Simple house wiring issue

[Fanatical Meat]

Greenman has an interesting point.
Maybe consider a demo and rebuild yourself.
Construction loans are difficult but possible. Interest is really low. Go modest on building and it may be cheaper than fixing all this stuff.
Aren’t you and @Greenman both in California?

@Greenman what is the average finished build cost per foot?

While I don’t know CA building codes well, I assume it is easier to build on an existing foundation vs a new foundation. The new building would have the same envelope or real similar.

 

[Muse]

Sounds like there's so much work to do, you need to decide if it's worth it for you to do it or it. Ex: realize you probably will never get that money back if all you care about is resale value, but if it will make it better for your own enjoyment then that is worth something.

Well, there's something else to consider: The process of making improvements has its inconveniences, majorly, not just expenditures. Who, how, what, making the adjustments necessary to allow the work to happen, noise, dust, debris, cleanup. Formidable! ATM, my electricity, plumbing, are not overtly problematical at all. The roofs are fine. My landscaping is a problem, I do it all. I think I should take some classes!

 

[Muse]

Greenman has an interesting point.
Maybe consider a demo and rebuild yourself.
Construction loans are difficult but possible. Interest is really low. Go modest on building and it may be cheaper than fixing all this stuff.
Aren’t you and @Greenman both in California?

@Greenman what is the average finished build cost per foot?

While I don’t know CA building codes well, I assume it is easier to build on an existing foundation vs a new foundation. The new building would have the same envelope or real similar.

My foundation is like from Roman times, stones and mortar (I forget what they call it). It's not a poured concrete foundation and AFAIK there's no way to bolt a house to it. To build another house here the foundation would AFAIK have to be completely removed and a standard modern foundation formulated as on a new lot.

I saw a story on TV news the other day that wood is 3x as expensive right now as it was a year or two. It would seem to be the absolutely wrong time to tear down and rebuild if money is a major issue. Those construction materials costs, wood anyway, and going to come down (they said).

 

[Red Squirrel]

Yeah I would not do anything right now that's for sure. In November a 2x4x8 was around $3 and now it's around $11.

Copper prices seem high too, I was pricing out electrical wiring and I never really kept track of it but it seems more expensive than it should be.

So now is a good time to plan this stuff, but I would not actually do anything until hopefully things calm down. It could be a few years.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

My foundation is like from Roman times, stones and mortar (I forget what they call it). It's not a poured concrete foundation and AFAIK there's no way to bolt a house to it. To build another house here the foundation would AFAIK have to be completely removed and a standard modern foundation formulated as on a new lot.

I saw a story on TV news the other day that wood is 3x as expensive right now as it was a year or two. It would seem to be the absolutely wrong time to tear down and rebuild if money is a major issue. Those construction materials costs, wood anyway, and going to come down (they said).

You have concrete poured around the existing rock, yes wood prices have increased the costs but this would likely take a year or more to plan out and finance.

 

[Muse]

Knob & tube wiring needs to be replace and replaced in full.
-snip-
If the electrician is going to leave the old wire have them remove the ceramic post thingies that knob & tube has. Not because the inactive wire is dangerous but because you don’t want a potential buyer to see them and fear there is active knob & tube.

The only ceramic post stuff, i.e. the tell tale evidence of knob and tube that I have seen here is in the attic. If an electrician rewired this place I could personally remove that stuff in the attic. I've been up there a lot. I have some big pieces of plywood sitting on joists so I don't have to always be stepping on the joists. After the roofers did a complete tear off and reroof (they didn't replace the roof joists), there was incredible debris in the attic. I went in there and cleaned all of that out, doing the final cleaning with my big wet-dry vacuum.

 

[Muse]

You have concrete poured around the existing rock, yes wood prices have increased the costs but this would likely take a year or more to plan out and finance.

I have money, maybe not enough. But I wouldn't have a whole lot left after tear-down, rebuild! Maybe the smart thing is put money in that I'll get out (or even forgo that if it isn't worth doing)... then GET OUT before an earthquake wrecks things. This house could accommodate a good sized family. When I moved in there were 6 people here, including myself, each having their own bedroom. There are two baths, but both need remodeling. The rooms are mostly smallish. It's a two story "craftsman," has front and back staircases. There have been modifications. Was a two unit during WW II, I had it officially changed to a single family dwelling, maybe not a good idea.

 

[Greenman]

Greenman has an interesting point.
Maybe consider a demo and rebuild yourself.
Construction loans are difficult but possible. Interest is really low. Go modest on building and it may be cheaper than fixing all this stuff.
Aren’t you and @Greenman both in California?

@Greenman what is the average finished build cost per foot?

While I don’t know CA building codes well, I assume it is easier to build on an existing foundation vs a new foundation. The new building would have the same envelope or real similar.

Around here it's in the $350 to $450 per square foot range.
There is no way he would be allowed to build on his old foundation. and no way to bring that foundation up to code.

 

[Red Squirrel]

The issue with a demo is dealing with all the permit BS, inspectors and all that crap. In the end his taxes may also go up. That is one thing to take into account too. Doing some work yourself a little bit over time to fix it you can just skip the permit as long as it's work that's not really visible from outside but something big like a full rebuild you kinda can't get away from it.

 

[Greenman]

I have money, maybe not enough. But I wouldn't have a whole lot left after tear-down, rebuild! Maybe the smart thing is put money in that I'll get out (or even forgo that if it isn't worth doing)... then GET OUT before an earthquake wrecks things. This house could accommodate a good sized family. When I moved in there were 6 people here, including myself, each having their own bedroom. There are two baths, but both need remodeling. The rooms are mostly smallish. It's a two story "craftsman," has front and back staircases. There have been modifications. Was a two unit during WW II, I had it officially changed to a single family dwelling, maybe not a good idea.

The only way you'll ever crack the code on this is by talking to a real estate agent or two, and getting some idea of the homes value as it sits, and if it was in good shape. Then talk to a contractor or two and get a budget for bringing the place up to par. You're in a very desirable area, there might actually be a profit in it.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Around here it's in the $350 to $450 per square foot range.
There is no way he would be allowed to build on his old foundation. and no way to bring that foundation up to code.

You know the business better than I, couldn't in theory he us the same stone foundation footprint in encase that stone in concrete and *I think* it was rebar that I saw in a I'll call it a new build in Milford, interesting thing was event though nothing was left of the original structure the build date in public record was still 1890 or something?
I demanded a lead paint disclosure form (Massachusetts thing)
Public record said it was built during a time when lead was used, thus it needed a lead form.

 

[VirtualLarry]

You're in a very desirable area, there might actually be a profit in it

As they say, "Location, Location, Location."

Do you have enough lot space to tear it all down and put up a Motel 6? With you as the owner?

Edit: Or just a few suites for AirBnB.

 

[Greenman]

The issue with a demo is dealing with all the permit BS, inspectors and all that crap. In the end his taxes may also go up. That is one thing to take into account too. Doing some work yourself a little bit over time to fix it you can just skip the permit as long as it's work that's not really visible from outside but something big like a full rebuild you kinda can't get away from it.

Yes, permits are a pain in the ass as he would need an architect and an engineer, but doing the work without permits has to be disclosed when he sells.
Yes, his property taxes would go up substantially, but the end goal is to have a very valuable property when he's finished.
As his home sits now it's considered none habitable as it doesn't have heat. That limits his market to cash buyers only.

A lot of people love old houses, I wouldn't own one.

 

[Greenman]

You know the business better than I, couldn't in theory he us the same stone foundation footprint in encase that stone in concrete and *I think* it was rebar that I saw in a I'll call it a new build in Milford, interesting thing was event though nothing was left of the original structure the build date in public record was still 1890 or something?
I demanded a lead paint disclosure form (Massachusetts thing)
Public record said it was built during a time when lead was used, thus it needed a lead form.

The issue is that this is earthquake country, we use a LOT of rebar in foundations. The complexity of trying to incase what's already there would far surpass the cost of tearing it out. The easy solution is to raise the house 5 or 6 feet, remove the old foundation and put in a new one. I couldn't tell you if that makes sense or not.

 

[Muse]

As they say, "Location, Location, Location."

Do you have enough lot space to tear it all down and put up a Motel 6? With you as the owner?

Edit: Or just a few suites for AirBnB.

The lot isn't real big or real tiny... it's 40' x 100' IIRC, I think maybe kinda average for the neighborhood, although there's a lot of variation. This isn't a cookie cutter neighborhood, which adds to the charm. However, I don't regard it as a charming neighborhood (I've seen some!). However, the location is pretty great. It all depends on your perspective and needs. Different property shoppers would see it differently, that's the nature of things.

 

[BoomerD]

That's something I pretty much think about on a daily basis. Now, I did start buying EQ insurance around 3-4 years ago, but I don't have confidence or understanding of what would happen if the house suddenly became a tear down. The lot is probably worth quite a bit ATM, but I figure (just rumination here, I have no data or exposure to info on this) that after a "major earthquake" here the value of the property (lot included) might be poof!

You're in Berzerkely...unless the bay area falls into the ocean...your property value will only go up.

 

[Muse]

You're in Berzerkely...unless the bay area falls into the ocean...your property value will only go up.

I figure this, have no experience or data to back it up, just intuition:

In the event that there's a large EQ, a significant number of properties will be badly damaged, and therefore property values will decrease. I mean, right now there are probably very few lots for sale. But if there are suddenly 20-50 houses that are tear-downs, the value of lots for sale in Berkeley will be way down. Could I be wrong? I suppose, I really don't know.

 

[Greenman]

Lot price wouldn't go down if the entire city burned.

 

[Muse]

Lot price wouldn't go down if the entire city burned.

I find that unfathomable, but what do I know?

Edit: I heard that a whole lot of "Northside" burned back in the 1920's. Must have been hell of windy.

 

[Muse]

I find that unfathomable, but what do I know?

Edit: I heard that a whole lot of "Northside" burned back in the 1920's. Must have been hell of windy.

1923 Berkeley, California fire - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org