Source of bee die off found

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,590
86
91
www.bing.com
Very interesting article on the NYTimes about the bee die off over the past decade.

Turns out its not a virus, or a fungus, its' the combination of a virus and a fungus working in tandem.

DENVER — It has been one of the great murder mysteries of horticulture: what is killing off the honeybees?
Related Bees Vanish, and Scientists Race for Reasons (April 24, 2007)
RSS Feed Get Science News From The New York Times » . Since 2006, 20 to 40 percent of the bee colonies in the United States alone have suffered “colony collapse.” Suspected culprits ranged from pesticides to genetically modified food.
Now, a unique partnership — of military scientists and entomologists — appears to have achieved a major breakthrough: identifying a new suspect, or two.
A fungus tag-teaming with a virus have apparently interacted to cause the problem, according to a paper by Army scientists in Maryland and bee experts in Montana in the online science journal PLoS One.
Exactly how that double-whammy kills bees remains uncertain, the scientists said — a subject for the next round of research. But there are solid clues: both the virus and the fungus proliferate in cool, damp weather, and both do their dirty work in the bee gut, suggesting that insect nutrition is somehow compromised.
Liaisons between the military and academia are nothing new, of course. World War II, perhaps the most profound example, ended in a nuclear strike on Japan in 1945 largely on the shoulders of scientist-soldiers in the Manhattan Project. And Dr. Bromenshenk’s group has researched bee-related applications for the military in the past — developing, for example, a way to use honeybees in detecting land mines.
But researchers on both sides say that colony collapse may be the first time that the defense machinery of the post-Sept. 11 Homeland Security Department and academia have teamed up to address a problem that both sides say they might never have solved on their own.
“Together we could look at things nobody else was looking at,” said Colin Henderson, an associate professor in the College of Technology at the University of Montana and a member of the Bee Alert team.
Human nature and bee nature were interconnected in how the puzzle pieces came together. Two brothers helped foster communication across disciplines. A chance meeting and a saved business card proved pivotal. Even learning how to mash dead bees for analysis — a skill not taught at West Point — became a factor.
One perverse twist of colony collapse that has compounded the difficulty of solving it is that the bees do not just die — they fly off in every direction from the hive, then die alone and dispersed. That makes large numbers of bee autopsies — and yes, entomologists actually do those — problematic.
Dr. Bromenshenk’s team at the University of Montana and Montana State University in Bozeman, working with the Army’s Edgewood Chemical Biological Center northeast of Baltimore, said in their jointly written paper that the virus-fungus one-two punch was found in every killed colony the group studied. Neither agent alone seems able to devastate; together, the research suggests, they are 100 percent fatal.
“It’s chicken and egg in a sense — we don’t know which came first,” Dr. Bromenshenk said of the virus-fungus combination — nor is it clear, he added, whether one malady weakens the bees enough to be finished off by the second, or whether they somehow compound the other’s destructive power. “They’re co-factors, that’s all we can say at the moment,” he said. “They’re both present in all these collapsed colonies.”
Research several years ago at the University of California, San Francisco, had already identified the fungus as part of the problem. And several RNA-based viruses had been detected as well. But the Army/Montana team, using a new software system developed by the military for analyzing proteins, uncovered a new DNA-based virus, and established a linkage to the fungus, called N. ceranae.
“Our mission is to have detection capability to protect the people in the field from anything biological,” said Charles H. Wick, a microbiologist at Edgewood. Bees, Dr. Wick said, proved to be a perfect opportunity to see what the Army’s analytic software tool could do. “We brought it to bear on this bee question, which is how we field-tested it,” he said.
The Army software system — an advance itself in the growing field of protein research, or proteomics — is designed to test and identify biological agents in circumstances where commanders might have no idea what sort of threat they face. The system searches out the unique proteins in a sample, then identifies a virus — or other microscopic life form, like bacteria — based on the proteins it is known to contain. The power of that idea in military or bee defense is immense, researchers say, in that it allows them to use what they already know to find something they did not even know they were looking for.
But it took a family connection — through David Wick, Charles’s brother — to really connect the dots. When colony collapse became news a few years ago, Mr. Wick, a tech entrepreneur who moved to Montana in the 1990s for the outdoor lifestyle, saw a television interview with Dr. Bromenshenk about bees.
Mr. Wick knew of his brother’s work in Maryland, and remembered meeting Dr. Bromenshenk at a business conference. A retained business card and a telephone call put the Army and the Bee Alert team buzzing around the same blossom.
The first steps were awkward, partly because the Army lab was not used to testing bees, or more specifically, to extracting bee proteins.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”
The process eventually got refined. A mortar and pestle worked better then the desktop, and a coffee grinder worked best of all for making good bee paste.
Scientists in the project emphasize that their conclusions are not the final word. The pattern, they say, seems clear, but more research is needed to determine, for example, how further outbreaks might be prevented, and how much environmental factors like heat, cold or drought might play a role.
They said combination attacks in nature, like the virus and fungus involved in bee deaths, is quite common, and that one answer in protecting bee colonies might be to focus on the fungus — controllable with antifungal agents — especially when the virus is detected.
Still unsolved is what makes the bees fly off into the wild yonder at the point of death. One theory, Dr. Bromenshenk said, is that the viral-fungal combination disrupts memory or navigating skills and the bees simply get lost. Another possibility, he said, is a kind of insect insanity.
In any event, the university’s bee operation itself proved vulnerable just last year, when nearly every bee disappeared over the course of the winter.

This part had me confused:
Still unsolved is what makes the bees fly off into the wild yonder at the point of death. One theory, Dr. Bromenshenk said, is that the viral-fungal combination disrupts memory or navigating skills and the bees simply get lost. Another possibility, he said, is a kind of insect insanity.
I thought we already knew that hive type insects fled the hive when sick to avoid contaminating the rest of the hive, sort of an evolutionary defense tactic.
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
Interesting article.
Actually quite important that they have found the cause. Hopefully now they can stop it from spreading.
 

dud

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
7,635
73
91
Very interesting article/post.

There's an old saying that knowing is half the battle ... in this case it is probably more like 90%. If true, scientists now know who the enemy is and can target them with the weapons that we have at our disposal.
 

MrMatt

Banned
Mar 3, 2009
3,905
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0
VERY interesting article. I was wondering what the cause would end up being....beeing
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
29,391
2,738
126
tl;dr

so the reason bees are dying is that fly away from the hive to goto mcdonalds?

Train, u still have contacts there?
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,420
1,600
126
link?

seems similar to how all the vultures in India died
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
How interesting, I just happened to randomly read the Wiki on the subject last night.

I was reading about a certain pesticide, and it mentioned bees. Since we want to keep bees at some point, I clicked on a few links, and ended up at the Wiki.. Still have it open.. lol.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colony_Collapse_Disorder

It seems it was last majorly updated in 2009. If this article is correct, that is very good news.

The next problem is.. how do we stop it? Antivirals and fungals might work for a while, but I think that's a bad road. It would probably be better to genetically engineer a bee that is immune to these pests and release it. ;) lol....

We sure are at a strange road in our evolution. If we elect to take on any problem by genetically engineering it out of existence.. is there an end to that road? Should we really control so much? It will inevitably lead to our destruction, but it would probably be a pretty good run.. Heh.

Anyway... IMO, a major factor in this is/was disease transfer because of the way bees are transported all around now.

It seems like it was kinda the perfect storm for a massive honeybee die off. Hopefully we're out of the woods. There's a lot of BS out there, but there is a reason this phenomenon has garnered so much attention. It really would be a small scale catastrophe if bees were to become extremely scarce.

Fortunately, at least in the case of viruses and fungi, that should never be the case. We should always be able to raise some new bees in an environment known to be free of such pathogens. You would hope, at least. We have stores of seeds, just in case the shit hits the fan. What insects and animal DNA do we have archived?
 
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busydude

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2010
8,793
5
76
seems similar to how all the vultures in India died

That is a totally different cause. The vultures died due to eating cattle carcasses which have been treated with diclofenac, an anti-inflammatory drug.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,420
1,600
126
That is a totally different cause. The vultures died due to eating cattle carcasses which have been treated with diclofenac, an anti-inflammatory drug.

my post was WRT this quote

"both do their dirty work in the bee gut, suggesting that insect nutrition is somehow compromised. "
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
That is a totally different cause. The vultures died due to eating cattle carcasses which have been treated with diclofenac, an anti-inflammatory drug.

I thought they didn't eat beef in India? lol
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
How interesting, I just happened to randomly read the Wiki on the subject last night.

I was reading about a certain pesticide, and it mentioned bees. Since we want to keep bees at some point, I clicked on a few links, and ended up at the Wiki.. Still have it open.. lol.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colony_Collapse_Disorder

It seems it was last majorly updated in 2009. If this article is correct, that is very good news.

The next problem is.. how do we stop it? Antivirals and fungals might work for a while, but I think that's a bad road. It would probably be better to genetically engineer a bee that is immune to these pests and release it. ;) lol....

We sure are at a strange road in our evolution. If we elect to take on any problem by genetically engineering it out of existence.. is there an end to that road? Should we really control so much? It will inevitably lead to our destruction, but it would probably be a pretty good run.. Heh.

Anyway... IMO, a major factor in this is/was disease transfer because of the way bees are transported all around now.

It seems like it was kinda the perfect storm for a massive honeybee die off. Hopefully we're out of the woods. There's a lot of BS out there, but there is a reason this phenomenon has garnered so much attention. It really would be a small scale catastrophe if bees were to become extremely scarce.

Fortunately, at least in the case of viruses and fungi, that should never be the case. We should always be able to raise some new bees in an environment known to be free of such pathogens. You would hope, at least. We have stores of seeds, just in case the shit hits the fan. What insects and animal DNA do we have archived?


That is indeed a very intriguing query.

I've been beginning to think that we are actually quite close to clashing with that moral dilemma. Well, it's a dilemma for very good reasons - but it becomes a moral dilemma due to the existence of more fanatical religious concepts; ones that say, "don't you dare mess with genetic manipulation of animals, because that is defiling the perfect body god(s) gave us, and thus IT is a very serious sin to even propose such a radical notion!" yada yada yada, regardless of how the individual actually describes it, it all comes down to that basic little nugget of comedy.

Our future, if we desire to actually continue to rapidly increase in total population, and yet also desire an increase in life-expectancy through further medical advancements... we are certainly going to come to a hard brick wall that basically requires us to pursue such "controversial" avenues.

However, actually diving into genetic engineering... it could prove to have a serious toll on it's own. It could prove exceptionally handy, in the event we can colonize places off Earth, as a hardier body could make it far easier to care for a body anywhere on Earth or off.
 
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Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
0
0
So it wasn't cell phones like the "progressives" were bitching about.

Good to know.
 

busydude

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2010
8,793
5
76
That is indeed a very intriguing query. I've been beginning to think that we are actually quite clashing with that moral dilemma. Well, it's a dilemma for very good reasons - but it becomes a moral dilemma due to the existence of more fanatical religious concepts; ones that say, "don't you dare mess with genetic manipulation of animals, because that is defiling the perfect body god(s) gave us, and thus IT is a very serious sin to even propose such a radical notion!" yada yada yada, regardless of how the individual actually describes it, it all comes down to that basic little nugget of comedy. Our future, if we desire to actually continue to rapidly increase in total population, and yet also desire an increase in life-expectancy through further medical advancements... we are certainly going to come to a hard brick wall that basically requires us to pursue such "controversial" avenues. However, actually diving into genetic engineering... it could prove to have a serious toll on it's own. It could prove exceptionally handy, in the event we can colonize places off Earth, as a hardier body could make it far easier to care for a body anywhere on Earth or off.

This reminds me of Gattaca.

We could be having gene tests rather than dope test if that were to happen.