single payer healthcare moving forward in VT

[Macamus Prime]

",.. the new law will mandate the creation a five-member board appointed by the governor to set payment rates for doctors, which benefits will be covered, and a number of other details"

Like a medical fee "cap". Isn't that like,... COMMUNISM? MAH GAWD!! This is AH-MER-IKA!! Whatcha'll doin ta this great nation of awrs?!?!

 

[Craig234]

I know I certainly wouldn't vote for medicare fraud enforcement.

At least you're consistently wrong.

Don't spend the few dollars on enforcement, and lose the huge dollars to criminals.

(Oh, I know, you can say you just wouldn't have Medicare, but that's not one of your options in the topic.)

 

[Nebor]

At least you're consistently wrong.

Don't spend the few dollars on enforcement, and lose the huge dollars to criminals.

(Oh, I know, you can say you just wouldn't have Medicare, but that's not one of your options in the topic.)

I'd just point out that Medicare is riddled with fraud and needs to be done away with.

I'd rather the money go to crafty criminals than societal leaches anyway. At least the criminals are showing some initiative. LOL.

 

[Craig234]

I'd just point out that Medicare is riddled with fraud and needs to be done away with.

I'd rather the money go to crafty criminals than societal leaches anyway. At least the criminals are showing some initiative. LOL.

Another Ayn Rand nutjob. Do you abuse yourself watching Logan's Run instead of porn?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Well this should be interesting. If they screw up things as much as medicaid is now then there won't be much rejoicing. On the other hand they might achieve a workable system.

We'll see.

 

[Double Trouble]

",.. the new law will mandate the creation a five-member board appointed by the governor to set payment rates for doctors, which benefits will be covered, and a number of other details

What they will find is that if they set payment rates at levels that are lower than what the market commands, doctors will simply not opt in (the same way they opt out of medicare, leaving patients with no primary care physician options if they are on medicare).

I'm sure it will be a mess, but the people of VT can decide if it suits their needs or not. If they like the results, that's fine. At this point nobody really knows what will or won't happen because we don't have a crystal ball to see the future, we can all only speculate.

 

[werepossum]

It probably won't be less expensive simply because of the moral hazard-type of problem. Healthy well-to-do people are liable to emigrate out of the state and sick people are liable to immigrate. In contrast, if it were implemented on a national scale that sort of problem wouldn't come up, provided that we end illegal immigration and reduce legal immigration.

You think this will be so good that those financially able to flee it will do so, so your solution is to make it nationwide? M'kay . . .

Personally I'm all for it. Let's try a variety of measures in different states to provide full coverage and access, then see what works best. Other states can then adopt from the more successful plans.

 

[Zebo]

",.. the new law will mandate the creation a five-member board appointed by the governor to set payment rates for doctors, which benefits will be covered, and a number of other details"

Like a medical fee "cap". Isn't that like,... COMMUNISM? MAH GAWD!! This is AH-MER-IKA!! Whatcha'll doin ta this great nation of awrs?!?!

No offense but protecting profits with patents, licensees, etc is just as much command economy as regulating prices. What we have now is protection for monopolies. Must be nice. Make a drug and if you don't take it you die and company can charge whatever. Talk about 'over the barrel' - hence outrageous costs relative to rest of the world.

 

[JSt0rm]

You think this will be so good that those financially able to flee it will do so, so your solution is to make it nationwide? M'kay . . .

Thats speculation. We dont know if people who are upper middle class will leave it or not. The mega wealthy already have private doctors so why would they care?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Thats speculation. We dont know if people who are upper middle class will leave it or not. The mega wealthy already have private doctors so why would they care?

People will care if the state taxes the shit out of them. VT oldtimers are probably saying WTF to all this.

 

[KGB]

People will care if the state taxes the shit out of them. VT oldtimers are probably saying WTF to all this.

They'll prolly migrate, en masse to Florida.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

You think this will be so good that those financially able to flee it will do so, so your solution is to make it nationwide? M'kay . . .

If no one immigrated into the state then there might not be any reason for anyone to emigrate out. However, if sick people and the poor from other states start moving in, it could become a burden on the more well-to-do people.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

No offense but protecting profits with patents, licensees, etc is just as much command economy as regulating prices. What we have now is protection for monopolies. Must be nice. Make a drug and if you don't take it you die and company can charge whatever. Talk about 'over the barrel' - hence outrageous costs relative to rest of the world.

Pharmaceutical patents pose an interesting problem. On the one hand we want affordable drugs. On the other hand companies that engage in expensive and risky pharmaceutical research need to be rewarded. Maybe what we need is some sort of system of mandatory licensing to competing producers that would give patent holders a certain percentage of all sales proceeds. This way the company wouldn't have a monopoly but would still benefit financially for having developed the drug.

Of course, anything we do to reduce pharmaceutical profits on patented drugs will stymie new drug development, so it's a policy balancing act where we have to balance out two competing policies (innovation and having affordable drugs).

Perhaps the federal government should invest more money in the public research of pharmaceuticals.

 

[JSt0rm]

People will care if the state taxes the shit out of them. VT oldtimers are probably saying WTF to all this.

Is that worst then ever inflating healthcare costs? Also is replacing healthcare spending with taxes to pay for healthcare less expensive? most think yes.

Is like the same argument always comes from the pro-health as profit crowd.

 

[werepossum]

Thats speculation. We dont know if people who are upper middle class will leave it or not. The mega wealthy already have private doctors so why would they care?

My point was merely that if the system is so bad that people flee it, making it nationwide merely makes everyone live under a bad system. Whether or not it makes people flee, at least to the degree that wealth migrates out of the state, remains to be seen and depends on many factors like how well it is implemented, how many restrictions it places on those who wish to spend their own money on their own health care, how well health care providers are compensated, what level of health care was available before versus afterward, etc.

If no one immigrated into the state then there might not be any reason for anyone to emigrate out. However, if sick people and the poor from other states start moving in, it could become a burden on the more well-to-do people.

Agreed, that's a valid point.

 

[JSt0rm]

how many restrictions it places on those who wish to spend their own money on their own health care,

http://www.cedars-sinai.edu/

There is a doctor at this hospital that will on accept cash for treatment. A lot of cash. Only the mega wealthy get to see him. His situation will not change no matter what type of health care plan in implemented. You will find these types of doctors near the very wealthy. Exceptional at what they do to the point that they only need to accept the highest amount of money. You, werepossum from yeehawdy dooville will never ever get this type of healthcare.

 

[Nebor]

http://www.cedars-sinai.edu/

There is a doctor at this hospital that will on accept cash for treatment. A lot of cash. Only the mega wealthy get to see him. His situation will not change no matter what type of health care plan in implemented. You will find these types of doctors near the very wealthy. Exceptional at what they do to the point that they only need to accept the highest amount of money. You, werepossum from yeehawdy dooville will never ever get this type of healthcare.

Uh, anyone can get access to a private doctor, with many procedures and treatments included in the package for less than $50,000 a year. They do house calls and usually have only a handful of patients.

 

[Zebo]

What they will find is that if they set payment rates at levels that are lower than what the market commands, doctors will simply not opt in (the same way they opt out of medicare, leaving patients with no primary care physician options if they are on medicare).

I'm sure it will be a mess, but the people of VT can decide if it suits their needs or not. If they like the results, that's fine. At this point nobody really knows what will or won't happen because we don't have a crystal ball to see the future, we can all only speculate.

This. Because they have someplace better to go, like RI or anywhere else nearby.

There is only 2 ways health care works not this weird amalgam we have with outrageous costs and shit service.

1. Countries who have socialized medicine impose strict price controls on drugs, devices and payments to professionals nationwide. All professionals are state employees. No one can sue. None of these nations allow their pharmaceutical companies to sell drugs and devices at 10x or 100x the price in other nations in their markets like we do.

2. Then there are the true Free Market systems, such as India. You can fly there and have any procedure done by the best usually grads from a US medical school or their medical schools which are even better.. Your hospital room will look a 5-star Hotel. Procedure will only cost 1/5th of what it costs here in the US. You will have to pay cash and that very nice Hospital doesn't treat people who don't have any money. Sorry charlie.

 

[OCGuy]

I love how ignorant people pretend that a state like Vermont is the same as a border state as far as people who cannot contribute to the system.

It is sad that the critical thinking skills of liberals fail to see the difference...


There is a reason why every time a list comes out naming the happiest and most well-off countries, it is always the same few. Unfortunately it is politically incorrect to point out the reasons why.

 

[Zebo]

http://www.cedars-sinai.edu/

There is a doctor at this hospital that will on accept cash for treatment. A lot of cash. Only the mega wealthy get to see him. His situation will not change no matter what type of health care plan in implemented. You will find these types of doctors near the very wealthy. Exceptional at what they do to the point that they only need to accept the highest amount of money. You, werepossum from yeehawdy dooville will never ever get this type of healthcare.

They have to treat everyone. EMTALA says so. Cash payers maybe make up the shortfalls for treating non payers.

 

[JSt0rm]

They have to treat everyone. EMTALA says so. Cash payers maybe make up the shortfalls for treating non payers.

The hospital does but this specific doctor does not. Infact he has people on his staff whos job it is to give insurance patients the run around until they go away.

 

[JSt0rm]

Uh, anyone can get access to a private doctor, with many procedures and treatments included in the package for less than $50,000 a year. They do house calls and usually have only a handful of patients.

He costs much more then this. He's not a general practice guy.

 

[Ape]

Good for VT. I think it's stupid and I would move if I lived there and they implemented it. 40 plus states to chose from.

 

[Zebo]

The hospital does but this specific doctor does not. Infact he has people on his staff whos job it is to give insurance patients the run around until they go away.

What's his name? I bet he's been sued plenty.

 

[JSt0rm]

What's his name? I bet he's been sued plenty.

sued for what?