might be around 18.

You might want to ease up on trying to psychoanalyze, you don't seem to be good at it.

As for self examination, I'm glad to, but you have only said I appear to be getting dumber. You gave no insight, no context, just that ambiguous. So, what is there to for me to examine?
 

thraashman

Lifer
Apr 10, 2000
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You're defending them. They only apologized since they were sued. Why did it take a lawsuit for them to realize how wrong and stupid they were. They thought they could attack this man and get away with it but he fought back against these cowards.
You attack anyone with an even slightly different viewpoint than you all the time. You insult, defame, accuse any and all groups you dislike. You are REGULARLY proven wrong on here with mountains of evidence. I've never once seen you admit you're wrong and apologize. So literally anyone else is a better person than you to take issue with SPLC over this.
 

pmv

Lifer
May 30, 2008
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I think he is trying to help many people in his community accept modern ideas. I'm an atheist so I disagree with him in terms of his belief in God, but I agree with the vast majority of what he appears to be doing.

This was also more than a dispute though. Maajid from your perspective is a guy that leans slightly to the right but is clearly not an extremist. Anyone that does any type of research into Maajid would quickly find that he is not anti-Muslim. Remember, the claim by the SPLC was not that he was an Islamic Extremist, but that he was anti-Muslim. So I was surprised that he was labeled anti-Muslim as a Muslim.

For the SPLC to get this so wrong, and then defend it shows they have some internal issues that need to be resolved.


They got this one wrong, and I suspect that's because there are hard-line Muslims (but not necessarily Islamists, rather those who give opposition to Islamophobia and racism top priority while downplaying or not even seeing sexism or homophoba) who are very hostile to the guy...and there are leftists who are very sympathetic to those Muslims, and those leftists in turn probably have some influence or connection to the SPLC. I suspect that might be how this happened.

It's a fraught issue, because different front-lines cross each other on this, and different people give priority to different issues. And people get very, very partisan or 'tribal'. It becomes self-perpetuating at times.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
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No, I honestly feel like you might be around 18.

You might want to ease up on trying to psychoanalyze, you don't seem to be good at it.

As for self examination, I'm glad to, but you have only said I appear to be getting dumber. You gave no insight, no context, just that ambiguous. So, what is there to for me to examine?
That maybe you are dumb and should put in some effort not to be dumb. Just my cursory takeaway there...maybe you can go deeper with it.

Also, your feelings betray you, sunshine.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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They got this one wrong, and I suspect that's because there are hard-line Muslims (but not necessarily Islamists, rather those who give opposition to Islamophobia and racism top priority while downplaying or not even seeing sexism or homophoba) who are very hostile to the guy...and there are leftists who are very sympathetic to those Muslims, and those leftists in turn probably have some influence or connection to the SPLC. I suspect that might be how this happened.

It's a fraught issue, because different front-lines cross each other on this, and different people give priority to different issues. And people get very, very partisan or 'tribal'. It becomes self-perpetuating at times.

I think that is pretty spot on in what happened. You should be careful though, because, that view is going to get you attacked here lol. Saying that Left groups mislabel people because of a personal agenda is going to get you labeled as a conservative.

Also, this was more than just a simple misunderstanding. Its one thing for an individual that knows little of a subject to get something wrong. Its massively different for a group that was started to fight against hate to get the labeling of hateful people wrong. People make mistakes, but, the SPLC should do better if it wants credibility for its agenda.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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That maybe you are dumb and should put in some effort not to be dumb. Just my cursory takeaway there...maybe you can go deeper with it.

Also, your feelings betray you, sunshine.

You are dumb. Be less dumb. Now, ruminate on that and tell me what specifics you have learned.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
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You are dumb. Be less dumb. Now, ruminate on that and tell me what specifics you have learned.
Oh, I spend a lot of time thinking about how much I don't know. I've got a wealth of ignorance.

It's clear that you do as well, so I wonder why you pretend at being smart, rather than just owning how stupid you are and opening yourself up to being less so.

Other than the SPLC, anything else in the world raising your hackles? Just curious.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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Oh, I spend a lot of time thinking about how much I don't know. I've got a wealth of ignorance.

It's clear that you do as well, so I wonder why you pretend at being smart, rather than just owning how stupid you are and opening yourself up to being less so.

Other than the SPLC, anything else in the world raising your hackles? Just curious.

That is a non sequitur. How is it that I am pretending to be smart? How do I not own my ignorance?

You seem pretty arrogant if you believe that telling me you think I'm dumb will help in any way. Explain what I got wrong, show me where I messed up, and I can reflect.

As for other things that I dislike, there is a very long list. The expansion of hatred and what that will bring is a big one. Its why I don't want to see something like the SPLC lost. Not sure why I must bring up other topics though.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
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That is a non sequitur. How is it that I am pretending to be smart? How do I not own my ignorance?

You seem pretty arrogant if you believe that telling me you think I'm dumb will help in any way. Explain what I got wrong, show me where I messed up, and I can reflect.

As for other things that I dislike, there is a very long list. The expansion of hatred and what that will bring is a big one. Its why I don't want to see something like the SPLC lost. Not sure why I must bring up other topics though.
You don't have to. I was just curious what's on you mind. You started this thread to bring attention to this subject. I wondered what else is going on with you.

Heh. I just explain how dumb I am and am still called arrogant by the guy who calls me "kid." That's fun.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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You don't have to. I was just curious what's on you mind. You started this thread to bring attention to this subject. I wondered what else is going on with you.

Heh. I just explain how dumb I am and am still called arrogant by the guy who calls me "kid." That's fun.

This is the type of thing that makes me thing you are a kid. As someone in his 30's, I have met many people that say they are dumb, and, are also very arrogant.

But again, what is it that you think makes me appear dumb in this thread? What mistake did I make?
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
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This is the type of thing that makes me thing you are a kid. As someone in his 30's, I have met many people that say they are dumb, and, are also very arrogant.

But again, what is it that you think makes me appear dumb in this thread? What mistake did I make?
Ah, 30s. That's a fun time. I hope you are enjoying it more than how you project on these boards.

As for your "mistake," I read your OP and made a comment that somehow provoked you into slamming the SPLC, which you also claim to appreciate. So no mistake was made, but your demeanor in your responses to people was that of a bully and I associate bullies with people who are dumb and feel insecure about it.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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Ah, 30s. That's a fun time. I hope you are enjoying it more than how you project on these boards.

As for your "mistake," I read your OP and made a comment that somehow provoked you into slamming the SPLC, which you also claim to appreciate. So no mistake was made, but your demeanor in your responses to people was that of a bully and I associate bullies with people who are dumb and feel insecure about it.

Again, you are bad at psychoanalyzing. How have I not shown that I have been enjoying my 30's?

Okay, so I am dumb for "slamming" the SPLC, and bulling. You then told everyone that you thought I was getting dumber, and that was to do what? It was not to help me as you clearly told me it was not addressed to me. You seem to be trying to make up a point and a justification. You seem unfocused and appear to have no ground to stand on. Enjoy your day.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
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Again, you are bad at psychoanalyzing. How have I not shown that I have been enjoying my 30's?

Okay, so I am dumb for "slamming" the SPLC, and bulling. You then told everyone that you thought I was getting dumber, and that was to do what? It was not to help me as you clearly told me it was not addressed to me. You seem to be trying to make up a point and a justification. You seem unfocused and appear to have no ground to stand on. Enjoy your day.
You keep telling me I'm bad at it, but refute none of it. I mean at least follow your own rules.

Look, be as dumb as you want, man. I just lament that you seem to be getting dumber. I don't like seeing the members of the board who strive for thoughtfulness dive deeper up their own ass.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,733
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I bet you people constantly contact SPLC saying that the things they publish about them are lies. [/QU0TE]
But we know that in one case at least the challenger was actually correct. This would be like saying we have to accept that cops will use excessive violence because so many of the people they come in contact with are not average everyday people.

Those are often lies in and of themselves so it's not at all surprising that SPLC does not take their word for it.

Not only is it not a surprise that we fall into stereotyping others based on past experience, but it seems to me your giving the SPLC some sort of pass for it is irrelevant because it's exactly, or apparently to me at least, that IS what they did. They only listened when arguments of their error was pointed out by others.

If you have some information on what process SPLC used (or didn't use!) in order to examine the truth or falsity of those counter claims that would be helpful. Without knowledge of that, saying they published lies could potentially be a defamatory statement by you of them, haha.

But we have such evidence aplenty, it seems to me:

"But after getting a deeper understanding of their views and after hearing from others for whom we have great respect, we realize that we were simply wrong to have included Mr. Nawaz and Quilliam in the Field Guide in the first place. Among those who contacted us were human rights advocates affiliated with the United Nations who emphasized that Mr. Nawaz’s work combatting extremism “is actually analogous to that of the SPLC over the years in the South.”

The ticket to refutation to what they have published seems to be the established esteem in which they hold the source. In such cases they take a second look.

Looking at the human context in which this all plays out, we have a war of good vs evil, a struggle of the left vs the right, each of which claims the moral high ground, all taking place in a competitive culture where being wrong is an anathema that has emotional consequences for the ego and what the ego attaches to as a place to hang ones hat of self respect. In this war to win comes in two forms. To be right, or to believe you are right. A third way, one requiring freedom from context, competition, would be not to need to be either. That would require the abandonment of ego attachment and the hat rack, the abandonment of good and evil at a different level of understanding.

I do think, though, that to be able to admit error, to desire real truth over self deception, is a road down which one can come to see that one is wrong, not just here and there, but about everything one has previously believed. I leave you to decide where that might lead.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
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You keep telling me I'm bad at it, but refute none of it. I mean at least follow your own rules.

Look, be as dumb as you want, man. I just lament that you seem to be getting dumber. I don't like seeing the members of the board who strive for thoughtfulness dive deeper up their own ass.

The refutation is in the implication. I am living a better life than I ever have. I'm healthy, about to get married, traveling the world, have no money problems. I am happier than I ever expected to be. I did not feel the need to say that, because, you made a baseless assumption and that should have been enough.

If you think I am getting dumber, then for the last time, explain how. Its not that hard. Further, it seems weird that you would ask that question to others.
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
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our president has been sued so many times for being a scheisty businessman it's not even funny.
 
Apr 27, 2012
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So, you've chosen to be a bitter child, then.

Yeah, they should've been better about it. But what good are you doing, exactly, by continuing to attack them after they've done the right thing? How do you think people grow and develop? They learn from mistakes. They move forward. They don't get hung up like you do.

You call me bitter child? LOL! You made false statements about me and when I slapped you down you ran away. This isnt about the SPLC for you, you're just upset and taking it out on me personally which is quite pathetic.

The problem is you're defending them, they put this man in serious danger. He is a Muslim who is trying to fix problems within his own community, how does that make him anti-Muslim? The idea that he is anti-Muslim is pure BS. It was the splc attacking for saying anything critical of Islam when he himself has the right to do it.

He could have been killed because of the splc and it was under threat of a lawsuit they had to admit they were wrong, they didn't care if his life was in danger or his reputation ruined. This is the same group of people who inspired the shooter that attacked the Family Research Council.