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So the rich do actually pay more taxes. MUCH more

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borosp1 said:
The ultra rich are mostly generating there income from investments and not labor. They are actually called the investment class and because of asset allocation strategy to utilize low taxes on investments most ultra rich pay a much lower tax rate than those in the working class. The multimillionaire who like Mitt Romney can generate most of there wealth through investments like tax free municipal bond funds, Qualified dividend, and long term capital gains. As well as having a domicile in a TAX-FREE state like Texas, Florida, Nevada, or Washington boosts there individual income and lowers the total tax liability.

I really get mad when all these arguments only take in account labor income and not investment income which disproportionately rich individuals take part in vs. middle class which need their income for living expense. So if your honest in looking at total income (investment and labor) and total tax liability % the rich do not pay more than middle class individuals.
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Yes they do. The chart proves it. The middle class pay very little in federal income taxes.
 
spidey07 said:
Yes they do. The chart proves it. The middle class pay very little in federal income taxes.
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Did you realize any chart or economic statistic can be shown one sides opinion doesn't make it true. For example the 1 economic statistic always quoted is the unemployment rate which is not a TRUE measure of the working public.

The chart doesn't show that most wealthy individuals make most of their income from investments (ie capital gains & Qualified Dividends which is taxed at 15%). Also there are tax loopholes like carried interest which Mitt Romney took advantage off. The middle class has little or no wealth generation through equities (investments) and most income for middle class is generated from labor which is taxed at a higher rate.
 
Jhhnn said:
Yada, yada, yada. Standard duh-versionary propaganda.

Enormous incomes are not earned through working, but rather investing. That investment requires wealth- earned, inherited or leveraged. Not everybody has that, nor can we all obtain it simultaneously. Your pablum doesn't apply.

A great deal of income is earned by dint of ownership rather than work. People who are extremely wealthy don't necessarily manage their empires personally, at all. They hire people to do it. Their sole claim to that income is ownership of the means to produce it.

Middle class conceptualizations of work & reward simply do not apply.

A lot of factors beyond our control influence our paths in life & our incomes, as well. Family background. Native talent & intelligence. Opportunity. The notion that we all have equal opportunity is a joke. If we did, GWB probably would have been the town drunk somewhere in Texas.

The notion that the enormous concentration of wealth & income achieved over the last 35 years has no effect on the rest of America is equally absurd. It's a form of hoarding.

None of this is about me personally, so you'd do well not to pretend that it is. I've done well, in part because I've been lucky to have the opportunities afforded by New Deal America when I was younger man. Opportunities for younger people are much scarcer, in no small part because opportunity been concentrated along with wealth & income in this brave new world of trickle down Reaganomics.
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Complete and utter ownage. Couldn't help noticing how the conservative cockroaches scuttled back to their fetid caves when faced with this immaculate and spot on analysis. Well done sir.
 
^ LOL. No one of any intelligence whatsoever pays any attention to that hack. Keep dreaming.
 
bshole said:
Complete and utter ownage. Couldn't help noticing how the conservative cockroaches scuttled back to their fetid caves when faced with this immaculate and spot on analysis. Well done sir.
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You flatter me. It's more like badgers, really. Once they're backed into their hole of denial, snarling at the entrance, further discourse is impossible. They'll fight to maintain their belief structure rather than recognize it as irrational. See below.

Zaap said:
^ LOL. No one of any intelligence whatsoever pays any attention to that hack. Keep dreaming.
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bshole said:
Well I pay attention to his writings.
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The sad thing is you fail to realize that if Jhhnn had his way your assets would be long gone, much like the war you declared on the rich/yourself. You would still get to keep your job but your salary would be $40,000/year.
 
Matt1970 said:
The sad thing is you fail to realize that if Jhhnn had his way your assets would be long gone, much like the war you declared on the rich/yourself. You would still get to keep your job but your salary would be $40,000/year.
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Heh. Wing nuts believe the most amazing & stupid shit in an effort to maintain denial, even resorting to outright lies of false attribution.

Quote me on that if you would, sir. Or get back in your hole.
 
Jhhnn said:
Yada, yada, yada. Standard duh-versionary propaganda.

Enormous incomes are not earned through working, but rather investing. That investment requires wealth- earned, inherited or leveraged. Not everybody has that, nor can we all obtain it simultaneously. Your pablum doesn't apply.

A great deal of income is earned by dint of ownership rather than work. People who are extremely wealthy don't necessarily manage their empires personally, at all. They hire people to do it. Their sole claim to that income is ownership of the means to produce it.

Middle class conceptualizations of work & reward simply do not apply.

A lot of factors beyond our control influence our paths in life & our incomes, as well. Family background. Native talent & intelligence. Opportunity. The notion that we all have equal opportunity is a joke. If we did, GWB probably would have been the town drunk somewhere in Texas.

The notion that the enormous concentration of wealth & income achieved over the last 35 years has no effect on the rest of America is equally absurd. It's a form of hoarding.

None of this is about me personally, so you'd do well not to pretend that it is. I've done well, in part because I've been lucky to have the opportunities afforded by New Deal America when I was younger man. Opportunities for younger people are much scarcer, in no small part because opportunity been concentrated along with wealth & income in this brave new world of trickle down Reaganomics.
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A large pile of hate, envy and greed is hardly what most of us would call doing well.
 
Matt1970 said:
The sad thing is you fail to realize that if Jhhnn had his way your assets would be long gone, much like the war you declared on the rich/yourself. You would still get to keep your job but your salary would be $40,000/year.
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You wouldn't even have an income. Government would own your labor, and government would give you what it wants you to have.

Of course, people like him would be well-compensated for the burden of making everyone's decisions.
 
Every time you eat or drive a car or go to a doctor or watch TV or use a phone or drink alcohol, or smoke cigarettes You are paying a tax.
 
Jhhnn said:
Heh. Wing nuts believe the most amazing & stupid shit in an effort to maintain denial, even resorting to outright lies of false attribution.

Quote me on that if you would, sir. Or get back in your hole.
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Yes you do comrade. Keep up the good work. There will be a little something extra on your food tray tonight.
 
bshole said:
Screw that, tax them a Raping the Poor Tax. I figure it would be 2% of their entire estate yearly, followed by a 95% death tax.
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You rape the poor with your fat retirement account, hypocrite. Your personal assets place you too far above the average, so you're fucked. :colbert:
 
werepossum said:
A large pile of hate, envy and greed is hardly what most of us would call doing well.
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When your arguments prove empty, just work up a little self righteous moral outrage, attribute your own failings to others. It's a very pure form of denial.
 
Matt1970 said:
Yes you do comrade. Keep up the good work. There will be a little something extra on your food tray tonight.
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Merely persisting with false accusations in no way supports the original slander. You discredit yourself in ways that I don't have the cruelty to do myself. If you were only half as smart as you think you are, you'd be embarrassed by your own bullshit.
 
Jhhnn said:
Merely persisting with false accusations in no way supports the original slander. You discredit yourself in ways that I don't have the cruelty to do myself. If you were only half as smart as you think you are, you'd be embarrassed by your own bullshit.
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Your irony is beyond measure.
 
werepossum said:
You wouldn't even have an income. Government would own your labor, and government would give you what it wants you to have.

Of course, people like him would be well-compensated for the burden of making everyone's decisions.
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When you find a lie you like, latch on, embellish it, try to tarbrush your way around the truth.

It's so noble, so fitting, so true to your character & values.
 
Matt1970 said:
Your irony is beyond measure.
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Where's that quote? You know, the one you need to substantiate your scurrilous accusations.

A man of your integrity & mental acumen should be able to produce it. Or not, given the huge delta between what is actually presented & how you choose to interpret it through an internal lens created by the absorption of enormous amounts of propaganda.
 
IndyColtsFan said:
Jhhnn is my #1 too -- I get a good laugh out of his posts, which are all of the #2 variety.
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Perhaps you'd care to, uhh, you know, actually address them rather than to deny their validity.

That real distinction is apparently lost on on you, denial & labeling being a much more convenient & emotionally satisfying alternative.

Rush would be so proud of the work he & his friends have done on your heads, the way they get you to fall into emotional traps limiting your intellects to circular reasoning of denial.
 
To me it just comes down to how much it hurts. So if one guy is paying a higher percentage taxes and can still go buy a yaht for fun than someone else who pays lower but once paid has no fun money then sure there is a large difference there, that not being the wealth but the fact that one doesn't actually suffer in terms of their lifestyle ratio.
Maybe fairness ideally would be in that everyone would hurt to the same degree but it's not feasible nor logical really.
I owed for the first time ever without change in income and sure it sucks, no fun money into the economy from me but that's life.
 
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