Slashdot topic on programming being a "dead end job"

[joohang]

<< Correct me if I'm wrong since I'm not a programmer and only know a little fortran, but can't a good progremmer easily make a transition to another language fairly quickly? >>


What manly and I were arguing (if I am understanding his argument correctly) is the distinction between a "good" programmer and a "bad" programmer.
I am a "medium-bad" programmer studying hard to become a good programmer.



<< As a side note I can't see any fun in programming. Seems like a solo job with little people interaction and bad for the eyes? >>


A good programmer has a lot of people interaction with the team. And it's great to work with a great team. Some linkies for you:
Microsoft Solutions Framework
McCarthy Technologies and the Core Protocols

If a programmer sits by himself in his own office/cubicle, there is likely something seriously wrong with that organization/team.



<< What makes it so attractive? Is it an art to make good code that intrests you guys? Seriously im interested. >>


It is the joy that when the damn thing BUILDS and the build WORKS, I feel like I am the king of the world. It's a great feeling.

And most good programmers I know have a strong passion in programming or some computer-related area in general. So what makes it so attractive? They are following their passion.

 

[manly]

Carbonyl,

You're absolutely correct, and that's what I alluded to earlier.

CS != computer programming, but the average CS graduate is probably fairly well equipped to do computer programming. She should be able to acquire any technology and run with it. In fact, understanding the variety of tools available, and picking a proper one for the job is extremely important.

If I run around saying use Java for everything, or use Microsoft for everything, then I'm probably not making good use of CS fundamentals. If the only tool in your belt is a hammer... everything looks like a nail, I think the cliche goes.

I didn't mean to demean VB programmers at all. What I was alluding to is that VB is popular because it's pushed by MS, and it's easy to get your feet wet. As an analogy, it's like HTML. Anyone can set up a dirty home page, but that doesn't make everyone a web designer either. So I'm just saying there are probably many VB coders who have an uphill battle since VB.Net is a new programming model. As a related counter-example, I would argue that because C# is a close language to Java, any good Java programmer would have the shortest learning curve to learn C#.

Finally, while programming may often seem like a solitary activity, professionally it's not. The reason is that there's a finite limit to what one person can do. One person, no matter how brilliant must specialize because he can't possibly know everything (although some try and succeed to various degrees). So the essential challenge is building software is to assemble a team that works together to ship the product. Think basketball for example. We all know Jordan was the best ever, but if he had to play 1 on 5 against other teams, he can't win.

There is a famous computer engineering book (Brooks' The Mythical Man Month, highly recommended) that has a cover illustration that sums up what software development can be like at its worse: it illustrates woolly mammoths stuck in tar pits to die.

 

[Zebo]

Cool bones there Manley...

I with Manlry on this. There really is no subsitution for the "thoery" you learn in college by completeing a degree. Plus it's helps you to know where to look if you don't know something.. In science and engineering (CS is included) I think this ability to quickly find and understand you found the proper resource is what you get by completeing the whole four years rather than just some boot camp tech classes and it makes you more adaptable to change.

 

[ShanCiera44]

Hello,

There are a lot of computer programing jobs offered with Hewlett-Packard Development Company, its just about finding the right job for you <removed>has a variety of entry-level programming jobs, in addition to other IT related jobs openings all across the U.S., Canada and overseas. Hope this helps Good Luck

Good Luck
ShanCiera

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[Broheim]

eleven year old thread... Honestly I don't understand why they aren't just closed after a certain amount of time and you have to PM a mod to have it reopened. The mods usually close the necro anyway, regardless of any relevant posts.

 

[Markbnj]

Hello,

There are a lot of computer programing jobs offered with Hewlett-Packard Development Company, its just about finding the right job for you. HP Careers has a variety of entry-level programming jobs, in addition to other IT related jobs openings all across the U.S., Canada and overseas. Hope this helps Good Luck

Good Luck
ShanCiera

Thank god you're here! I've been out of work since April of 2002. Do you think HP will hire me? Is C still hot? Please reply.

 

[videogames101]

lol OP


"java"


..lol


most people with CS degrees suck at programming

 

[Rakehellion]

most people with CS degrees suck at programming

This, pretty much.

Programmers are disposable. You need to be a good designer, project manager, or something other than a guy who processes work units.

 

[Doppel]

eleven year old thread... Honestly I don't understand why they aren't just closed after a certain amount of time and you have to PM a mod to have it reopened. The mods usually close the necro anyway, regardless of any relevant posts.

I don't understand why necros are so bad.

In this case it's a thread predicting something and 11 years later is a fantastic time to discuss it. As far as this thread is concerned programming wasn't a dead-end career 11 years ago, was it? Also interesting to see that some still think the same thing today.

IT is one of the healthiest fields now, and it wasn't when this thread was started, reeling freshly off the dotcom burst.

 

[IEC]

Programming will always be a good career - provided you can adapt to survive. What is useful or hot right now won't necessarily be so in another 5 years.

And lol at law school.

 

[Broheim]

I don't understand why necros are so bad.

In this case it's a thread predicting something and 11 years later is a fantastic time to discuss it. As far as this thread is concerned programming wasn't a dead-end career 11 years ago, was it? Also interesting to see that some still think the same thing today.

IT is one of the healthiest fields now, and it wasn't when this thread was started, reeling freshly off the dotcom burst.

I think it's a perfectly good time to discuss it, and yes a relevant necro is a good thing, but 99% of the time it's just some guy who googled something and never looked at the post date.

outsourcing and particularly off-shoring IT more often than not is a bad idea by some clueless business major at the top, and there's no shortage of horror stories.