Snow details tax breaks for hybrid cars

[techs]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060113/us_...Ir0F;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MXN1bHE0BHNlYwN0bWE-
Treasury Secretary John Snow, aiming to boost the ailing domestic auto industry and encourage conservation, on Friday outlined details of proposed tax breaks for people who buy hybrid gasoline-electric vehicles.

At a Ford Motor Co. research center in suburban Detroit, Snow discussed tax policy changes that would give people who buy or lease increasingly popular hybrid cars and trucks a tax credit up to $3,400.
The tax credits are limited in the sense that they will be phased out for each manufacturer once that company has sold 60,000 eligible vehicles.


The last line is whats important. Since Toyota has already sold a ton of hybrids they are over the 60,000 or will be very soon. So the break is really for American automakers.
This is actually the same type of subsidy that other countries are using to unfairly compete with America and I like the idea that we are sticking them back.

 

[Ryan]

It still won't help them. Toyota has solidified itself as the hybrid leader, and the general public knows it. When they think hybrid, they think Toyota - this ins't going to hold them back at all.

 

[Strk]

How is it bad news for Toyota when they hit the 60,000 mark, while others are still lagging behind them? If you ask me, it sounds like they're the winners of the bunch.

Ford will lag behind for a little while longer, as the hybrid Fusion isn't due out for a while. GM is even further behind, since their only hybrid is a truck, which isn't even for the better fuel consumption (because it doesn't really get any).

Toyota received the highest tax break, with Honda not far behind them.

 

[tennisflip]

I know several people who were purchasing a Prius without even knowing that such a tax break even existed. I don't see this harming Toyota at all.

 

[EagleKeeper]

The credit would have to be given to each manufacturer, not to the public.
And the manufacturere would have to pass it along to the consumer.

If it was set up for the consumer based on model purchased; it would be challenged in tax court.

 

[dmcowen674]

Too late for American Auto workers.

Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week. :thumbsup:

 

[judasmachine]

Dear GM and Ford and Dodge,

Make desirable cars that are also efficient.

Thanks,
Judasmachine


PS The governement shouldn't be giving you breaks, if you continue to build crap vehicles. Try competing instead of whining.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week. :thumbsup:

If in doubt, just make stuff up!

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: FuzzyBee

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week. :thumbsup:

If in doubt, just make stuff up!

Can you read???

From the above article:

"Ford also plans to close plants and cut jobs as part of a restructuring announcement to be made next week."

 

[FuzzyBee]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: FuzzyBee

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week. :thumbsup:

If in doubt, just make stuff up!

Can you read???

From the above article:

"Ford also plans to close plants and cut jobs as part of a restructuring announcement to be made next week."

Can you type???

"Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week." WTF does that mean?

I'll presume that you mean "Ford is announcing the closing of North American operations next week." In this case, you imply that Ford is closing all of their North American operations next week, which is incorrect. BTW, it doesn't say there that Ford is closing North American plants, does it?

 

[EagleKeeper]

Technicalities are suppressed for maximum impact.

 

[BlancoNino]

What disgusts me the most are people who strongly support american unions and then buy japanese cars. The UAW is the main cause of poorly built american cars because it's hard to spend time and money building new cars when you're going bankrupt paying employees.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: FuzzyBee

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: FuzzyBee

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week. :thumbsup:

If in doubt, just make stuff up!

Can you read???

From the above article:

"Ford also plans to close plants and cut jobs as part of a restructuring announcement to be made next week."

Can you type???

"Ford is announcing the closing North American operations next week." WTF does that mean?

I'll presume that you mean "Ford is announcing the closing of North American operations next week." In this case, you imply that Ford is closing all of their North American operations next week, which is incorrect. BTW, it doesn't say there that Ford is closing North American plants, does it?

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper
Technicalities are suppressed for maximum impact.

Technically the United States is dead but the Sheeple don't realize it yet because they have been brainwashed so well. Way to go Republicans :thumbsup:

Seriously, excellent job, 1930's Europe Leaders are extremley proud from beyond the grave.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Technically the United States is dead but the Sheeple don't realize it yet because they have been brainwashed so well. Way to go Republicans :thumbsup:

Seriously, excellent job, 1930's Europe Leaders are extremley proud from beyond the grave.

Was that bleating I heard from you?

 

[Strk]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
What disgusts me the most are people who strongly support american unions and then buy japanese cars. The UAW is the main cause of poorly built american cars because it's hard to spend time and money building new cars when you're going bankrupt paying employees.

It isn't the UAW, but GM's insistence on building cars with the cheapest materials they can get their hands on. Ford has been upgrading the materials they use, so why can't GM?

As far as buying Japanese or Korean, Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, Subaru and Nissan all have factories in the United States.

There are major issues with legacy costs because of UAW, but they aren't all to blame for Toyota's taking the number one spot in the world in the near future.

 

[BlancoNino]

There are major issues with legacy costs because of UAW, but they aren't all to blame for Toyota's taking the number one spot in the world in the near future.

I agree it's not all the blame, but I think it's really slowed down the progression of quality. Are the american companies really using "cheaper" materials or are they not engineered and assembled as well? Perhaps that's a direct result of their financial status and spending more time and money on employees rather than on innovation and improvement.

When more fuel efficient cars started to become a huge demand in the US the Japanese car market skyrocketed because they had been making smaller and more efficient cars for years and the American companies had to come up with their own. That, I think, was the other main factor.

Lately, GM's quality has been going up while Ford's hasn't. You can't just quality by resale value either. Used Toyota and Honda's are a complete ripoff because consumers are willing to spend several thousand dollars more on them because of their popularity and name. This is equivilent to the ridiculous resale value of Harley Davidsons which are poorer in quality than most bikes which sell for much less (Not to say that Hondas and Toyotas are of poorer quality, but that it isn't the main factor in resale value).

I bought my 2004 Nissan Sentra with 60,000 miles on it for 9,000. Another dealer was selling a 2004 Toyota Corolla with 200,000 miles on it for the same price (same car class and same options).

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

It is pretty sad the domestic automakers have to be propped up.

 

[fornax]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
What disgusts me the most are people who strongly support american unions and then buy japanese cars. The UAW is the main cause of poorly built american cars because it's hard to spend time and money building new cars when you're going bankrupt paying employees.

More precisely, greedy unions and greedy and incompetent companies. GM, Ford, etc. thought the golden age of American automobile manufacturing would last forever and couldn't plan for the future if their life depended on it. There's an Europen proverb that says something like "Dumb is not who eats the cake but those who gave it to him".

 

[Shortass]

Not gonna lie, I'm really going to enjoy driving a Camry next year. Once some better and reasonably priced options from American dealers that have such a good record for durability, I'll consider other options. It's kind of hard to not enjoy a 12 year old car that runs as it did in 1993.

 

[nageov3t]

ah, well, the people getting the tax cut on the american cars can use that money for all the additional repairs they'll need versus japanese cars.

 

[marincounty]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

There are major issues with legacy costs because of UAW, but they aren't all to blame for Toyota's taking the number one spot in the world in the near future.

I agree it's not all the blame, but I think it's really slowed down the progression of quality. Are the american companies really using "cheaper" materials or are they not engineered and assembled as well? Perhaps that's a direct result of their financial status and spending more time and money on employees rather than on innovation and improvement.

When more fuel efficient cars started to become a huge demand in the US the Japanese car market skyrocketed because they had been making smaller and more efficient cars for years and the American companies had to come up with their own. That, I think, was the other main factor.

Lately, GM's quality has been going up while Ford's hasn't. You can't just quality by resale value either. Used Toyota and Honda's are a complete ripoff because consumers are willing to spend several thousand dollars more on them because of their popularity and name. This is equivilent to the ridiculous resale value of Harley Davidsons which are poorer in quality than most bikes which sell for much less (Not to say that Hondas and Toyotas are of poorer quality, but that it isn't the main factor in resale value).

I bought my 2004 Nissan Sentra with 60,000 miles on it for 9,000. Another dealer was selling a 2004 Toyota Corolla with 200,000 miles on it for the same price (same car class and same options).

No, I think the problems with Detroit quality have more to do with poor management and short-term profit seeking. In the 60's the GM ceo said the japanese would never sell more than 50,000 cars here-ha ha ha ha
When they were making tons selling Ford Explorers at a $10,000 profit, did they put that money into R&D? No, they gave to the sharelholders.
"Used Toyota and Honda's are a complete ripoff because consumers are willing to spend several thousand dollars more on them because of their popularity and name"-is complete bull, the reason people will pay so much for a used Toyota or Honda is because they are the MOST RELIABLE CARS MADE. My dad's Toyota has over 200k miles and the head has never been off. Try that in a Ford. And I notice you bought a japanese car-where's your patriotism?

 

[BlancoNino]

No, I think the problems with Detroit quality have more to do with poor management and short-term profit seeking. In the 60's the GM ceo said the japanese would never sell more than 50,000 cars here-ha ha ha ha
When they were making tons selling Ford Explorers at a $10,000 profit, did they put that money into R&D? No, they gave to the sharelholders.
"Used Toyota and Honda's are a complete ripoff because consumers are willing to spend several thousand dollars more on them because of their popularity and name"-is complete bull, the reason people will pay so much for a used Toyota or Honda is because they are the MOST RELIABLE CARS MADE. My dad's Toyota has over 200k miles and the head has never been off. Try that in a Ford. And I notice you bought a japanese car-where's your patriotism?

1) I partially disagree with your theory on Detroit quality. If the speculation was that the japanese weren't going to be fierce competitors AND that everyone thought the U.S. had tons of oil, how could you blame them?

2) I had a 1987 Ford Mustang GT with 188,000 pretty rough miles on it (lots of racing) and the head had never been off either. My sisters 1993 Accord had transmission problems, window problems, door problems, air conditioning failure...my co-workers 94 accord had 120,000 miles on it with a fair enough amount of internal problems it pretty much needed a rebuild. My only point is that there are stories from everything, not to disredit Toyota or Honda. Again, I ask...2004 Sentra with 60,000 miles on it or 2004 Corolla with 200,000 miles on it (same condition, options, and class) for the same price?

3) My point was never that everyone should be buying only American made cars. Although I find it highly unfair that we sell Japanese cars but Japan doesn't sell American cars. And don't forget about the hassle Detroit has to go through to sell their cars in other countries (taxes, etc) that others don't have to deal with.

 

[EatSpam]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
What disgusts me the most are people who strongly support american unions and then buy japanese cars. The UAW is the main cause of poorly built american cars because it's hard to spend time and money building new cars when you're going bankrupt paying employees.

LOL. The management with their golden parachutes and massive bonuses are the issue. Seriously, if you were in the UAW, would you give management any concessions? I wouldn't. The managment would just take the money saved and put it in their paycheck!

 

[marincounty]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

No, I think the problems with Detroit quality have more to do with poor management and short-term profit seeking. In the 60's the GM ceo said the japanese would never sell more than 50,000 cars here-ha ha ha ha
When they were making tons selling Ford Explorers at a $10,000 profit, did they put that money into R&D? No, they gave to the sharelholders.
"Used Toyota and Honda's are a complete ripoff because consumers are willing to spend several thousand dollars more on them because of their popularity and name"-is complete bull, the reason people will pay so much for a used Toyota or Honda is because they are the MOST RELIABLE CARS MADE. My dad's Toyota has over 200k miles and the head has never been off. Try that in a Ford. And I notice you bought a japanese car-where's your patriotism?

1) I partially disagree with your theory on Detroit quality. If the speculation was that the japanese weren't going to be fierce competitors AND that everyone thought the U.S. had tons of oil, how could you blame them?

2) I had a 1987 Ford Mustang GT with 188,000 pretty rough miles on it (lots of racing) and the head had never been off either. My sisters 1993 Accord had transmission problems, window problems, door problems, air conditioning failure...my co-workers 94 accord had 120,000 miles on it with a fair enough amount of internal problems it pretty much needed a rebuild. My only point is that there are stories from everything, not to disredit Toyota or Honda. Again, I ask...2004 Sentra with 60,000 miles on it or 2004 Corolla with 200,000 miles on it (same condition, options, and class) for the same price?

3) My point was never that everyone should be buying only American made cars. Although I find it highly unfair that we sell Japanese cars but Japan doesn't sell American cars. And don't forget about the hassle Detroit has to go through to sell their cars in other countries (taxes, etc) that others don't have to deal with.

Wrong, they do sell American cars in Japan. But there is not much demand for Cadillacs and Ford Explorers in a country with gas at $5 per gallon and roads the size of an alleyway. The American cars they would consider are inferior and more expensive than a japanese car. Wait, there is one segment of japanese society that loves american cars-the yakuza.