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So replacing cokes with ice water is an excellent first step to losing weight?

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Lol, there goes alkemyst trolling again.

WTF?


dude seriously don't doubt me because you journey through life doing it wrong or have lunger's genetics.

Fuck I just got a dog in July and dropped 30lbs walking him in two months doing nothing else.

My body wants to go to around 220 without activity...even with a major diet. Once I do simple things I drop to 190. Oddly as I start lifting more I don't really lose much from there. If I go on a rip I will hit 180ish, dropping to 175ish to get freaky.

Diet coke despite having zero calories extends my gut. If I am drinking it regularly my weight will be the same, but it looks like I am 20lbs heavier.

Currently for each diet coke I try to drink a 1.9L bottle between them. I usually have 2-3 straight in the morning and then another 2-3 during the day and about 2-3 of the waters.

at night another few cokes/maybe one bottle of water.
 
I'm talking about water out of the tap and then just throwing some ice in there. Is that a lot healthier than drinking cokes(I drink like 2-3 a day, can get up to like 5-6)? Will doing that alone help me lose weight?

i stopped drinking Sierra Mist, Root Beer, and tea with lots of honey in it on Oct. 28, 2008, because of a REAL bad dental appointment (8 cavities + threatened 2nd crown replacement).

then i had a regular doctor appointment in Jan. 2009, and had lost about 8 pounds.

which i have since gained back - even though i stuck with the program - and didn't change my diet.

as far as water from the tap - look up "sodium fluoride". it's used as rat poison. the Nazi's fed it prisoners to make them more docile. and it's in our drinking water, obviously in lower doses.

do you have well water where you live ?
 
i stopped drinking Sierra Mist, Root Beer, and tea with lots of honey in it on Oct. 28, 2008, because of a REAL bad dental appointment (8 cavities + threatened 2nd crown replacement).

then i had a regular doctor appointment in Jan. 2009, and had lost about 8 pounds.

which i have since gained back - even though i stuck with the program - and didn't change my diet.

as far as water from the tap - look up "sodium fluoride". it's used as rat poison. the Nazi's fed it prisoners to make them more docile. and it's in our drinking water, obviously in lower doses.

do you have well water where you live ?

Please don't start this "fluoride in our water is a conspiracy" nonsense. It is pure FUD against what is one of the major public health achievements of the twentieth century.
 
Please don't start this "fluoride in our water is a conspiracy" nonsense. It is pure FUD against what is one of the major public health achievements of the twentieth century.

The FUD is believing without fluoride in your water that your teeth will rot and cavities will abound. Extreme conspiracies aside, there is no direct medical evidence that fluoridated water prevents cavities. There are too many variables. Applying it to your teeth directly has an chemical effect, but in the drinking water it's not direct science. It's a big game of statistics and believing what you want to believe, right now, the medical establishment and most oral care providers believe fluoride is good. It is cheap, so I say I can buy mouthwash or toothpaste, get it out of my water.

It is a carcinogen, Rat poison as mentioned, and it bioaccumulates. Almost impossible to filter because the particle is so small. It is the only additive added to our water to medicate people rather than treat the water. Any person with a shred of medical principle knows that you shouldn't medicate all people at once with a fixed dose. There have been many cases of infants overdosing on fluoride, which makes the boned harder and more brittle. It can also mess up your teeth and cause fluorosis. The ADA has even come out in recent years having to mention to risks of fluoride to children.

You don't medicate people with a fixed dose. It's that simple. That should be enough to get it out of the water. But it doesn't happen because there's big money in disposing of toxic waste into our water supplies, and as long as people believe this, the money will keep flowing.

If you want to prevent cavities, stop consuming sugar. Stop drinking soda. I never had a cavity in my life growing up and I had bad oral hygiene routines, but I rarely drank soda or had sugar. It wasn't until college and I became hooked on soda I got cavities. I don;t plan on getting any more, I'll let you know how that goes. Xylitol is a great alternative way to prevent cavities, BTW.

if you study history, when the sugar cane, and later the sugar beet hit mass production, it was a pandemic of tooth decay problems. It wasn't that they had a fluoride deficiency.

Oh, and then there's the chlorine in the water, put there to kill bacteria. No one lets it air out or filters it. You drink it, and it kills the good bacteria in your gut as well. Does this kill you? No. Is it natural and healthy? not for me. So glad I live in VT and have real water popping out of hillsides.
 
To the OP, stop drinking soda. It's one of the best things I ever did. I just had one yesterday on my cheat week, after 3 months of no soda. Today I have heartburn, haven't had that in forever. To me, drinking any soda makes my body want to drink less water, so I find cutting it out completely helps.

Really, cut out all added sugar if you can, limit it to what you already get in things like ketchup and BBQ sauce.

Start drinking seltzer. i know it's nasty at first but keep at it, in 2 weeks you will acquire the taste. Also cutting your juice with seltzer can be a good combo, cuts down on the sugar.
 
To the OP, stop drinking soda. It's one of the best things I ever did. I just had one yesterday on my cheat week, after 3 months of no soda. Today I have heartburn, haven't had that in forever. To me, drinking any soda makes my body want to drink less water, so I find cutting it out completely helps.

Really, cut out all added sugar if you can, limit it to what you already get in things like ketchup and BBQ sauce.

Start drinking seltzer. i know it's nasty at first but keep at it, in 2 weeks you will acquire the taste. Also cutting your juice with seltzer can be a good combo, cuts down on the sugar.

Screw all that, just drink water. It's not like giving up smoking. You may experience caffeine headaches for a few days, but meh.
 
Screw all that, just drink water. It's not like giving up smoking. You may experience caffeine headaches for a few days, but meh.

Well, I'm recommending the seltzer, because some people have impulse-buy habits and you can find it in most convenience stores as an alternative. If you have soda stocked in the office fridge at work, get a 12-pack of seltzer cans and stock your own. The flavor and bubbles make it mimic soda when you get a craving. It can be hard braking habits, you should break them one at a time, and once you physically get over the soda, a daily habit may have it creep back in.

As someone who was really addicted to soda, I say it is like giving up smoking. They say no one ever quits smoking, but the nicotine is out of your system in 3 days. It's worse than smoking, because soda is much more available. Every where you go you can be tempted. And the habits of sitting at your desk and drinking sugar can get fiercely ingrained, it used to be people smoked at their desk, now it's drinking fluids. As a one-time soda addict I can say I will probably never quit, but if I can limit myself to say, 12 cans a year, I'll be fine with myself - recreation use. 🙂

Totally, drink water. Spring water, preferably artesian. Lots of dissolved solids and high hardness factor is best. As I mentioned I don't like fluoride or chlorine. I don't like filtering either because that filters out the "dirt" - minerals your body needs. But I am crazy water bottle guy, I bottle my own spring water. Just switching to tap water instead of soda will be like night and day.
 
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The FUD is believing without fluoride in your water that your teeth will rot and cavities will abound. Extreme conspiracies aside, there is no direct medical evidence that fluoridated water prevents cavities. There are too many variables. Applying it to your teeth directly has an chemical effect, but in the drinking water it's not direct science. It's a big game of statistics and believing what you want to believe, right now, the medical establishment and most oral care providers believe fluoride is good. It is cheap, so I say I can buy mouthwash or toothpaste, get it out of my water.

It is a carcinogen, Rat poison as mentioned, and it bioaccumulates. Almost impossible to filter because the particle is so small. It is the only additive added to our water to medicate people rather than treat the water. Any person with a shred of medical principle knows that you shouldn't medicate all people at once with a fixed dose. There have been many cases of infants overdosing on fluoride, which makes the boned harder and more brittle. It can also mess up your teeth and cause fluorosis. The ADA has even come out in recent years having to mention to risks of fluoride to children.

You don't medicate people with a fixed dose. It's that simple. That should be enough to get it out of the water. But it doesn't happen because there's big money in disposing of toxic waste into our water supplies, and as long as people believe this, the money will keep flowing.

If you want to prevent cavities, stop consuming sugar. Stop drinking soda. I never had a cavity in my life growing up and I had bad oral hygiene routines, but I rarely drank soda or had sugar. It wasn't until college and I became hooked on soda I got cavities. I don;t plan on getting any more, I'll let you know how that goes. Xylitol is a great alternative way to prevent cavities, BTW.

if you study history, when the sugar cane, and later the sugar beet hit mass production, it was a pandemic of tooth decay problems. It wasn't that they had a fluoride deficiency.

Oh, and then there's the chlorine in the water, put there to kill bacteria. No one lets it air out or filters it. You drink it, and it kills the good bacteria in your gut as well. Does this kill you? No. Is it natural and healthy? not for me. So glad I live in VT and have real water popping out of hillsides.

Nothing is ever perfect in a public health scenario. Their job is to figure out how to have the best NET impact while minimizing public health impacts. On one hand, you have the incredibly high cost of poor oral hygiene, which exacts a huge toll in dental, medical, and social costs. You could approach this by individually counseling people, providing free dental care, toothbrushes, and toothpaste (and you DO do this, to some extent), but what's the cost of that, and what makes you think that people will actually follow recommendations? (They don't - observe obesity as a public health issue.) On the other, you have the potential toxicity of fluoride (in very high concentrations, mind you). Which side wins out? It's an ethical, economic, and debate of practicality as much as it is a public health concern.

The public health investigations would seem to point that the drawbacks of the latter is a small price to pay for the former, particularly because they can be minimized by, for example, breastfeeding or using bottled, non-fluoridated water to prepare formula. What happens is that some people (such as yourself) use loaded terms like "rat poison," extoll "natural" (also a loaded term) and have a knee-jerk reaction, running for the hills. What we are talking about here is DOSING, and the quantity of fluoride in water is a fraction of what is found in fluoridated water (unless, of course, fluoride finds its way into water naturally - which is very possible).

When public health authorities decided to fortify grains with folic acid to reduce the incidence of birth defects (NTDs), one of the arguments against it was that folate is required for cell reproduction. So for somebody with cancer, folic acid could, potentially, HELP the cancer grow (some cancer drugs are folate blockers). Ultimately, the ability to prevent NTDs won out and they fortified flour. The incidence dropped like a rock.

Chlorination of water. Well, look at it this way. Do you treat the water, or just leave it be, potentially allowing pathogenic bacteria/viruses to enter the water system? Some municipal systems handle millions upon millions of gallons a day. It is simply not technically and financially feasible to treat that much water using some of the higher-end systems available (such as those used by water bottlers - reverse osmosis and the like). New York City is building an ultraviolet treatment system for the city's water at a cost of billions of dollars. How many municipalities can afford that sort of thing? Like ALL public health inititiatives, this is a calculus of benefits and drawbacks.

Same principle applies to vaccination. The benefits - reduced incidence of disease throughout the population, reduced risk of pandemics - outweigh the drawbacks, including a population which cannot be vaccinated and the small fraction of cases who may have adverse reactions. Unfortunately, these fringe cases get the most publicity and irresponsible celebrities go on TV to tell parents NOT to vaccinate their kids, essentially spreading FUD, unraveling the public health initiatives in the process, and putting everybody at risk as a consequence.

Finally, I should point out that it is not sugar that causes dental caries, it is CARBOHYDRATES (which also include sugars). You can get tooth decay from a diet of brown rice, fish, and vegetables. The key point is the frequency of carbohydrate and the "stickiness." A person who eats 3-4 meals a day and barely snacks will have a lower risk of dental caries than somebody who grazes all day on carbohydrate-rich snacks (and face it,most snacks ARE carbohydrate) and eats meals on top of that.

I didn't have many cavities until I got to college. I, too, drank soda during college. But was it the soda? Well, yes and no. I'd drink the soda between meals and throughout the day, so my carbohydrate intake was spread out as opposed to being restricted to meals. This provides more opportunity for bacteria to feast on sugar passing through my mouth. In effect, drinking milk or juice instead of soda would have done more or less the same thing.
 
Nothing is ever perfect in a public health scenario. Their job is to figure out how to have the best NET impact while minimizing public health impacts. On one hand, you have the incredibly high cost of poor oral hygiene, which exacts a huge toll in dental, medical, and social costs. You could approach this by individually counseling people, providing free dental care, toothbrushes, and toothpaste (and you DO do this, to some extent), but what's the cost of that, and what makes you think that people will actually follow recommendations? (They don't - observe obesity as a public health issue.) On the other, you have the potential toxicity of fluoride (in very high concentrations, mind you). Which side wins out? It's an ethical, economic, and debate of practicality as much as it is a public health concern.

The public health investigations would seem to point that the drawbacks of the latter is a small price to pay for the former, particularly because they can be minimized by, for example, breastfeeding or using bottled, non-fluoridated water to prepare formula. What happens is that some people (such as yourself) use loaded terms like "rat poison," extoll "natural" (also a loaded term) and have a knee-jerk reaction, running for the hills. What we are talking about here is DOSING, and the quantity of fluoride in water is a fraction of what is found in fluoridated water (unless, of course, fluoride finds its way into water naturally - which is very possible).

When public health authorities decided to fortify grains with folic acid to reduce the incidence of birth defects (NTDs), one of the arguments against it was that folate is required for cell reproduction. So for somebody with cancer, folic acid could, potentially, HELP the cancer grow (some cancer drugs are folate blockers). Ultimately, the ability to prevent NTDs won out and they fortified flour. The incidence dropped like a rock.

Chlorination of water. Well, look at it this way. Do you treat the water, or just leave it be, potentially allowing pathogenic bacteria/viruses to enter the water system? Some municipal systems handle millions upon millions of gallons a day. It is simply not technically and financially feasible to treat that much water using some of the higher-end systems available (such as those used by water bottlers - reverse osmosis and the like). New York City is building an ultraviolet treatment system for the city's water at a cost of billions of dollars. How many municipalities can afford that sort of thing? Like ALL public health inititiatives, this is a calculus of benefits and drawbacks.

Same principle applies to vaccination. The benefits - reduced incidence of disease throughout the population, reduced risk of pandemics - outweigh the drawbacks, including a population which cannot be vaccinated and the small fraction of cases who may have adverse reactions. Unfortunately, these fringe cases get the most publicity and irresponsible celebrities go on TV to tell parents NOT to vaccinate their kids, essentially spreading FUD, unraveling the public health initiatives in the process, and putting everybody at risk as a consequence.

Finally, I should point out that it is not sugar that causes dental caries, it is CARBOHYDRATES (which also include sugars). You can get tooth decay from a diet of brown rice, fish, and vegetables. The key point is the frequency of carbohydrate and the "stickiness." A person who eats 3-4 meals a day and barely snacks will have a lower risk of dental caries than somebody who grazes all day on carbohydrate-rich snacks (and face it,most snacks ARE carbohydrate) and eats meals on top of that.

I didn't have many cavities until I got to college. I, too, drank soda during college. But was it the soda? Well, yes and no. I'd drink the soda between meals and throughout the day, so my carbohydrate intake was spread out as opposed to being restricted to meals. This provides more opportunity for bacteria to feast on sugar passing through my mouth. In effect, drinking milk or juice instead of soda would have done more or less the same thing.

I do respect you position and understand where you are coming from. But that all looks like a bunch of FUD to me. Making me worry about my health so I buy into the system. You can do anything to people in the name of public health, and it takes away my personal choice. I want to drink the water my ancestors drank for the past millions of years. I don't care if you think I'm misguided, it's my choice and it is getting exceedingly difficult to do so. To me, that's ridiculous. Changing the chemical makeup of our most essential nutritional and health requirement, water, for about 100 years compared to millions of years of evolution is just arrogant. The arrogance of science will be it's downfall. I get tired of all these official science positions that then suddenly realize they made a mistake, oh we didn't know trans-fats are bad for you, that kind of thing. Modern health science is constantly making mistakes because it's purely mechanical; really having a simpler, holistic philosophy solves so many problems. Meanwhile they are arrogant all the way thinking they know everything. I don't have faith in modern science. The two are not compatible. I love, and practice science, but faith has no place there, only questions and doubt. Gotta love how it's turning into the new religion.

Carbs in small amount along with a balanced diet will not result in cavities, a good diet low in carbs will keep most people from ever having cavities. I don't really drink milk or juice either. pasteurized milk is basically sugar water. I get about 2 oranges a day, whole fruit. It's the carbs that get you in high doses causes the problem. Everything is about dose. There is a good case that we shouldn't drink milk, as we are not best adapted to it. There is even a good emerging case that agriculture and grains specifically are what caused imperialism in our founding civilizations only ten thousand years ago. It because carbs make us feel good that we cultivated them, destroyed our soil and needed to conquer more land. Really the hunter/gatherer diet of nuts, seeds, veggies, meat and some carbs is what we evolved to eat. I am basically on the paleolithic diet and I feel the best I have in my life. If I eat carbs, especially grains, I feel like shit. The govt food pyramid is upside-down for me, yet most people don't question it. We have gone so far from nature that it is really insane. Truly we live in interesting times. But if you tell me to not question established science, then you yourself are not a scientist and I don't care to talk to you. Everyone's health and body is their own and they have a right to do whatever they want to it, good or bad. I should be the only one that pays the costs. If you pay for my bad health, that's your problem.

I really don't like social justice discussions, I'm bad at them, and they're just not my thing. I keep it on a personal level and that's my choice.
 
I do respect you position and understand where you are coming from. But that all looks like a bunch of FUD to me. Making me worry about my health so I buy into the system. You can do anything to people in the name of public health, and it takes away my personal choice. I want to drink the water my ancestors drank for the past millions of years. I don't care if you think I'm misguided, it's my choice and it is getting exceedingly difficult to do so. To me, that's ridiculous. Changing the chemical makeup of our most essential nutritional and health requirement, water, for about 100 years compared to millions of years of evolution is just arrogant. The arrogance of science will be it's downfall. I get tired of all these official science positions that then suddenly realize they made a mistake, oh we didn't know trans-fats are bad for you, that kind of thing. Modern health science is constantly making mistakes because it's purely mechanical; really having a simpler, holistic philosophy solves so many problems. Meanwhile they are arrogant all the way thinking they know everything. I don't have faith in modern science. The two are not compatible. I love, and practice science, but faith has no place there, only questions and doubt. Gotta love how it's turning into the new religion.

Carbs in small amount along with a balanced diet will not result in cavities, a good diet low in carbs will keep most people from ever having cavities. I don't really drink milk or juice either. pasteurized milk is basically sugar water. I get about 2 oranges a day, whole fruit. It's the carbs that get you in high doses causes the problem. Everything is about dose. There is a good case that we shouldn't drink milk, as we are not best adapted to it. There is even a good emerging case that agriculture and grains specifically are what caused imperialism in our founding civilizations only ten thousand years ago. It because carbs make us feel good that we cultivated them, destroyed our soil and needed to conquer more land. Really the hunter/gatherer diet of nuts, seeds, veggies, meat and some carbs is what we evolved to eat. I am basically on the paleolithic diet and I feel the best I have in my life. If I eat carbs, especially grains, I feel like shit. The govt food pyramid is upside-down for me, yet most people don't question it. We have gone so far from nature that it is really insane. Truly we live in interesting times. But if you tell me to not question established science, then you yourself are not a scientist and I don't care to talk to you. Everyone's health and body is their own and they have a right to do whatever they want to it, good or bad. I should be the only one that pays the costs. If you pay for my bad health, that's your problem.

I really don't like social justice discussions, I'm bad at them, and they're just not my thing. I keep it on a personal level and that's my choice.

Wow, talk about going completely off topic. Haven't really address anything of what I was discussing, but okay...You would have us believe that others' health has nothing whatsoever to do with our own, but it does. Rising rates of obesity affect me. Kids being born with spina bifida affects me. People getting sick affects me. It affects me because it raises my insurance rates, occupies precious health care resources, and puts a drain on economic activity. The only way you can get around this is if you live in a shack in a remote part of the world and have ZERO contact with anybody. Public health recognizes that where problems with a large social cost can be solved in a simple method which maximizes gains and minimizes costs, that is a good thing with benefits for all. There is no FUD involved here except from the neurotic, sensationalistic opposition, who are obsessed with their conspiracy theories. The public health problems EXIST, and need to be solved. There is no FUD here.

For the record, H20 remains H20. The levels of minerals and other compounds in water does vary from place to place, but adding a small degree of fluoride to it does not in any way "change" the what water is. It is still H20. It changes the composition somewhat, but not to the extent of adulterating it, which is what conspiracy theorists love to imply. A subtle shift which has minimal cost to everybody but has a huge payoff. That's a simple principle, don't you think? It is one, moreover, which has strong backing. Sensationalists run around screaming "rat poison" with no real proof but distortions of reality - it's an emotional argument, that unfortunately, wins people over.

Which brings me to my point. Science is not a perfect system. It makes "mistakes," you claim, when that's simply the nature of the beast - we learn new things. A "mistake" implies that we could have acted otherwise. People WISH science was perfect, but it isn't. That's life. We do the best we can do with what we know at the time. This means that you have to accept that there are going to be changes, new discoveries, new recommendations. It's not perfect, but if we knew everything there would be little point in the first place.
 
I currently drink about 4-8 sodas (coke or mt dew) per day, and I very much want to cut it out of my diet. I already have a water filter and a nice water bottle (24oz camelbak that I very much enjoy).

So, how should I go about this? My self-control is admittedly awful. Should I just go cold-turkey, or limit to a certain number of cans per day? Or try to drink a certain amount of water per day? My number one issue when I try this is always that I don't find myself sipping water like I do soda.
 
When I stopped drinking soda I would limit myself to 1 a day(from 6+) for a week, then maybe one a week as needed haven't had a soda in about 4 months now and it's great.
 
Well, it has been one soda-less day. Feeling a bit twitchy, but not bad. Pretty sure it's going to get worse before it gets better.
 
I currently drink about 4-8 sodas (coke or mt dew) per day, and I very much want to cut it out of my diet. I already have a water filter and a nice water bottle (24oz camelbak that I very much enjoy).

So, how should I go about this? My self-control is admittedly awful. Should I just go cold-turkey, or limit to a certain number of cans per day? Or try to drink a certain amount of water per day? My number one issue when I try this is always that I don't find myself sipping water like I do soda.

I like mixing juices with mineral water such as Pelegrino. 6 parts juice, 4 parts Pelegrino. It gives same bubbly feeling as soda, but doesn't have all the nasty chemicals and it cuts calories almost by half. Bad news is that juice still has lots of sugar and calories, so even if you dilute it with Pelegrino like I do, at 4-8 cans/glasses a day that's still at least 250-500 calories coming from your drink. I suggest you try juice/mineral water mix and slowly get yourself off of soda and then work on drinking more water instead of juice.
 
I want to drink the water my ancestors drank for the past millions of years. I don't care if you think I'm misguided, it's my choice and it is getting exceedingly difficult to do so. To me, that's ridiculous. Changing the chemical makeup of our most essential nutritional and health requirement, water, for about 100 years compared to millions of years of evolution is just arrogant.

Carbs in small amount along with a balanced diet will not result in cavities, a good diet low in carbs will keep most people from ever having cavities.

I don't have the energy to reply to all of that and someones doing it for me, but I'll comment on two things.

Fluoride is found naturally in water and in some places in even greater concentration than what we add to municipal water. The way we found out about it's affects is from towns that had FAR greater concentrations than what we use now and their kids were getting fluorosis. While they were getting fluoride poisoning, they weren't getting cavities... So depending on where you're from, it's entirely possible your ancestors were drinking fluoride in greater quantities than we do now.

For cavities and carbs, frequency matters more than the sum quanitity. The dentist that explained to it me said basicly everytime you eat even small amounts of carbs you activate the bacteria in your mouth for about 15 minutes. If you're always eating a bit of rice every 15 minutes you'll be worse off than eating a box of pixie sticks in one sitting and nothing else the rest of the day... Atleast cavity wise.
 
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