So......Is It Finally Over????

[ToBeMe]

Looks like the results will be final tommorow and Bush has won.......maybe......I mean yeah, the absentee's aren't all in but, they will be in favor of Bush too so, is it finally over????

 

[JayPatel]

Personally, i dont think it will ever be over, this is one for the Ages.

 

[konichiwa]

Well we all know what Russ is going to "bust up in here" and say.

 

[Russ]

<< Looks like the results will be final tommorow and Bush has won....... >>



Not necessarily. Because the Judge copped out by stating that the SOS cannot &quot;arbitrarily&quot; reject results submitted after the 5 PM deadline, the field is left wide open for the democrats to sue; and they will.

Even though Palm County has certified their ballots based on the machine recount, they are still moving forward with the hand count. It is clear what is coming.

Russ, NCNE

 

[snow patrol]

Just on the off chance that Gore wins, who would like to bake the humble pie for Russ?

 

[IBhacknU]

/me feels pity for our country right now.

 

[Double Trouble]

It ain't over, the Democrats are figuring out their strategy for stealing this one yet. I'm sure it will involve lots of lawyers, lots of lying, and certainly not a little bit of cheating.

One can only hope that come Saturday they will manage to put a stop to this nonsense before the Gore cronies come up with some excuse to do a 27th recount, this time with the counters using their feet and being blindfolded, to see if he can get the magical numbers he wants.

Sheesh.

 

[Russ]

It gets even more interesting:



<< WEST PALM BEACH, Florida (CNN) -- The Florida Democratic Party has filed suit in Palm Beach County Circuit Court in a bid to force the county's canvassing board to count votes under a &quot;dimple test.&quot;

Dimpled ballots are those with a slight indention, where the chad were not punched through completely. The lawsuit was filed late Monday. >>



I guess if a voter started to punch the ballot, changed their mind and voted for the other candidate the first attempt is the valid one?

Russ, NCNE

 

[somethingwitty]

this won't be over until the 18th of december. at that point, I believe, the electorial votes are official. bush could win florida, but then 2 people could change their minds...

 

[ride525]

<< I guess if a voter started to punch the ballot, changed their mind and voted for the other candidate the first attempt is the valid one? >>



I'd guess no....there would be no way to know which came first or second.....I'll be if there was a punch and a dimple, that the machine would read only the punch...(I think another name for the &quot;dimple&quot; is &quot;pregnant chad&quot;...

Probably the dimple would only count if there were no other punches... But who knows.....

Russ is right again.....it's certain DEMs will want manual votes counted from the three counties they requested....if Secretary of State denies them, there is sure to be a court battle......

This just gets more and more interesting....

 

[sweetrobin]

More like stupider and stupider ... how the heck can they justify this to themselves ??? God they are making themselves look like the idiots of all time ....

 

[Russ]

ride525,

You just presented an excellent argument for the assertion that machine counting is the only objective, and therefore fair and accurate method, for vote tabulation.

EDIT: Apparently there is also a difference between a &quot;dimpled&quot; chad and a &quot;pregnant&quot; chad. Thanks go to Konichiwa:

Dimple Chad: A &quot;Chad&quot; that's not punched out but has an indentation
Hanging Chad: A &quot;Chad&quot; that got punched out but is hanging by a thread
Pregnant Chad: A &quot;Chad&quot; that was obviously punched, because it has a big crevasse in it.

Russ, NCNE

 

[U2fan]

Bush has more votes in Florida, therefore Bush is the president. If West Palm Beach is going to be recognized. The heavily Republican, Duval County with 26000 votes thrown out because of more than one candidate or none at all should count.

 

[lowtech1]

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (Reuters)

>>>David Boies, the newest member of the Gore legal team who represented the government in its anti-trust case against Microsoft Corp., said more court action remained possible.

``If the (Florida) secretary of state refuses to accept amended returns based on the recount and violates what this court has ruled is her duty, which is to accept those results unless she has a good reason not to, then we may be back in court,'' Boies said.<<<


IMHO. Me don't think anyone is coming out of this election a winner, and it is going to be a long 4 years for you American.

 

[ToBeMe]

Well, I'm not sure on this one, but I heard this in another forum a short time ago......apparently Al and the Dems., realizing that the country is getting pretty anxious over their tactics has filed one last suit for a new count that they're sure will work......it goes as follows: If, in the last 6 months, you have said anything remotely positive regarding Al Gore, or, the Democrats as a whole, you will be considered to have intended to have voted for Al Gore! By God Al, I think that one might just swing the vote to your side!

 

[ride525]

<< You just presented an excellent argument for the assertion that machine counting is the only objective, and therefore fair and accurate method, for vote tabulation. >>



Yeah, I realized that when I wrote it.....may be time for me to come over to the Dark Side.

I realize this manual count thing is subject to interpretation, and hard to discern SOME of the ballots. But there are others, that couldn't be machine read, which you should be able to tell.

 

[Russ]

ToBeMe,

Fortunately, the way you worded the criteria has given me an escape clause. While I may have accidentally let one or two positive comments slip about individual democrats, never as a whole, and never Albert Jr.

Russ, NCNE

 

[ride525]

Just saw 60 Minutes on TV, story on Florida election and &quot;chad&quot;.

Apparently punch card ballots are used in about 37% of US elections. About FIVE PERCENT of punch card are rejected. That is reason enough to manual read the ballots. Just 300 votes separate now.

Only problem, perhaps all counties with punch cards should be manual read. Only a few were requested to have recounts.

 

[Capn]

Count em all or count none of them. That's the only fair way.

 

[ride525]

<< Count em all or count none of them >>



You know, I think you are right. But, that's not the way things are going. The Dems asked for a few recounts, and that's all that has been requested......

 

[Russ]

Hell, you guys have it easy. After Florida certifies the election, we in Washington State are still staring at two statewide races that are probably going to automatic recount.

ride525,

Manual recounts probably have an even higher rejection rate. And that rate is based on judgement not objective criteria. No matter how hard one argues that hand counts are better than machine counts, it is simply not the case when judged by the only issue that matters: OBJECTIVITY.

Russ, NCNE

 

[ride525]

I don't know if I have the answer.

It's clear the losing side in Florida will claim it should of won.

I give up....

Wait....the &quot;expert&quot; on 60 minutes said really this was &quot;tie&quot; (yeah I know Bush is ahead by 300 votes, but that is out of almost 6 million cast, within the margin of error of probably ANY voting method.)

Let's do what Football and Basketball do....Play an overtime period....
I don't know how that would look though.....

 

[SJ]

Next thing you know they sue Broward because they don't count chads with only one corner cut as a vote, oh wait they already ARE. Has to be two corners there. Hell I bet if Palm Beach went by two corners Gore wouldn't gain half the votes(or even less) he did. Gotta love it, three different counties, three different sets of rules. Wonder how Dade is going to do it. Gore won't let himself lose. He will win, even if he does have to steal it.

 

[ride525]

Russ,

I'm not sure I really care......I just want the person elected in Florida to have the most votes of all that voted in Florida....

I'm not sure how to really make sure of that right now......both sides feel really disenfranchised.....

 

[SJ]

That would be impossible, there are ZERO standards with the hand recount in Florida.