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should you always let your battery drain all the way?
- Thread starter kcthomas
- Start date
genghislegacy
Member
Many of the manuals do not say anything about how to prolong battery life. Usually just be careful on first time use, drain them all the way. you cant spend all the time to keep remember to drain batteries...
TitanDiddly
Guest
If it's a newer laptop and has a Lithium chemistry battery, it's actually good to keep it around 40%. Lithium batteries are happiest at that level. So anytime your store it, 40% is best. But for general usage, it doesn't make much of an impact.
TitanDiddly
Guest
I don't have a link, but there was a (University, IIRC) page of a study that showed Lithium-chemistry batteries performed better and lasted longer when stored at 40%. Cold temperatures are better, too.
alteredNate
Member
This is certianly an age-old question that I have NEVER seen any REAL study data on. People say all sorts of different things, that they heard or read somewhere, and we never really know what's true.
I'm not at all trying to discredit anyone, I'm just saying that it's frustrating to have so many different answers to such a seemingly simple question.
For my cell phone, for instance, which I bought from a friend who works for a cell cervice provider, he told me that it doesn't matter if I drain it flat before charging - the MOST important thing is to remove the charger right after it's done charging (i.e. never leave it plugged in overnight). He said all cellphone manufacturers say that doing this will kill the life of your battery. That's the first time I've ever heard anything of that sort, and I have a really hard time believing it!
Just after I talk to another friend that works in the cell phone industry, and he told me this: "studies say" that batteries are rated for a number of charges they will take, and they are rated at more charges if they are NOT drained all the way. You'll say: "duh" but what he meant is that if they could take 1000 charges at empty, they would take more than 2000 charges at half full. This makes about as much sense to me as the first thing...
So go figure!
I have to say that I have a dell inspiron that is nearing 3 years old, and the batteries still function quite well, even though I rarely drain them all the way (it does happen from time to time). I feel pretty lucky because I know peope who's laptop batteries have died after a year.
So I'm open to any links with research studies!
I'm not at all trying to discredit anyone, I'm just saying that it's frustrating to have so many different answers to such a seemingly simple question.
For my cell phone, for instance, which I bought from a friend who works for a cell cervice provider, he told me that it doesn't matter if I drain it flat before charging - the MOST important thing is to remove the charger right after it's done charging (i.e. never leave it plugged in overnight). He said all cellphone manufacturers say that doing this will kill the life of your battery. That's the first time I've ever heard anything of that sort, and I have a really hard time believing it!
Just after I talk to another friend that works in the cell phone industry, and he told me this: "studies say" that batteries are rated for a number of charges they will take, and they are rated at more charges if they are NOT drained all the way. You'll say: "duh" but what he meant is that if they could take 1000 charges at empty, they would take more than 2000 charges at half full. This makes about as much sense to me as the first thing...
So go figure!
I have to say that I have a dell inspiron that is nearing 3 years old, and the batteries still function quite well, even though I rarely drain them all the way (it does happen from time to time). I feel pretty lucky because I know peope who's laptop batteries have died after a year.
So I'm open to any links with research studies!
Not true. No current consumer batteries perform as good cold, as when they are kept warmer. As far as the charge level, that's possible to a small extent.
alteredNate: It really depends on what type of batteries you are referring to. This was a notorious problem with Ni-Cd batteries.
TitanDiddly
Guest
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-21.htm
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-19.htm
Not actually a university, but that's what I was thinking of with the lithium page. It says to store at cool temperatures.
Not to nitpick, but it says for "storage" to keep in a "cool" place. I wouldn't dispute that. Any battery will age faster if it is stored in a warmer place.
For operation though, all batteries perform better when warmer.
If you'd like to test this, take your cell phone (most today use Li-ion) and put it in the freezer for a couple hours, and watch the charge level drop off like a rock.
When it warms up again, the charge level will come back up. 🙂
Edit: I read your second link... I am unfamiliar (first hand) with the effects of a "hot" battery.
For operation though, all batteries perform better when warmer.
If you'd like to test this, take your cell phone (most today use Li-ion) and put it in the freezer for a couple hours, and watch the charge level drop off like a rock.
When it warms up again, the charge level will come back up. 🙂
Edit: I read your second link... I am unfamiliar (first hand) with the effects of a "hot" battery.
JimPhelpsMI
Golden Member
Hi, NiCad batteries are said to have a memory. It's a multicell battery that has the memory. Running them down occasionally will equalize the charge in each cell and allow all cells to charge to max. Everyready data manual used to say not to run them down lower than 1.1 volts per cell. Don't know what the latest says. Jim
Generally industrial batteries (where detailed specs are available) are specified to last much longer if they are only partially discharged, rather than discharged completely. E.g. a NiMH battery may last 1000 cycles at 70% discharge, but 300,000 cycles at 5% discharge (that's how Toyota can guarantee the Prius NiMH battery for so long, it's discharged only a tiny amount before it's topped up). I would expect the same to be true of domestic batteries.
Overcharging is also the quickest way to kill batteries - it's also much of the reason why NiCd and NiMH batteries appear to get a 'memory'. Initially the voltage of the battery is temporarily reduced (and can be recovered by a deep discharge) but eventually the damage becomes permanent and the battery becomes useless. With Li-ion most chargers are highly sophisticated and generally will not overcharge the battery, but the same is not true of NiCD and NiMH which are often continuously 'trickle' charged as long as a charger is connected.
Li-ion batteries also tend to have a limited 'shelf life', whether they are used or not. This is about 2-3 years. This can be prolonged if they are kept cool and dry, and is significantly shortened if they are allowed to overheat (e.g. left in the sun, or in a hot car).
Overcharging is also the quickest way to kill batteries - it's also much of the reason why NiCd and NiMH batteries appear to get a 'memory'. Initially the voltage of the battery is temporarily reduced (and can be recovered by a deep discharge) but eventually the damage becomes permanent and the battery becomes useless. With Li-ion most chargers are highly sophisticated and generally will not overcharge the battery, but the same is not true of NiCD and NiMH which are often continuously 'trickle' charged as long as a charger is connected.
Li-ion batteries also tend to have a limited 'shelf life', whether they are used or not. This is about 2-3 years. This can be prolonged if they are kept cool and dry, and is significantly shortened if they are allowed to overheat (e.g. left in the sun, or in a hot car).
zephyrprime
Diamond Member
You're talking at cross purposes. The batteries store better at cold temperature but put out more power at warm temperatures.
Apparently they do as the manufactuer for my Powermax 1800's says to discharge them fully time to time before recharging because of the memory affect.
I don't mind because with the fast charger, they're ready in 3hrs after a full drain. They really do last a long time, perfect for digital cameras (like the Sony Cybershot). Just don't like that they don't hold their charge like alkalines. 🙁
alteredNate
Member
This is what I have always assumed and I have left my numorous phones plugged in overnight with no problems. Been doin it for years and don't intend to stop.
if you leave your phone in all nite, and it is still fine - are you doing this everynite?
cos if you are, you only know it is fine for 18hours or whatever.
Look at it this way - if your phone is on whilst it is being charged up:
phone charges to 100% after 90minutes [or whatever].
if there is circuitry in the phone to prevent overcharging, then, phone uses up its own power down to 99%, charger cuts in. Stops at 100%. phone uses its own power till 99%. etc etc. lots of small cycles - don't think that can be too good for it
if there is no circuitry in the phont to prevent overcharging, then after 100%, the phone is constantly on charge. How hot is the phone battery in the morning, or the power pack?
cos if you are, you only know it is fine for 18hours or whatever.
Look at it this way - if your phone is on whilst it is being charged up:
phone charges to 100% after 90minutes [or whatever].
if there is circuitry in the phone to prevent overcharging, then, phone uses up its own power down to 99%, charger cuts in. Stops at 100%. phone uses its own power till 99%. etc etc. lots of small cycles - don't think that can be too good for it
if there is no circuitry in the phont to prevent overcharging, then after 100%, the phone is constantly on charge. How hot is the phone battery in the morning, or the power pack?
Arcanedeath
Platinum Member
It totaly depends on the type of battery as has been stated before, NiCad's have the most recharge cycles (by a large magnidute) NiMetal has the least and Lith-Ion is in the middle but pretty similar to NiMetal when you leave a Lith-Ion Battery on over night in a charger it's bad for the battery because each time it drops below a full charge the charger kicks in and recharges the battery using a recharge cycle even if it's only charging 1 % of the battery and this can severly shorten the life of Lith-Ion batteries, w/ Lith-Ion, it's best to use the battery until it's almost dead then recharge it to full and repeat this ad-infinium. If you can't do this make sure to take your battery off the charger as soon as it's done charging.
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