So...with this DTV transition on Feb 17 2009...

[JC86]

I agree with LTC8K6 100% . . . i put in a small flatpanel in the bathroom by the tub and since I had nowhere to put a STB and didn't want to pay the extra $$ for another box from Dish, decided to get a antenna and see what I can get OTA, there are a surprising number of channels OTA in the Socal area but with the DTV, it's either perfect picture or unwatchable TV. Weird thing is, big stations like NBC drop out randomly. I'm getting a slingcatcher and slinging my DVR and see how that goes.

 

[Sasiki]

I have had OTA for a year. It's fine.. and it's free. Some of the stations do cut out every now and then though. Maybe when the digital transition is done, they'll increase transmitter power.

And for the antenna comment, you don't need a new antenna. Yours will work fine. I'm using a cheap Phillips, NON amplified with 1 adjustment knob.

 

[Cogman]

Originally posted by: ICRS

Originally posted by: Cogman
It seems like every other day I have to answer my parents questions about it. They have a VHF antenna, no UHF. So I tell them "Even with an adapter you won't get anything without a new antenna". So every week, like clockwork. "So, I saw a commercial that says you just have to get a converter box and you'll be fine with existing setups." And again I have to explain to them that UHF and VHF are broadcast at different frequencies.

My parents aren't thick, just not technologically inclined (like 99% of the world). Most likely enough station will have shut off by the 17th that most people will already be complaining. I know of at least a few locally that are shutting off their analog broadcast before the deadline.

Hate to break it to you, but digital broadcast isn't limited to UHF, and many stations will still broadcast in VHF even after Feburary 3, I know a few here that will be.

Hmm, interesting, I thought VHF was going to be abandoned all together. Guess I was wrong there. At very least all my local stations (all 3 of them, yeay rural Idaho!) are going to UHF exclusively, so as far as my parents are concerned it is dead.

 

[Shawn]

I'm willing to bet that at least half of the people who get antenna TV have no idea their TVs are going to go dark.

 

[Shawn]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
People are going to be pissed because OTA DTV will be a bad experience for most people, imo.

When the analog signal gets a little poor, you get a little fuzz, but you can still watch and enjoy.

With DTV you get that irritating blockiness and loss of sound, or instant total dropout, both of which make the program pretty much unwatchable. The shift from perfect to intolerable is always instant and total.

I have an OTA DTV receiver in my office. It's the most frustrating thing trying to watch.

It goes from crystal clear perfect to unwatchable in a blink.

The same thing happens with the receiver I have at home.

I have digital cable. I bought the newer TV's to see what the over the air digital was like.

Unless they improve it a lot, I can't see why they bothered.

When I was in Philly over the holidays I saw the same theme play out at my Aunt's house with a Digital OTA box. My Aunt has cable, but she was going to use the box on a back bedroom set. Another very frustrating experience with random dropouts and blockiness from otherwise crystal clear reception.

She decided to forget about the box and have cable put in for the back bedroom.

Not ready for prime time if you ask me.

When the switch to digital happens bandwidth all the stations will transmit digital at full power.

 

[LTC8K6]

When the switch to digital happens bandwidth all the stations will transmit digital at full power.

Documentation?

One would think that answer would be given to complaints about the DTV reception. I haven't heard it yet.

 

[0roo0roo]

anyone crying about losing their tv on that day lol good way to weed out the stupids.

and yes on that day u get to rescan. some stations are using secondary antennas and such for digital right now. the switch will free them to use their good stuff.

as for reception. in bay area with roof top antenna i get a buttload of channels+subchannels, all crystal clear. no blockiness or dropouts.

 

[LTC8K6]

I doubt they are not already broadcasting at full strength in digital.

If they weren't, they would be telling us to be patient and wait until they went to full strength.

 

[Cogman]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I doubt they are not already broadcasting at full strength in digital.

If they weren't, they would be telling us to be patient and wait until they went to full strength.

I actually don't doubt it. The reason is simple, digital stations overlap the frequencies of their analog counterparts. If you broadcast them too loud you introduce single degradation to the analog channels (The entire reason we are doing this whole complete digital switch). At very least, the digital channels will have less noise when the analog channels go out, resulting in a stronger signal.

Its like when you have a giant group of people all using the same wireless channels (or a small range of them, IE 1, 2, 3, 4) it causes the wireless as a whole to perform worse because of the noise.

 

[LTC8K6]

I have read all sorts of reviews of the boxes, pages from the stations about the transition and how to receive the signal and I cannot recall any mention of this as a possible reason for why the signal might be poor.

In fact our local stations appear to have put the digital broadcast on new antennas and relgated the analog to older equipment.

WRAL 5 apparently did this around the end of September.

 

[LTC8K6]

Since it's digital, if we have a signal at all, we should have a perfect picture.

Transmitter power is likely not the problem if we are getting a perfect picture some of the time.

 

[LTC8K6]

I can't explain the digital cliff to my parents...

 

[I Saw OJ]

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: I Saw OJ
I'm gonna need a new antenna I know that, I can only get some stations in analog

/facepalm

your current antenna will do just fine. You simply need an ATSC tuner. plug cheapo aluminum foil antenna into tuner, tuner into TV; viola, you're all digital.

I already get digital channels, what I was saying is some stations the signal isnt strong enough for my current antenna to pick up their digital broadcast, so I only get analog, so I need a new antenna.

 

[Pocatello]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
People are going to be pissed because OTA DTV will be a bad experience for most people, imo.

When the analog signal gets a little poor, you get a little fuzz, but you can still watch and enjoy.

With DTV you get that irritating blockiness and loss of sound, or instant total dropout, both of which make the program pretty much unwatchable. The shift from perfect to intolerable is always instant and total.

I have an OTA DTV receiver in my office. It's the most frustrating thing trying to watch.

It goes from crystal clear perfect to unwatchable in a blink.

The same thing happens with the receiver I have at home.

I have digital cable. I bought the newer TV's to see what the over the air digital was like.

Unless they improve it a lot, I can't see why they bothered.

When I was in Philly over the holidays I saw the same theme play out at my Aunt's house with a Digital OTA box. My Aunt has cable, but she was going to use the box on a back bedroom set. Another very frustrating experience with random dropouts and blockiness from otherwise crystal clear reception.

She decided to forget about the box and have cable put in for the back bedroom.

Not ready for prime time if you ask me.

Excellent point. A lot of times I can watch ABC and NBC in glorious HD, the next minute, jerkiness, in clear weather with 100% reception. Another thing, my local Fox affiliate broadcasts in 480i, in digital. I was so excited about watching football in HD, not to be.

 

[Pardus]

I read about 25% of people in the usa still use rabbit ears on there TV with no cable, satellite, or converter box.

 

[Colt45]

I'm sure there'll be riots in the hills of Tennessee.

 

[Bateluer]

I don't have a TV at all yet, so it won't effect me.

 

[Shadowknight]

Originally posted by: eelw
But who is still using OTA?

I've been using it since 1998.

 

[Cogman]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Since it's digital, if we have a signal at all, we should have a perfect picture.

Transmitter power is likely not the problem if we are getting a perfect picture some of the time.

In one post, you complain that your DTV works fine some of the time and then sucks every so often, in the next you say it only needs a weak signal to be perfect...

A stronger signal REMOVES the jerkyness from the signal making it more watchable. I wasn't saying that it would give a better picture (for digital). Its just like a wireless internet connection, the stronger the signal you have, the less likely you are to suffer from dropped packets. For digital, it is either all there or not there at all. There is no middle ground like there is in analog.

Its not like the receiver can just pull data from the air regardless of what it is. Digital needs its data integrity just like analog does, only more so because you are getting that crystal clear picture.

 

[yowolabi]

My mom still uses OTA. I ordered a couple of coupons last March, waited a few months for them to arrive, then had to pre-order a convertor box from Sears because no one had the boxes in stock in the Chicago-city area. I checked Radio Shack, Bestbuy, Sears, and Target before I gave up. The original arrival date of 3 weeks was pushed back an additional two weeks.

When I went and hooked the boxes up, my mom said she had seen the commercials but didn't really believe them. She doesn't use the internet and couldn't check the websites, and it seemed like they were trying to sell her something. She still doesn't use the converters because CBS which gets a weak signal through analog, won't come through at all digitally. This is with a quality amplified antenna. I guess I can try a different type of antenna to see if that helps. She also gets confused with multiple remote controls.

To summarize, if I had left this up to my mom, she'd be stuck. She's not stupid, just not technically inclined.... she originally was an accountant. I'm hoping that more converter boxes are in stock now, but previously it took way too long to get them. Even with me buying and setting them up myself, she still isn't using them, and will need a new antenna and a universal remote capable of controlling the converter box before this makes sense to her.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: eelw
But who is still using OTA?

I am. My TV bill is $0.00 a month. How much is yours?

I get clean digital TV for free. 720p or 1080i for most channels, and I don't have to pay extra for HD or have a box. You?

 

[0roo0roo]

well my neighbors are very old, 70+ they figured it out. it depends on the person.
if your mom doesnt know how it works and gets confused, buy her a new tv.
one remote control.
i installed one for a relative.
i removed the analog connection from the tv altogether so they have no choice and so will be less likely to get confused since seeing snow is pretty clear you are on the wrong input.

 

[yowolabi]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
well my neighbors are very old, 70+ they figured it out. it depends on the person.
if your mom doesnt know how it works and gets confused, buy her a new tv.
one remote control.
i installed one for a relative.
i removed the analog connection from the tv altogether so they have no choice and so will be less likely to get confused since seeing snow is pretty clear you are on the wrong input.

Seeing as how she watches 4 channels, and neither she nor I has money to burn, i'm going to explore the universal remote option first. A new tv is an option down the line, but not by February.

I set everything to digital originally in August. I changed it back upon request since she couldn't get CBS. I don't think a new tv will help that either.

I'll work these problems out. I just wanted to help people understand that there will be a significant number of people with problems, and why.

 

[Goosemaster]

I don't even have a TV so I don't care

 

[Linflas]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
well my neighbors are very old, 70+ they figured it out. it depends on the person.
if your mom doesnt know how it works and gets confused, buy her a new tv.
one remote control.
i installed one for a relative.
i removed the analog connection from the tv altogether so they have no choice and so will be less likely to get confused since seeing snow is pretty clear you are on the wrong input.

I would bet that for every "80 year old shut in" there is a clueless about the world outside of a cellphone 18 year old that will be equally surprised.