Shutdown over?

[Zorba]

They aren't. Mitch McConnell could pass a spending bill with 50+1 any time he wishes.

I don't think the dems should be using this line of argument right now. If the filibuster is pulled, we are all very fucked with the current shitshow in congress.

 

[K1052]

Trump wins again. Democrat traitors give GOP everything they want in exchange for promises they already know are meaningless.

As usual with shutdowns I don't think anybody really won.

 

[IronWing]

I don't think the dems should be using this line of argument right now. If the filibuster is pulled, we are all very fucked with the current shitshow in congress.

Mitch already drops the 60 vote rule when ever he find it convenient. In this case, he decided more was to be gained by shutting down the government.

 

[Zorba]

Looks like a compromise has been reached. Ds saying they'll vote yes.

In addition to DACA votes on ACA stabilization appear to have been (again) promised to secure Collins + a couple Ds. Timing is the real question now. If McConnell fucks everybody he made deals with over again all bets will be off in Feb when the CR runs out.

You know McConnell isn't going to keep this promise. Will be interesting to see what happens next. And even if he does, the House will never hear it, so what's the point?

 

[fskimospy]

You know, that does bother me. The minority party should have the power to bring forth some items to vote on too.

It's one of the more dysfunctional aspects of our government in recent years and unlike most of the #bothsides nonsense this really is something both parties have done.

 

[Zorba]

Mitch already drops the 60 vote rule when ever he find it convenient. In this case, he decided more was to be gained by shutting down the government.

He dropped it for the USSC, and used reconciliation a couple of time. My understanding is reconciliation can't be used here.

 

[K1052]

You know McConnell isn't going to keep this promise. Will be interesting to see what happens next. And even if he does, the House will never hear it, so what's the point?

He has a trust problem that's only going to grow in size if he repeatedly keeps screwing over even people in his own caucus in deals made to secure votes. Probably nearing the point to just chuck something over to the House and let them deal with it.

 

[UNCjigga]

As usual with shutdowns I don't think anybody really won.

Trump and the WH will be disappointed if the shutdown ends so soon. They even convinced themselves that they were "winning" the shutdown. He'll probably see a 5 point bump in the opinion polls until the next scandal.

 

[Jaskalas]

It's one of the more dysfunctional aspects of our government in recent years and unlike most of the #bothsides nonsense this really is something both parties have done.

I am 100% in favor of, if a bill is voted down, the opposition immediately has the option and authority to hold a vote on a counter proposal.

 

[fskimospy]

I am 100% in favor of, if a bill is voted down, the opposition immediately has the option and authority to hold a vote on a counter proposal.

Well the main problem is that bills are never put up to be voted on at all. I think avenues should exist for any member to submit legislation. Technically they already do, but as a practical matter they don't.

 

[Jhhnn]

Looks like a compromise has been reached. Ds saying they'll vote yes.

In addition to DACA votes on ACA stabilization appear to have been (again) promised to secure Collins + a couple Ds. Timing is the real question now. If McConnell fucks everybody he made deals with over again all bets will be off in Feb when the CR runs out.

Everybody needs to realize that these short term deals are hostage taking by the GOP. The hostage is the govt of the People. They'll put the hostage in front of the cameras with a gun to their head over and over and over again.

 

[Zorba]

It's one of the more dysfunctional aspects of our government in recent years and unlike most of the #bothsides nonsense this really is something both parties have done.

Yeah, the Majority of the Majority crap needs to die.

 

[Jhhnn]

It's one of the more dysfunctional aspects of our government in recent years and unlike most of the #bothsides nonsense this really is something both parties have done.

Bothsiderism doesn't look good on anybody. The GOP attempted to gum up the works of the Senate with an endless stream of bills that had no hope of passage during Reid's leadership. It was part of their obstructionist strategy. Reid rightfully refused to advance them.

Neither McConnell nor Ryan can prevent defections when it comes to an actual vote on legislation that enjoys bipartisan support so they simply prevent a vote from occurring.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Government will likely reopen with CR until 2/8/18. Vote is currently underway.

 

[K1052]

until the next scandal.

Might have to wait several whole hours or maybe even a day.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Bothsiderism doesn't look good on anybody. The GOP attempted to gum up the works of the Senate with an endless stream of bills that had no hope of passage during Reid's leadership. It was part of their obstructionist strategy. Reid rightfully refused to advance them.

Neither McConnell nor Ryan can prevent defections when it comes to an actual vote on legislation that enjoys bipartisan support so they simply prevent a vote from occurring.

There were a shit-ton of bipartisan bills from the House that Reid obstructed....and you say this was all part of the GOP's obstructionist strategy? What color is the sky in your world?

 

[Jhhnn]

Yeah, the Majority of the Majority crap needs to die.

It's the Hastert rule. It's how the Teahadis hold the Speaker & the GOP hostage. It's why Boehner resigned & why Ryan is a weak Speaker. W/O the Teahadis the GOP doesn't have a majority.

Both their ultra-right billionaire donors & the gerrymandered teahadis have the leadership of the GOP right by the short & curlies. The only answer for that is for Dems to win back the HOR.

 

[fskimospy]

There were a shit-ton of bipartisan bills from the House that Reid obstructed....and you say this was all part of the GOPs obstructionist strategy? What color is the sky in your world?

That's an exceedingly generous view in favor of Republicans. The vast majority of the 'bipartisan' bills passed by the House were on uncontroversial issues that were eventually passed by the Senate anyway. There were very few bipartisan bills of substance that Reid blocked, primarily because there were very few bills of substance that the House would pass that could attract any Democratic votes.

So yes, both parties have on occasion done this and it's a bad thing. The idea that there were a 'shit ton' of these that Reid blocked is a partisan fantasy though.

 

[fskimospy]

Neither McConnell nor Ryan can prevent defections when it comes to an actual vote on legislation that enjoys bipartisan support so they simply prevent a vote from occurring.

Right, and I'm saying that 'I don't want to hold a vote on this because too many people support it' is not a good reason.

 

[Moonbeam]

There were a shit-ton of bipartisan bills from the House that Reid obstructed....and you say this was all part of the GOPs obstructionist strategy? What color is the sky in your world?

If you obstruct obstruction, isn’t that obstruction? It’s not the definition I see as the issue. I’m not really interested in the color of the sky so much as the potential deflection that may be the real intention. I don’t see any sky color that says that republicans are the true masters and applies of obstruction. All for the good of course. You have to save the majority from deviant opinions. America is only for white people. White supremacy and anything that furthers and advantages whites is good. Conservatives are far more morally dedicated and faithful to their principles than liberals. Too bad their principles are also evil. The conservative tide sweeping the country is one that flushes toilets.

White supremisists now control 4 branches of government and government by the people is dead.

 

[glenn1]

As usual with shutdowns I don't think anybody really won.

I think a winner is the principle of "you don't get policy concessions by threatening to or actually closing the government or blocking approval to spend money. This is the third time in a few years where the party that tried the tactic gained basically nothing for their troubles except for bad press. Hopefully unlike the GOP the Dems will be smart enough to learn the lesson the first time rather than stupidly doing the same "hey y'all watch this" stupid sh!t.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

That's an exceedingly generous view in favor of Republicans. The vast majority of the 'bipartisan' bills passed by the House were on uncontroversial issues that were eventually passed by the Senate anyway. There were very few bipartisan bills of substance that Reid blocked, primarily because there were very few bills of substance that the House would pass that could attract any Democratic votes.

So yes, both parties have on occasion done this and it's a bad thing. The idea that there were a 'shit ton' of these that Reid blocked is a partisan fantasy though.

Lots of substantive bipartisan jobs bills were obstructed by Reid at a time when unemployment was very high. He's a scumbag politician who obstructed at every turn...even going to the point of abandoning regular order and disallowing amendments to bills. (Note: When taking power, Republicans immediately reinstated regular order). There is no doubt Republicans obstructed on some issues...especially ACA. But, in addition to hundreds of bipartisan bills, there where even 24 substantive bills from the House solely sponsored by Democrats, that Reid obstructed as well. Reid was a complete and utter scumbag imo and did irreparable harm to this country during his tenure as Senate majority leader.

 

[K1052]

Vote to invoke cloture passed. Now on to the actual vote over the CR then the House.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

If you obstruct obstruction, isn’t that obstruction? It’s not the definition I see as the issue. I’m not really interested in the color of the sky so much as the potential deflection that may be the real intention. I don’t see any sky color that says that republicans are the true masters and applies of obstruction. All for the good of course. You have to save the majority from deviant opinions. America is only for white people. White supremacy and anything that furthers and advantages whites is good. Conservatives are far more morally dedicated and faithful to their principles than liberals. Too bad their principles are also evil. The conservative tide sweeping the country is one that flushes toilets.

White supremisists now control 4 branches of government and government by the people is dead.

Their principles are evil? How so?

 

[SP33Demon]

so people from california arent real americans?

Swing states matter more whether you like it or not.