Shut up about the economy, it's perfectly fine and bouncy.....

[DisgruntledVirus]

According to Steve Balmer

Our economy is "bouncy"?

I would say our economy lost it's "bouncy" aspect a few months back. Our economy is more like the huge snowpack on the side of the Rocky Mountains just waiting for the shell to land starting the avalanche.

 

[blackangst1]

Yes, it is.

 

[SP33Demon]

It's not as bad as the news is hyping (especially as bad as Bush and co are proclaiming) and Balmer is right. Why do you think it took so long for McCain/Obama to reluctantly support the bailout? Yes, some banks/hedges got shut down and we will probably be in a recession but it will "bounce" back once the dust settles.

One of my posts from the other thread:

"Proof that 6 of the major 10 banks are still doing ok (and keep in mind that Wachovia was the ONLY one in the top 10 that went under):

JP/Morgan Chase 2 year chart - business as usual

Citi 2 year - close to alltime low but bouncing back with Wachovia buyout

Bank of America 2 year - already bounced back.

Wells Fargo 2 year - AT AN ALL TIME HIGH

Suntrust 2 year - Business as usual.

HSBC 2 year - bouncing back.

Keep spreading your doom and gloom, but some of us know that some banks actually didn't fall for the subprime BS and are still F-I-N-E. Yeah, we won't have as many lenders to choose from, but hey, the fat has been cut and you have to actually have a credit rating to get something now. Imagine that?"

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Yes, it is.

There you are! You've been on this slant for months. I don't know how much bad news it will take before you realize something is terribly dire in the economy. You see a 9% drop in the DOW in a day and say it's not as bad as we've had before, as if it was not big deal at all. Lending is way down with banks, they are running low on the ability to extend credit and you agree with it being "bouncy"?

In regard to Ballmer, I've no clue how he's immune to what most other companies are feeling in the US right now.

Why do you think it took so long for McCain/Obama to reluctantly support the bailout?

They were trying to figure out which would make them look better to voters.

Yep, nothing to see here at all.

 

[yllus]

Mr. Ballmer is no slouch when it comes to pretending all is well. The Kingdom of Microsoft isn't exactly doing that well lately. In fact, from all recent reports I've read and heard, the monster machine that is MS has been all but consumed by its own bureaucracy.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It sounds like he's describing a set of boobs.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

 

[Thump553]

Last week Washington Mutual failed, the biggest bank failure in US history.

Today Wachovia essentially failed-forced into a forced marriage by the FDIC, with the FDIC picking up all the portfolio losses over $42M.

Today several banks in Europe either failed or had to be propped up by their respective governments.

Today the fed and other central banks poured $620B into the markets in an effort to ease up liquidity problems, an effort that was only partially successful.

US stock markets remain extremely skitish, and down big again today so far (Dow Jones down 280 as of this posting).

All sorts of news articles about how solid, profitable companies like McDonalds franchises, are getting their lines of credit cut off, putting in danger their ability to meet ordinary day to day expenses, like payroll.

I respect Ballmer's accomplishments but think the evidence is still extremely strong that we are dancing along a cliff's edge.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
It's not as bad as the news is hyping (especially as bad as Bush and co are proclaiming) and Balmer is right. Why do you think it took so long for McCain/Obama to reluctantly support the bailout? Yes, some banks/hedges got shut down and we will probably be in a recession but it will "bounce" back once the dust settles.

One of my posts from the other thread:

"Proof that 6 of the major 10 banks are still doing ok (and keep in mind that Wachovia was the ONLY one in the top 10 that went under):

JP/Morgan Chase 2 year chart - business as usual

Citi 2 year - close to alltime low but bouncing back with Wachovia buyout

Bank of America 2 year - already bounced back.

Wells Fargo 2 year - AT AN ALL TIME HIGH

Suntrust 2 year - Business as usual.

HSBC 2 year - bouncing back.

Keep spreading your doom and gloom, but some of us know that some banks actually didn't fall for the subprime BS and are still F-I-N-E. Yeah, we won't have as many lenders to choose from, but hey, the fat has been cut and you have to actually have a credit rating to get something now. Imagine that?"

I know that a lot of banks are fine, and are not at risk of failing. I just said in the OP that if the right "shell" lands on our economy it is just going to start an avalanche effect and bring the whole thing crashing down. Will it be as bad as the Great Depression? Who knows. I don't think we will have that happen, but I do believe we have to be very careful as to how we handle this. One or two wrong moves could easily crash the market IMHO.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
There you are! You've been on this slant for months. I don't know how much bad news it will take before you realize something is terribly dire in the economy. You see a 9% drop in the DOW in a day and say it's not as bad as we've had before, as if it was not big deal at all. Lending is way down with banks, they are running low on the ability to extend credit and you agree with it being "bouncy"?

I never said it was rosy, it isnt the end of the fucking world though. Its a cycle caused by shitty things but we certainly arent in any trouble. Why would all the major investors heep buying American companies of things were soooo bad? Get a grip man.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

Im squarely middle class and doing better than I ever have. In fact, I find it easier to live 30% below my income than I did in 2000. My friends arent doing that bad either.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little? WTF is wrong with you? Get back to me when unemployment is 20% will ya? And see my post above. Frankly Im waiting for DOW to hit 8-9000 so I can grab up some fortune 50 sticks at a discount. Youre a fool if you think your precious stocks and 401k isnt going to bring a nice return in 20 years. You dont lose money till you withdraw. BUY NOW.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Thump553
Last week Washington Mutual failed, the biggest bank failure in US history.

Today Wachovia essentially failed-forced into a forced marriage by the FDIC, with the FDIC picking up all the portfolio losses over $42M.

Today several banks in Europe either failed or had to be propped up by their respective governments.

Today the fed and other central banks poured $620B into the markets in an effort to ease up liquidity problems, an effort that was only partially successful.

US stock markets remain extremely skitish, and down big again today so far (Dow Jones down 280 as of this posting).

All sorts of news articles about how solid, profitable companies like McDonalds franchises, are getting their lines of credit cut off, putting in danger their ability to meet ordinary day to day expenses, like payroll.

I respect Ballmer's accomplishments but think the evidence is still extremely strong that we are dancing along a cliff's edge.

Washington Mutual, Wachovia, and several European banks engaged in risky loan practices and are now paying the price for it. Why are you making excuses for them? Yes, we know how big they were. Yes, they are now paying the price, as they should.

Overall, you make it sound like the majority of our banks are closing which is simply not the case. What percent of total assets among the big 10-20 banks do WAMU and Wachovia represent? What percent of the major banks engaged in risky loans and what percent didn't? The answer is obvious who did and who did NOT drink the Kool Aid.

These companies do not deserve help, let the market cut the fat from the bone. The only reason why this bailout crap is so popular is because nobody has the balls to take the fall for it. Congress: "We did what we could, so vote for us again." POTUS: "I warned you, the sky is falling." So the real question remains: How many bailouts until this deck of cards collapses again? Or How many bailouts until someone, besides a few sane House Reps, has the balls to say enough is enough and do what's best for their country (and not their career)?

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

Im squarely middle class and doing better than I ever have. In fact, I find it easier to live 30% below my income than I did in 2000. My friends arent doing that bad either.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little? WTF is wrong with you? Get back to me when unemployment is 20% will ya? And see my post above. Frankly Im waiting for DOW to hit 8-9000 so I can grab up some fortune 50 sticks at a discount. Youre a fool if you think your precious stocks and 401k isnt going to bring a nice return in 20 years. You dont lose money till you withdraw. BUY NOW.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

That's only good if it's not going to drop anymore. Never try to catch a falling knife.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Thump553
Last week Washington Mutual failed, the biggest bank failure in US history.

Today Wachovia essentially failed-forced into a forced marriage by the FDIC, with the FDIC picking up all the portfolio losses over $42M.

Today several banks in Europe either failed or had to be propped up by their respective governments.

Today the fed and other central banks poured $620B into the markets in an effort to ease up liquidity problems, an effort that was only partially successful.

US stock markets remain extremely skitish, and down big again today so far (Dow Jones down 280 as of this posting).

All sorts of news articles about how solid, profitable companies like McDonalds franchises, are getting their lines of credit cut off, putting in danger their ability to meet ordinary day to day expenses, like payroll.

I respect Ballmer's accomplishments but think the evidence is still extremely strong that we are dancing along a cliff's edge.

Washington Mutual, Wachovia, and several European banks engaged in risky loan practices and are now paying the price for it. Why are you making excuses for them? Yes, we know how big they were. Yes, they are now paying the price, as they should.

Overall, you make it sound like the majority of our banks are closing which is simply not the case. What percent of total assets among the big 10-20 banks do WAMU and Wachovia represent? What percent of the major banks engaged in risky loans and what percent didn't? The answer is obvious who did and who did NOT drink the Kool Aid.

These companies do not deserve help, let the market cut the fat from the bone. The only reason why this bailout crap is so popular is because nobody has the balls to take the fall for it. Congress: "We did what we could, so vote for us again." POTUS: "I warned you, the sky is falling." So the real question remains: How many bailouts until this deck of cards collapses again? Or How many bailouts until someone, besides a few sane House Reps, has the balls to say enough is enough and do what's best for their country (and not their career)?

I bet they said the same thing in 1929.

Yes, actually, they did.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

Im squarely middle class and doing better than I ever have. In fact, I find it easier to live 30% below my income than I did in 2000. My friends arent doing that bad either.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little? WTF is wrong with you? Get back to me when unemployment is 20% will ya? And see my post above. Frankly Im waiting for DOW to hit 8-9000 so I can grab up some fortune 50 sticks at a discount. Youre a fool if you think your precious stocks and 401k isnt going to bring a nice return in 20 years. You dont lose money till you withdraw. BUY NOW.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

That's only good if it's not going to drop anymore. Never try to catch a falling knife.

Im hoping it hits 8-9k personally. I love sales on stocks You of all people should know better.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

Im squarely middle class and doing better than I ever have. In fact, I find it easier to live 30% below my income than I did in 2000. My friends arent doing that bad either.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little? WTF is wrong with you? Get back to me when unemployment is 20% will ya? And see my post above. Frankly Im waiting for DOW to hit 8-9000 so I can grab up some fortune 50 sticks at a discount. Youre a fool if you think your precious stocks and 401k isnt going to bring a nice return in 20 years. You dont lose money till you withdraw. BUY NOW.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

That's only good if it's not going to drop anymore. Never try to catch a falling knife.

Hey LK, quick question:
Why is Wells Fargo at close to a 52 week high? OMG, the sky is falling! Wait, Wells Fargo (124 bill market cap) isn't a top 5 bank, right? Their stock is going to absolutely crash soon, right?

More doom and gloomers with biased views in the financial sector. I'd be pissed too if I wasn't getting that fat xmas bonus this year.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

Im squarely middle class and doing better than I ever have. In fact, I find it easier to live 30% below my income than I did in 2000. My friends arent doing that bad either.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little? WTF is wrong with you? Get back to me when unemployment is 20% will ya? And see my post above. Frankly Im waiting for DOW to hit 8-9000 so I can grab up some fortune 50 sticks at a discount. Youre a fool if you think your precious stocks and 401k isnt going to bring a nice return in 20 years. You dont lose money till you withdraw. BUY NOW.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

That's only good if it's not going to drop anymore. Never try to catch a falling knife.

Im hoping it hits 8-9k personally. I love sales on stocks You of all people should know better.

Cheap assets are one thing, but the collapse of the economy is another.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Yes, it is.

As long as you happen to be as rich as Steve Balmer. :roll:

Im squarely middle class and doing better than I ever have. In fact, I find it easier to live 30% below my income than I did in 2000. My friends arent doing that bad either.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little? WTF is wrong with you? Get back to me when unemployment is 20% will ya? And see my post above. Frankly Im waiting for DOW to hit 8-9000 so I can grab up some fortune 50 sticks at a discount. Youre a fool if you think your precious stocks and 401k isnt going to bring a nice return in 20 years. You dont lose money till you withdraw. BUY NOW.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

That's only good if it's not going to drop anymore. Never try to catch a falling knife.

Hey LK, quick question:
Why is Wells Fargo at close to a 52 week high? OMG, the sky is falling! Wait, Wells Fargo (124 bill market cap) isn't a top 5 bank, right? Their stock is going to absolutely crash soon, right?

More doom and gloomers with biased views in the financial sector. I'd be pissed too if I wasn't getting that fat xmas bonus this year.

Wow, you pick one stock. Great.

I never got a big fat bonus, nice try though. Besides, mine is March 1st, not Christmas.

Not biased, just know a fuckload more than you do.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Skoorb
There you are! You've been on this slant for months. I don't know how much bad news it will take before you realize something is terribly dire in the economy. You see a 9% drop in the DOW in a day and say it's not as bad as we've had before, as if it was not big deal at all. Lending is way down with banks, they are running low on the ability to extend credit and you agree with it being "bouncy"?

I never said it was rosy, it isnt the end of the fucking world though. Its a cycle caused by shitty things but we certainly arent in any trouble. Why would all the major investors heep buying American companies of things were soooo bad? Get a grip man.

What is your definition of "trouble"? Of course it's a cycle. It's also a cycle to get a pap smear or colonoscopy, it doesn't mean it's fun.

Why is the DOW even an issue? Have you morons ever heard of buy low sell high? So when the market actually DROPS you chicken little?

Oh not this again. When I first saw you touting that, the market was much higher than it is now, so I suppose if we'd listened we'd now be in the red.

BUY NOW.

Why would we buy now? You just said you're waiting until 8-9000. If we buy now and it drops to 9000 that's pretty damn silly and negates the advice you gave above to buy low sell high.

Get a grip on reality not this false bullshit sky is falling crap.

That is sound advice. Next time a company cannot get a loan, they should just be told that.

Nobody said it's the end of the world.

Washington Mutual, Wachovia, and several European banks engaged in risky loan practices and are now paying the price for it. Why are you making excuses for them?

He made no excuses. He was relating data.

So the real question remains: How many bailouts until this deck of cards collapses again? Or How many bailouts until someone, besides a few sane House Reps, has the balls to say enough is enough and do what's best for their country (and not their career)?

Good question, nobody knows. I think we're not done bailing out yet, though Money is free, or almost free; ink is pretty cheap and those printing presses are well-oiled.

Im hoping it hits 8-9k personally. I love sales on stocks You of all people should know better.

Can I get in on your fund? With your prophetic skills you must be making returns way better than the indexes!

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
What is your definition of "trouble"? Of course it's a cycle. It's also a cycle to get a pap smear or colonoscopy, it doesn't mean it's fun.

Never said it was fun or easy. Its nice for me because my employment is not at risk, and the extra ($xxxx) I buy now will be worth much much more in 15 years when I retire. thats all I care about.

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Oh not this again. When I first saw you touting that, the market was much higher than it is now, so I suppose if we'd listened we'd now be in the red Why would we buy now? You just said you're waiting until 8-9000. If we buy now and it drops to 9000 that's pretty damn silly and negates the advice you gave above to buy low sell high.

Hey genious...if youre a day trader good fucking luck. If you buy for the future how can you say in the red? ONLY IF YOU SELL. What is so hard to comprehend?

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Can I get in on your fund? With your prophetic skills you must be making returns way better than the indexes!

Total Im up 12% for the year. But 60% is overseas. 5 year Im up 60% or so. Ive laid out my complete portfolio several times. Look it up yourself. Not everything is dumping.

edit: If youre serious, which you arent youre just picking a fight, here's 5 beating indexes:

1. The iShares Biotechnology Fund (AMEX: IBB).

2. The Merrill Lynch Broadband HOLDRs (AMEX: BDH).

3. The iShares Dow Jones Transportation Fund (NYSEArca: IYT).

4. Market Vectors Environmental Services (AMEX: EVX).

5. HealthShares Cardio Devices (NYSEArca: HHE).

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Wow, you pick one stock. Great.

I never got a big fat bonus, nice try though. Besides, mine is March 1st, not Christmas.

Not biased, just know a fuckload more than you do.

For all of your knowledge about how bad the sector is, I was hoping for a better explanation of why Wells is enjoying incredible success amid this "recession" or "depression" or "crisis". Did they, or didn't they drink the Kool Aid? Just answer the question since you "know a fuckload more" than I.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Wow, you pick one stock. Great.

I never got a big fat bonus, nice try though. Besides, mine is March 1st, not Christmas.

Not biased, just know a fuckload more than you do.

For all of your knowledge about how bad the sector is, I was hoping for a better explanation of why Wells is enjoying incredible success amid this "recession" or "depression" or "crisis". Did they, or didn't they drink the Kool Aid? Just answer the question since you "know a fuckload more" than I.

Not to mention big blue he works for :roll:

 

[heyheybooboo]

Topic: Shut up about the economy, it's perfectly fine and bouncy.....

Tell that to the 9%+ of the Michigan workforce that's unemployed.

 

[NeoV]

wells fargo engaged in plenty of risky mortgages, they also sold them very quickly, eliminating much of their risk that way

 

[StageLeft]

Hey genious...if youre a day trader good fucking luck. If you buy for the future how can you say in the red? ONLY IF YOU SELL. What is so hard to comprehend?

What? Whether you sell or don't, if you buy at 10k and it falls to 9k you bought at the wrong time. I don't need to expound on that.

edit: If youre serious, which you arent youre just picking a fight, here's 5 beating indexes:

Actually, I am, I'm down in my 401k about the same as the market, so it oculd hardly be any fvcking worse. Unfortunately, my available funds are pretty darn limited with my plan.