So if the Dems are so wise and Green

[Hayabusa Rider]

Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

 

[alchemize]

Solar tiles are really the best alternative energy source model I think. Over a 25 year period you could retrofit the south facing roofs of every house in the country, tie them into the grid somehow. Somebody mathematical should calculate the energy that would create...

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

First things first.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

One trick pony. Gotcha.

 

[heyheybooboo]

Psssst.

In addition to Dow there are 3 other companies that make solar shingles (unless Dow bought them out). Every manufactured shingle is purchased immediately ---- production cannot keep pace with demand.

Then, there is the matter of the power inverter and state legislation which requires the utility to purchase the excess electricity production. Thankfully, over the last 20 years or so inverter efficiency has increased --- in many cases, 15-20% (to 90-95%).

The power purchase requirements and the reimbursement rate paid by PowerCo pretty much range from 'suck' to 'blow'. I don't have the time right now but I'm certain someone can easily find a chart of state by state reimbursement rates.

That is where the real challenge is ----- or we will all be tools of PowerCo.

 

[Ausm]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

I agree this needs to be addressed to but as Americans we face so many problems right now it is hard to prioritize these things. What is not important to you may be much more important to others.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Psssst.

In addition to Dow there are 3 other companies that make solar shingles (unless Dow bought them out). Every manufactured shingle is purchased immediately ---- production cannot keep pace with demand.

Then, there is the matter of the power inverter and state legislation which requires the utility to purchase the excess electricity production. Thankfully, over the last 20 years or so inverter efficiency has increased --- in many cases, 15-20% (to 90-95%).

The power purchase requirements and the reimbursement rate paid by PowerCo pretty much range from 'suck' to 'blow'. I don't have the time right now but I'm certain someone can easily find a chart of state by state reimbursement rates.

That is where the real challenge is ----- or we will all be tools of PowerCo.

Well considering all the money we spend on subsidizing bad debt, let's give tax incentives (and big ones) to Dow and their kin. Ramp up production and give industry the means and reason to do so. The state regulations will change as need demands. If the inverter is a cost issue, subsidize that too.

Hey we're throwing around trillions. Let's get something that benefits citizens for once.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Ausm

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

I agree this needs to be addressed to but as Americans we face so many problems right now it is hard to prioritize these things. What is not important to you may be much more important to others.

We've had two wars recently that are tied to oil. No, not the acquisition of it, but the only reason people like Bin Laden could exist is because of the geopolitical dependence on it.

We'll hear stories of people freezing this winter. All we need one act of terrorism, and we march to $5.00 a gallon.

If DC had two functioning neurons, it should be able to see that there isn't just one issue. In fact, Congress has divided it's workload to multitask.

Let's look at it another way. There are some people without insurance, and a debate about it is perfectly reasonable. We ALL are under a Sword of Damocles when it comes to energy and our dependence on it.

My own belief is that the Dems don't want this any more than the oil company loving Reps. They would lose tax funds and control, and their supporters won't hold them accountable.

This opportunity will go nowhere fast, and few will care enough which I think is sad.

 

[DesiPower]

Govt is already heavily subsidizing solar panels, businesses get almost 60% subsidy everything put together. But, do you know where majority of the panels are coming from? - CHI fuckin NA, so much for creating green jobs that cannot be outsourced...

 

[rudder]

I live in the south and wonder what would happen if the demand for electricity dropped. .. we would have a lot of Tennessee Valley Authority employees who do nothing all day... really do nothing.

Even at 30-40% cost savings with the shingles... it is still hella expensive for the average homeowner to consider.. even with subsidies. It will be ten years before my roof needs to be redone on the house... maybe by then this technology will be a lot more affordable and I can run a home server with a little more CPU power without feeling guilty about leaving it on 24/7.

 

[Slick5150]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

If you'd bother to read the news you'd see that Dow received $20 million from the Dept of Energy to develop these.

But hey, facts suck.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Slick5150

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

If you'd bother to read the news you'd see that Dow received $20 million from the Dept of Energy to develop these.

But hey, facts suck.

Hey, 20 Million? That could have been used to insure all Americans! :roll:

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Originally posted by: Slick5150

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

If you'd bother to read the news you'd see that Dow received $20 million from the Dept of Energy to develop these.

But hey, facts suck.

Hey, 20 Million? That could have been used to insure all Americans! :roll:

Ah, so YAHCT.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Robor

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Originally posted by: Slick5150

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

If you'd bother to read the news you'd see that Dow received $20 million from the Dept of Energy to develop these.

But hey, facts suck.

Hey, 20 Million? That could have been used to insure all Americans! :roll:

Ah, so YAHCT.

No, it's a "hey you dimwits in DC there are actually other things worthy of consideration going on" thread.

We hear people toss around incomprehensible numbers concerning health care, and then am told that a few minutes worth of another program was tossed as a bone and that's significant?

"Hey, I know there are starving people, but I fixed that. I gave some guy a bag of peanuts" logic.

 

[keird]

Geothermal needs to be coupled with wind/solar power. I wish that new construction concrete homes were more prevalent, but they still aren't. I'd love nothing more than to have every home produce more energy than they needed at a low cost. Maybe in my lifetime I'll witness it. This country is on the cusp of energy independence and the only thing holding it back is political will.

I was taught that security is your first 'need' and then shelter, water and food. I think that the U.S. is secure enough to work on shelter now. If I were President, I'd subsidize concrete homes and geothermal, too. I think that this would set the stage for an evolution in wind/solar and battery technology.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

My feeling keird is that there is considerable political will (on the part of politicians, Dems included) to prevent energy independence. It doesn't fill their war chests, and it diminishes their control over us.

 

[keird]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
My feeling keird is that there is considerable political will (on the part of politicians, Dems included) to prevent energy independence. It doesn't fill their war chests, and it diminishes their control over us.

I was musing that if concrete homes were subsidized then the timber industry would spend gobs of money to prevent that bill going through.

Democracy is the best we could do, huh?

Two-party politics suck, but at least we're not Arab.

 

[Cogman]

Solar power is not clean energy. Especially this type that uses gallium. A much cleaner solution that would cut power demand in half would be replacing windows and properly insulating houses across the US.

Heck, even installing something like a geo-thermal pump for every home would be a cheaper and cleaner alternative then installing solar panels.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

Nobody's arguing for health care for anyone's pets.

Apparently, Dow Chemical has figured out how to make solar shingles economically viable without government subsidies. Why are you complaining when there's a chance something in the great free marketplace of ideas actually works to everyone's advantage without government intervention?

"We're looking at this one product that could generate $5 billion in revenue by 2015 and $10 billion by 2020," Jane Palmieri, managing director of Dow Solar Solutions, told Reuters in an interview.

If this is now a proven technology, local, state and federal government subsidies to speed adoption and installation would be a great idea, and many government bodies are already doing exactly that. My local Los Angeles Department of Water and Power gives rebates for purchasing an energy efficient refrigerator or water heater and a further rebate for hauling away the old energy hog it replaces. They also offer financial incentives for installing other current technology for solar rooftops. There's no reason they shouldn't extend that policy to Dow's new system.

The basic improvements, here, are greater efficiency, which is a constant goal, and integration of the photovoltaic conversion materials into the building materials, instead of bolting them onto older construction methods, which makes them easier to integrate into architectual designs.

Dow has other darker corners in their past, such as Bopal, but hats off to them for this one. :thumbsup:

Why be a one trick pony party?

Dow's self-financed achievement leaves more scarce government resources available to underwrite other promising technologies that aren't as far along in development and marketing.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

Nobody's arguing for health care for anyone's pets.

Apparently, Dow Chemical has figured out how to make solar shingles economically viable without government subsidies. Why are you complaining when there's a chance something in the great free marketplace of ideas actually works to everyone's advantage without government intervention?

"We're looking at this one product that could generate $5 billion in revenue by 2015 and $10 billion by 2020," Jane Palmieri, managing director of Dow Solar Solutions, told Reuters in an interview.

If this is now a proven technology, local, state and federal government subsidies to speed adoption and installation would be a great idea, and many government bodies are already doing exactly that. My local Los Angeles Department of Water and Power gives rebates for purchasing an energy efficient refrigerator or water heater and a further rebate for hauling away the old energy hog it replaces. They also offer financial incentives for installing other current technology for solar rooftops. There's no reason they shouldn't extend that policy to Dow's new system.

The basic improvements, here, are greater efficiency, which is a constant goal, and integration of the photovoltaic conversion materials into the building materials, instead of bolting them onto older construction methods, which makes them easier to integrate into architectual designs.

Dow has other darker corners in their past, such as Bopal, but hats off to them for this one. :thumbsup:

Why be a one trick pony party?

Dow's self-financed achievement leaves more scarce government resources available to underwrite other promising technologies that aren't as far along in development and marketing.

And at this rate in a few decades we may have what could be done in a few years. This is a timely issue that would benefit virtually all citizens of our nation. The support? 20 million bucks. Regardless of the technology and the company, the Reps wouldn't put their efforts to putting alternative energy in the hands of the people. So far there's been no change. What are we going to spend on other things? A trillion or so? It's going to be hard to convince many people who are concerned about such things that it's going to take more than a tiny fraction of that to get this and other here and today technologies into our hands, however there's no interest in doing more than window dressing.

Soon ( in relative terms) there is going to be another major problem in the middle east. The price of energy will skyrocket, and once again we will be involved in things that we would not have to, but for the fact that we were waiting for "one day". You will see another Iraq. You will see Americans yelling for heads. It's all tied together. Why? Because the ME is vital to our national interests. If for no other reason than people should want to avoid the base problems that led to Bush's War, then they should promote this kind of thinking to have it now, not one day.

It's a bomb waiting to go off, and the timer is set. Tick Tick.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

I know, they don't fund it at all. Look ONLY $0.5 billion was set aside in the first few months in office! Heck, they only pumped $16.8 Billion in here. :roll:

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

Nobody's arguing for health care for anyone's pets.

Apparently, Dow Chemical has figured out how to make solar shingles economically viable without government subsidies. Why are you complaining when there's a chance something in the great free marketplace of ideas actually works to everyone's advantage without government intervention?

"We're looking at this one product that could generate $5 billion in revenue by 2015 and $10 billion by 2020," Jane Palmieri, managing director of Dow Solar Solutions, told Reuters in an interview.

If this is now a proven technology, local, state and federal government subsidies to speed adoption and installation would be a great idea, and many government bodies are already doing exactly that. My local Los Angeles Department of Water and Power gives rebates for purchasing an energy efficient refrigerator or water heater and a further rebate for hauling away the old energy hog it replaces. They also offer financial incentives for installing other current technology for solar rooftops. There's no reason they shouldn't extend that policy to Dow's new system.

The basic improvements, here, are greater efficiency, which is a constant goal, and integration of the photovoltaic conversion materials into the building materials, instead of bolting them onto older construction methods, which makes them easier to integrate into architectual designs.

Dow has other darker corners in their past, such as Bopal, but hats off to them for this one. :thumbsup:

Why be a one trick pony party?

Dow's self-financed achievement leaves more scarce government resources available to underwrite other promising technologies that aren't as far along in development and marketing.

Im just happy I bought at $16 in April

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

I know, they don't fund it at all. Look ONLY $0.5 billion was set aside in the first few months in office! Heck, they only pumped $16.8 Billion in here. :roll:

So you bought some solar shingles? Cool! How are they working for you? No, don't have any? Ok, so how much did your party put into the hands of Americans to buy this? Hey, how about helping to ramp up production? No?

Government has been tossing bones to energy development since the Carter days. Three wars, an oil embargo and countless lives lost later, we're doing the same thing.

We have things we can use today, and it's not important enough to make happen. Go figure.

 

[LTC8K6]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

Because they are a subsidized joke?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Why don't they throw 1/10 the effort into subsidizing things like this? as they do their pet health care legislation?

With things like this we could take a lot of power off the grid and lessen our dependence on oil. Less political ties to unstable countries, less emissions, more independence for the individual. Put a huge tax subsidy for this kind of technology and the economy of scale will bring down costs.

Why be a one trick pony party?

Because they are a subsidized joke?

Ok, why don't you tell us why it doesn't work? Got specifics? You have any expertise in the field? Got anything?