Social Security for illegals? Closer than you think..

[Engineer]

Click me!

Entitlements: About to become law is an agreement allowing illegal aliens to get Social Security benefits after only 18 months of employment in the U.S., further burdening a system on the brink of collapse.

Surveys have shown that more Americans believe in the existence of unidentified flying objects than in the promise that they'll ever get back what they've put into the Social Security system. It also is against current law for employers knowingly to hire individuals who are in this country illegally.

So it must be somewhat disconcerting for them to find out that about to become law is an agreement signed on June 29, 2004, between the U.S. Commissioner of Social Security and the director general of the Mexican Social Security Institute that allows illegal aliens to collect Social Security benefits if they have as little as 18 months of employment history. U.S. citizens must show 10 years, or 40 quarters of job history, to collect benefits.

The first public copy of the U.S.-Mexico Totalization Agreement has been obtained, and, no, it wasn't on the first page of the New York Times. It was obtained after three years of wrangling and a Freedom of Information Act request by the TREA Senior Citizens League (tscl.org) which represents more than 1 million seniors. And, as the saying goes, the devil is in the details.

The agreement, which awaits President Bush's signature, can take effect without Congress' approval. All the Democratic Congress has to do is nothing. It doesn't have to vote to approve it -- it has only 60 days to disapprove it, which isn't likely because they likely support allowing it to become law.

First, I'm not a big fan of SS but I highly doubt that much is going to change until the damn thing is in a huge bind, but I find it a huge slap in the face that not only can people who aren't supposed to be hired can gain SS, but they can gain it in only 18 months (didn't notice payout level) while the US citizen must work for 10 years to get it (I know that many get it without working at all, but that's another thread). Am I reading the above wrong or is the agreement just wrong? Your thoughts?

 

[laFiera]

Being a us citizen is really a liability nowadays! 🙂

So it must be somewhat disconcerting for them to find out that about to become law is an agreement signed on June 29, 2004, between the U.S. Commissioner of Social Security and the director general of the Mexican Social Security Institute that allows illegal aliens to collect Social Security benefits if they have as little as 18 months of employment history. U.S. citizens must show 10 years, or 40 quarters of job history, to collect benefits.
story

 

[Slackware]

"us and them"?

From the US that has no nationality or even a state language that is nothing but..

I would have written laughable, but it feels kinda like you don't have the guts to admit that you are a county of immigrants and nothing else, you HAVE NO nationality nor will you ever get one, it's a bunch of people, poor and rich, steelworkers and lawyers who tow together.

And you idiots do the best you can to tear the country apart by claiming rich for rich even though people who were poorer than ****** made it and poor for poor even though the poor was the rich during the IT boom.

You just go with the flow, don't you? I'm old now but not old enough to understand the hatred of Americans.

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: Slackware
"us and them"?

From the US that has no nationality or even a state language that is nothing but..

I would have written laughable, but it feels kinda like you don't have the guts to admit that you are a county of immigrants and nothing else, you HAVE NO nationality nor will you ever get one, it's a bunch of people, poor and rich, steelworkers and lawyers who tow together.

And you idiots do the best you can to tear the country apart by claiming rich for rich even though people who were poorer than ****** made it and poor for poor even though the poor was the rich during the IT boom.

You just go with the flow, don't you? I'm old now but not old enough to understand the hatred of Americans.

If that's the case, then why should illegals have SS eligibility after only 18 months and full citizens must work 10 years? So you're saying that illegal (notice the word illegal) emigrants should be able to receive benefits easier than those who are full citizens?

I'm not exactly sure what you're babbling about to be honest.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Sweet! We're finally going to get Social Security reform! :disgust:

 

[blackllotus]

Originally posted by: Slackware
"us and them"?

From the US that has no nationality or even a state language that is nothing but..

Who are you quoting?

Originally posted by: Slackware
You just go with the flow, don't you? I'm old now but not old enough to understand the hatred of Americans.

Hatred? I would say more like arrogance.

 

[MonkeyK]

I find SS to be a prudent and noble program. I say this based on my understanding of what SS should be (a comprehensive safety net for those who can no longer make a living by working, either by reason of age or disability as well as those depending on such people). We should come to agreement on what its purpose is and fix it to achieve that purpose.

That said, one would have to understand just what it means to say that illegals get SS. From what I read it sounds like if there were contributions on behalf of the illegal, they would be returned with interest. This is hardly a rediculous proposal if the illegal was not going to get benefits anyway.

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: MonkeyK
I find SS to be a prudent and noble program. I say this based on my understanding of what SS should be (a comprehensive safety net for those who can no longer make a living by working, either by reason of age or disability as well as those depending on such people). We should come to agreement on what its purpose is and fix it to achieve that purpose.

That said, one would have to understand just what it means to say that illegals get SS. From what I read it sounds like if there were contributions on behalf of the illegal, they would be returned with interest. This is hardly a rediculous proposal if the illegal was not going to get benefits anyway.

That being said, then everyone should have the option of getting it back and not have to work 10 years to do so, if that's the case.

 

[MonkeyK]

Originally posted by: Engineer

Originally posted by: MonkeyK
I find SS to be a prudent and noble program. I say this based on my understanding of what SS should be (a comprehensive safety net for those who can no longer make a living by working, either by reason of age or disability as well as those depending on such people). We should come to agreement on what its purpose is and fix it to achieve that purpose.

That said, one would have to understand just what it means to say that illegals get SS. From what I read it sounds like if there were contributions on behalf of the illegal, they would be returned with interest. This is hardly a rediculous proposal if the illegal was not going to get benefits anyway.

That being said, then everyone should have the option of getting it back and not have to work 10 years to do so, if that's the case.

tourshay.

However you do get to participate and currently you or your spouse and dependants qualify for benefits if you experience a qualifying event. I would guess that an illegal would not qualify for those same benefits.

 

[techs]

Uh, how come this is nowhere exept in Investors Business Daily and Immigration News Daily????
I smell an internet rat.
I doubt this is the full and true story. This is a piece citing another website that it says has analyzed some documents obtained via Freedom of Information act and that they have found a secret agenda. And I read the article on tsla.org and they are TALKING ABOUT A LOOPHOLE THEY CLAIM TO HAVE FOUND THAT WOULD ONLY AFFECT ANYONE IF A GUEST WORKER PROGRAM WERE TO EVER BE STARTED IN THE US. I smell tin foil hats in this thread.
Perhaps if you had a reliable source?

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: techs

Perhaps if you had a reliable source?

I don't know if it's true or not, I posted it because it's on Yahoo News from IBD. Maybe it's bogus or not. If it's not bogus, do you feel that it's ok (based on reading the article)?

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: Engineer

Originally posted by: techs

Perhaps if you had a reliable source?

I don't know if it's true or not, I posted it because it's on Yahoo News from IBD. Maybe it's bogus or not. If it's not bogus, do you feel that it's ok (based on reading the article)?

His post seems pretty angry at you for even suggesting it's real, lol.

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by: Engineer

Originally posted by: techs

Perhaps if you had a reliable source?

I don't know if it's true or not, I posted it because it's on Yahoo News from IBD. Maybe it's bogus or not. If it's not bogus, do you feel that it's ok (based on reading the article)?

I'd say it's either completely bogus, or a distortion. I remember from the Senate debates last year there was discussion that if some sort of way was devised to let illegal aliens eventually become citizens, and if they had paid into Social Security while they were illegal aliens, they ought to be able to claim those benefits.

So maybe this article is talking about some proposal that people who earned the right to become citizens would have to work 18 months after they became citizens, but they still would have to meet the same total amount of quarters as everyone else. Just that the quarters they paid into SS while they were illegal would count toward the 40 quarters.

I'm just speculating that something like that could be the source of this article, I don't know that it is.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: Engineer

Originally posted by: techs

Perhaps if you had a reliable source?

I don't know if it's true or not, I posted it because it's on Yahoo News from IBD. Maybe it's bogus or not. If it's not bogus, do you feel that it's ok (based on reading the article)?

His post seems pretty angry at you for even suggesting it's real, lol.

I do get sort of ticked when people see some wild allegation on the net and just assume is postworthy.
I was going to mention that it did make Yahoo News too, but Yahoo News has picked up some wacky stories before. I did want to make the point that I did read the article, checked out the "sources" and there is really NOTHING to this.
So don't take it personal.
I just want to EMPHASIZE THAT THIS IS A BOGUS NEWS STORY AND LETS MOVE ON.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: Slackware
"us and them"?

From the US that has no nationality or even a state language that is nothing but..

Tell me I don't have a country, and I'll tell you over my dead body.

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: Slackware
"us and them"?

From the US that has no nationality or even a state language that is nothing but..

I would have written laughable, but it feels kinda like you don't have the guts to admit that you are a county of immigrants and nothing else, you HAVE NO nationality nor will you ever get one, it's a bunch of people, poor and rich, steelworkers and lawyers who tow together.

And you idiots do the best you can to tear the country apart by claiming rich for rich even though people who were poorer than ****** made it and poor for poor even though the poor was the rich during the IT boom.

You just go with the flow, don't you? I'm old now but not old enough to understand the hatred of Americans.

Someone has Daddy issues

 

[BlancoNino]

I'm not an expert on this subject, and I'm not trying to talk out of my ass here, but I would like to ask a simple question and please forgive me for straying off topic, but...

If the United States has no real nationality or culture, then why are there so many stereotypes about Americans? Are hot dogs, baseball, american football, the american rock n roll groups and bands, blonde voloptuous women, American Eagle/Abercrombie style of clothing, hunting, fishing, etc not part of our nationality and culture?

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
I'm not an expert on this subject, and I'm not trying to talk out of my ass here, but I would like to ask a simple question and please forgive me for straying off topic, but...

If the United States has no real nationality or culture, then why are there so many stereotypes about Americans? Are hot dogs, baseball, american football, the american rock n roll groups and bands, blonde voloptuous women, American Eagle/Abercrombie style of clothing, hunting, fishing, etc not part of our nationality and culture?

We have no culture/nationality.... but almost everyone wants to be us anyway.

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
I'm not an expert on this subject, and I'm not trying to talk out of my ass here, but I would like to ask a simple question and please forgive me for straying off topic, but...

If the United States has no real nationality or culture, then why are there so many stereotypes about Americans? Are hot dogs, baseball, american football, the american rock n roll groups and bands, blonde voloptuous women, American Eagle/Abercrombie style of clothing, hunting, fishing, etc not part of our nationality and culture?

hell yes. so is Hollywood, South Park, jazz, the Navaho, long haul truckers, bonneville salt flats, topless bars, firemen running into burning buildings, county fairs, badass rappers, Amish people, old hippies, rolling into Waffle House at 3 am.

Long live America..

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
I'm not an expert on this subject, and I'm not trying to talk out of my ass here, but I would like to ask a simple question and please forgive me for straying off topic, but...

If the United States has no real nationality or culture, then why are there so many stereotypes about Americans? Are hot dogs, baseball, american football, the american rock n roll groups and bands, blonde voloptuous women, American Eagle/Abercrombie style of clothing, hunting, fishing, etc not part of our nationality and culture?

Actually America is the tired, the poor, the huddled masses yearning to breathe free.
Or to put it more succintly we are the "wretched refuse" of the world.

btw I seem to recall Investors Business Daily is one of the wacky NewsMax affiliated sites. For those who don't know about this its a right wing, far, far, right wing nutjob who has started a couple of hundred websites where he posts completely unsubstantiated or highly misleading "news" stories which people think are real due to how well done the sites are. It gives him a large readership for his editorials where, among other things, he advocates the murder of all homosexuals in America in order to save America from the homosexual conspiracy.