Sould Linux be harder or easier? Poll

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: tart666

I am a customer. I am always right. in this world, if I demand it, they will come

Apparently Linux is an anomaly in this capitalist world, where DEMAND drives products. I was wrong in my expectations about linux on the desktop. Apparently that hype was purely mass-media created. The linux developers and the turbo-dorks will make sure it stays as a niche curiosity of a code. not quite as good and stable as commercial unix, FreeBSD, etc, but cute, and customizable.

I pity the linux biggots. They will bring their own obscurity to themselves. Pretty soon they will disappear from the radar just like VMS biggots before them.

I am bored with this thread. I got everything I wanted out of this: the Demand for user-friendly linux is there, but the developers "don't give a rat's ass". Consider the discussion closed.

T

Aren't we pompus. Linux is a kernel. Your beef isn't with the kernel developers, it's with the GUI developers.

 

[drag]

IMO Windows isn't easier, it's just that it's the defacto-standard and too many people have grown up with a start button and control panel.
.

Ummm thats what I ment......

+my grandpa can use windows, but has no chance on Linux. so it is partly true and partly not that Linux is easier.....

Advanced users will find Linux much easier to use when they get use to it., but for the average user linux is still to advanced.

That's why I said that it was 'partly'[/i] a myth.

And the reason that ease of use by the uneducated matters is fairly obvious. It is important for Linux to get and maintain as large as a user base as possible. It is the most popular *nix right now because it is the most accessable OS alternative to Microsoft. Because of this Linux is able to get the money and corporate support needed to keep up the rate of growth and technological inovation that a OS needs to compete in a modern realistic world.

The popularity of Linux has definate side effects that benifit other Open Source projects. Do you honestly think that the BSD's would be were they are today if it wasn't for companies like RedHat that provide a comfortable way for users to ween themselves of off Windows and begin searching for alternative OS's to the 'alternative' Linux.

Hell I know a lot of currect *BSD users would stil be stuck hoping that IBM will continue to support OS/2 if it wasn't for Linux.

Sure there are a lot more whiners and lazy people that want easy answers for little or no effort, and bitch to other people because of their own ignorance. But that isn't the fault of people wishing to make their OS more inclusive. Its just a natural side effect of continual dependance on Microsoft products. It'll take them a little while to learn that they are not a smart or computer litterate as they once thought they were and come to enjoy the challenge of figuring things out for themselves.

 

[Nothinman]

+my grandpa can use windows, but has no chance on Linux. so it is partly true and partly not that Linux is easier.....

If someone like you set it up for him he could be fine. Infact it would probably be better because he'd have less 'spontaneous' problems and you'd be able to do any work he wanted (install apps, etc) via ssh from your house.

It is important for Linux to get and maintain as large as a user base as possible.

Important for who? I'll be using Linux as long as it does what I need, I could care less if only 3 other people in the world still use it. Especially if those 3 people are whiney brats that don't know how to look up answers for themselves on the 'net.

It is the most popular *nix right now because it is the most accessable OS alternative to Microsoft.

I don't believe you can fully explain it's popularity, frankly FreeBSD is just as accessable for end users. But for big corporations it seems to me like, crazy as it seems, the GPL is really the deciding factor. Take SGI for instance, they've donated their wonderfull XFS filesystem from IRIX over to Linux fully under the GPL. They've been asked a few times if a BSD port would ever be considered and the answer was no because they didn't want to put it under the BSD license so that Solaris 10 could include XFS support.

As a side note, I highly recommend XFS =)

Linux has more ports and that helps people who are enthusiasts for oddball hardware, like me and my Alpha (yes I know FreeBSD has an Alpha port) =)

 

[tart666]

OK, I thought this was over until another giant "useability breach"

Case in point: I gave up slack, as admittedly difficult and CLI-only oriented. Went out and spent the $80 on SuSe 8 Pro. Pretty impressive self-sufficient install and config, the printer (lj4plus) works in 3 min instead of never.

THen I go to nvidia.com for some drivers, download Suse 8.0 specific binary rpm's, install them and BAM: X is dead. I go to NVforums.net, lots of people are having this problem. The suggestion is: download source rpm's and compile the drivers. Now, I suddenly remember why I started this thread: I want to be a USER, seriously, why would a user want to recompile. Anyway, follow the instructions, the drivers refuse to compile. I am assuming my gcc or glib is not the newest.

I am not looking for help with install here, but Chaotic said before:

Your beef isn't with the kernel developers, it's with the GUI developers.

Who is my beef with now?
Nvidia?
SUSE?
XFree?
KDE?
Kernel?

anyone, anyone?

T

PS: I figured I will keep this thread alive considering my other flame war failed to materialize.

 

[Nothinman]

Who is my beef with now?

nVidia, they won't release the source to their drivers (you only get the source for a small wrapper module) so they can't be integrated with the kernel and actively maintained by a 'normal' kernel maintainer. If the RPMs they provide don't work, who else's fault could it be?

Would you consider yelling at MS if nVidia's driver setup.exe failed to run in Windows?

I want to be a USER,

Seems like you already are, stop smoking so much of whatever you have and put a little effort forth.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Complain to nVidia and make them play nice. They want to barely support the linux community, these problems are going to occur. There is a FAQ on nVidia driver installation in the Linux FAQ thread, I hope it helps. If not, create a thread, we can try and help (and add to the FAQ when we get solutions).

 

[ProviaFan]

Let Mandrake keep getting easier for the newbies, but Debain and Slackware can be for us hardcore linux types. No one Linux distro can hope to suit everyone. Just IMHO.

 

[Tiger]

I know several people who have dumped MS from the desktop completely and gone Linux.
Linux is a viable desktop solution.
There is an entire generation of "users" out there that still can't get around in Windows much less Linux.
Quit blaming the OS's and blame the appliance operators that "demand" the computer hold their hand for them.

I could install Linux on my parents computers and get them up and running on the net in less than an hour.
Once I showed them how to use the programs there would be NO functional difference between Mandy and Win98 as far as they're concerned. Are they "users"? Yes. Are they power users or geeks? Hell no.