So as a n00b to PC gaming, can someone explain how the transition to DX12 may work?

[Pottuvoi]

There's usually a good 3+ years between the release of a new DirectX API and the first games that are bold enough to make that API a requirement and many more years before it's common to see the new API a requirement.

The 3+ years is the time GPU designers get to create the new architecture so it is not big surprise to see new dx shader model in that cycle.

This would mean the 2013-2014 for the next DX/SM.. (when Maxwell and AMD future architecture are released.)

 

[taltamir]

DirectX 1-9 were all backwards compatible up until XP. With the new Vista driver model update DX10 onwards has remained backwards compatible and to my knowledge the plan is to keep that backwards compatibility going forward, so I would expect DX10/11/12 to all be backwards compatible.

DX5 and below games tend to have issues in XP and above.

 

[BFG10K]

DirectX is backwards compatible, but GPU drivers sometimes drop or alter legacy functions, and this breaks older games.

 

[taltamir]

DirectX is backwards compatible, but GPU drivers sometimes drop or alter legacy functions, and this breaks older games.

This doesn't happen with OpenGL.
This is because to be allowed to say your GPU is OGL v# compliant it must support backwards compatibility with all previous versions.
To say that your GPU is DX v# compliant it must support only that version.

 

[SuperMarioBro]

1. No they aren't, the GPUs that were cut down to make the console GPUs performed better in cross platform games.
2. You can't even buy computers this slow anymore. 2 years ago smartphones were equivalent to consoles. Nowadays top of the line smartphones have 4x the RAM and similar CPU/GPU.
3. So if I call you out on calling a cut down, weaker part "optimized" I now hate consoles?
4. Consoles are not more optimized. Console GAMES are more optimized.
Console games get more optimization because they need to in order to run at all. This is a very expensive and long process that require experts trying to eke out every last ounce of performance from crippled hardware that raises the time and cost to develop games.

Consoles don't have to run an operating system and handle multiple simultaneous apps running in the background. Of course they aren't going to have a very powerful CPU or a lot of RAM. Why would they?

They're single-purpose, dedicated machines (although Nintendo/MS/Sony seem intent on making them more versatile...). That's why, when it comes to gaming, they can do more with less. At least from my understanding... I'm no processor architect, unfortunately.

 

[DaveSimmons]

This doesn't happen with OpenGL.
This is because to be allowed to say your GPU is OGL v# compliant it must support backwards compatibility with all previous versions.
To say that your GPU is DX v# compliant it must support only that version.

Windows games have had issues with this in the past, like Chronicles of Riddick's OpenGL 1.3 error.

So, a game using OpenGL does not mean you're safe from backwards compatibility issues.

 

[taltamir]

Windows games have had issues with this in the past, like Chronicles of Riddick's OpenGL 1.3 error.

So, a game using OpenGL does not mean you're safe from backwards compatibility issues.

Compatibility issues are always possible but they are fairly rare with OGL while extremely common with DX.

 

[Pottuvoi]

Compatibility issues are always possible but they are fairly rare with OGL while extremely common with DX.

There were some hardware features dropped around DX8 times and this caused problems on both dx and GL titles.
One of the big ones was support for paletized textures. (2-8bit CLUT)

 

[Father Torque]

Consoles ALWAYS have the best graphics and best graphics tech at the start of a new gen.I don't see why this next gen coming up will be any different. The WiiU doesnt count since Nintendo is a generation behind everyone else.

 

[taltamir]

Consoles ALWAYS have the best graphics and best graphics tech at the start of a new gen.

No they don't.
The wii is not even in consideration... but the PS3 and Xbox360 were both using a cutdown version of a upper-mid GPU that was a generation behind. For example, the nvidia 8800GTX came out 3 days before the PS3. The 8800GTX was a MASSIVE upgrade over the DX9 cards from a generation before, the best of which are superior to whats in the xbox360 and PS3.

 

[StrangerGuy]

No they don't.
The wii is not even in consideration... but the PS3 and Xbox360 were both using a cutdown version of a upper-mid GPU that was a generation behind. For example, the nvidia 8800GTX came out 3 days before the PS3. The 8800GTX was a MASSIVE upgrade over the DX9 cards from a generation before, the best of which are superior to whats in the xbox360 and PS3.

The GPUs for the current consoles were the biggest letdowns this gen. If they have waited another year or so they could have been so MUCH more powerful based on DX10 unified shader parts for the PC. I don't think there will be silliness like COD4's "native 600p upscaled to 720p on X360" stuff if the console GPUs even had half a 8800GTX.

 

[flopper]

Games lag behind, and its not even 3 years its often 5+ years before we see a wider adoption from developers. most people upgrade their systems every 3-5 year or so.
Unless your a tech nerd. I got a new videocard after 2 years, that is about it.
dont foresee any new tech t0 get in 2 years, and likely to play GW2 or such on dx9 etc..until dx11 catch on....

BF3 is a joke as a dx11 title, its a good looking game but gamemechanics with netcode, makes the behaviour of the core design a pretty much a joke for me.
I dont play games due to them looks good, its for fun and enjoyment and I dont enjoy BF3.

 

[Father Torque]

No they don't.
The wii is not even in consideration... but the PS3 and Xbox360 were both using a cutdown version of a upper-mid GPU that was a generation behind. For example, the nvidia 8800GTX came out 3 days before the PS3. The 8800GTX was a MASSIVE upgrade over the DX9 cards from a generation before, the best of which are superior to whats in the xbox360 and PS3.

The 360 used a GPU that was a generation ahead,not a cutdown out dated PC gpu. ATI even said it was the most powerful GPU they had produced to date. The PC only guys couldnt deal with it so most kept saying it was a cut down x1800/x1900 when the Xenos has absolutely nothing to do with an x1800/x1900.

Just like the original Xbox had the most powerful GPU when it was released.Xbox always has the best graphics.Expect the trend to continue.

 

[taltamir]

Consoles ALWAYS have the best graphics and best graphics tech at the start of a new gen.

No they don't.
The wii is not even in consideration... but the PS3 and Xbox360 were both using a cutdown version of a upper-mid GPU that was a generation behind. For example, the nvidia 8800GTX came out 3 days before the PS3. The 8800GTX was a MASSIVE upgrade over the DX9 cards from a generation before, the best of which are superior to whats in the xbox360 and PS3.

The 360 used a GPU that was a generation ahead,not a cutdown out dated PC gpu. ATI even said it was the most powerful GPU they had produced to date. The PC only guys couldnt deal with it so most kept saying it was a cut down x1800/x1900 when the Xenos has absolutely nothing to do with an x1800/x1900.

Just like the original Xbox had the most powerful GPU when it was released.Xbox always has the best graphics.Expect the trend to continue.

You know what, I was generalizing (because you were) and that was wrong of me... lets take it one by one.

Wii, I am not gonna even bother. Obviously it was slow.

The PoS3 used a pathetic powerPC CPU with pathetic amounts of RAM and a cutdown version of nvidia 7800, reduced to 7600 levels on some aspects. It became available in November 11, 2006. 3 days after the 8800GTX came out and slaughtered the 7800s

The Xbox360 came out way back in November 16, 2005 according to wikipedia, a whole year prior.
And uses a modified 1800 which has additional features that later show up in ATIs next gen... however it couples those extra features with lower clockspeed, less ram (512 is shared between OS, game engine, and GPU... the 1800 came with either 256 or 512MB), and slower ram (GDDR3 @ 700MHz on Xenos, 1.5GHz on X1800). However it also tries to compensates for that with 10MiB eDRAM on a daughterboard.
Overall this combination of cutdowns and upgrades combines in such a way that I think (but cannot be sure) was indeed faster then the X1800 like you claim. However! You said:

Consoles ALWAYS have the best graphics and best graphics tech at the start of a new gen.

Graphics and tech... not GPU. Graphics are heavily GPU dependent but also require other things to be good (CPU, RAM, etc) to a lesser degree. And tech...
Not only is this statement patently false for the Wii and PoS3.

But for the xbox360 you have a maybe faster GPU encumbered by anemic RAM (size and speed) and a crummy CPU (triple core high MHz HT enabled ... PowerPC derivative with bad performance/MHz). And that is when it even worked in the first place since they released it in such a shoddy state and it kept on RRODing.

So, maybe better GPU with a combination of cutdowns and boosties... saddled with albatrosses that cause it to have overall worse graphics and tech.
And less then a year later (6 years ago) the 8800GTX and annihilate its only strong point (GPU).

 

[Pray To Jesus]

Consoles ALWAYS have the best graphics and best graphics tech at the start of a new gen.I don't see why this next gen coming up will be any different. The WiiU doesnt count since Nintendo is a generation behind everyone else.

Keep thinking that buddy. If you wish hard enough it might even be close to last gen graphics.

 

[notty22]

Microsoft Talks Hardware Acceleration in Windows 8

The latest Building Windows 8 blog details graphics hardware acceleration in the upcoming OS which will come packed with DirectX 11.1

 

[shadow_k]

Bf3 is DX10+++