Should I Upgrade My Graphic Card?

[taltamir]

Originally posted by: NickelPlate

Originally posted by: taltamir
the nwn2 issues result from serious bugs in the engine, such as the now fixed infinate loop bug and many others. The game is patched and patched and patched and now it is finally PLAYABLE but still very buggy. (with occasional crashing rather then constant crashing, and many repeatable bugs in the campaign and engine)

There is a known engine bug that causes those extremely low FPS on the 8800 series and it has nothing to do with computational power. They have yet to provide a fix for it (or many of the other problems, yet they did go ahead and release an expansion, so it is clear where their priorities lie)

That's a shame too because I've read they're both really good games. But I refuse to buy either of them because of the performance/technical issues of which the said game forums are littered with complaints. Maybe in 2 or 3 years, high end PCs will be able to run them at or above 60fps sustained. Until then, no sale.

NP

well nwn2 is finally PLAYABLE.. but it is still incomplete... they recently got the updater working... so you can actually patch the game now (that was their biggest problem)...
If you go to the forums they have an official guide (posted by a member of the development team) on how to get the game working:
1. Remove everything
2. Fresh install the original game
3. Fresh install mask of the betrayer expansion.
4. Run the autopatched to go from 1.10.115 to 1.10.116 to circumvent a bug in the installation of mask of the betrayer that prevent it from properly upgrading the version (it is actually version 1.7 mislabeled as 1.10 with some files from even older versions...)...don't let it install with anything else or the process will fail. Don't install any patches out of order or the process will fail...
Also if you don't have the expansion the latest version is 1.10.115... which is identical to 1.10.116 except that the 116 is for fixing the broken expansion installation... but online servers have a hardcoded SINGLE version compatibility rule where the server can only allow 1.10.115 or 116 version players to play... not both at once (despite the versions being the same)... potentionally if the next patch works it might allow players with and without the expansion to play together again...

if you do all of that then you can actually play the game now... it only took them 11 months after releasing the game to get it to (sorta) work.... It has no been over a year since it was released though and it is still not "ironed out"... only playable.
For example 10 monthes ago IGN listed an example bug... where upgrading your golem in the game gives it bonuses different the ones listed, and letting your compatriots do it for you doesn't work at all... That has still not been fixed a year after the games release despite being published as an example bug by the gaming media so long ago....

 

[alcoholbob]

At least NWN2 doesn't have an advanced physics engine, otherwise performance would be ridiculously unplayable. Like in Oblivion--with max settings you could probably pull off about 30-35fps with a top end system in the most demanding outdoor areas of the game. But as soon as a major combat starts you can pretty much say goodbye to the framerate.

 

[NickelPlate]

Originally posted by: s44
RPGs aren't meant to be run at min 60fps.

Not trying to start an argument here but says who? Unless it has one of those silly framerate caps. I've played many RPGs over the years at high fps like that. I'll agree that a high framerate is *usually* not as important in RPGs as opposed to shooters (in terms of life and death), but it still makes things alot more enjoyable. To be blunt, I think games like NWN2 and the like are just great games with lousy, inefficient engines. It's one thing to have a brilliant game engine ahead of it's time, quite another when ultra high-end PCs one year or more after a title's release still can't run them very well, and then the game's visuals really aren't anything groundbreaking either. Sure it looks good, but it's no Oblivion, FEAR or HL2. Just my $.02.

NP

 

[taltamir]

hi, I picked up my copy of NWN1 AND temple of elemental evil when they were already dated and had a BLAST playing them on max everything at 60FPS (capped to my monitor's refresh rate)... I think ALL games are meant to look as beutiful as they can...

Ironically I am now playing NWN2 on absolute lowest settings (on 1920x1200 res) not because of lag (I have no problems on medium high settings). But because the LOAD TIMES for all the areas... you have to move between areas every couple of minutes and the load times are horrible... it takes several times longer to load an area if you have higher graphics settings because the game has to decompress the textures and other data every time you enter a zone... it just throws all those things away and reloads everything into memory, atrocious really since it should have kept it in mem until no longer needed... the game takes 600MB at high settings for me and leaves 2.5GB of free ram. Every time I load a zone it just drops all the data and cpu goes out the roof as it starts decompressing the data for that zone... BAH!

 

[mode101wpb]

I'm in the same boat as well, 2 year old system but with a 4000+ San Diego, only upgrade was the GPU since 2005 have a x1959Pro now. Newegg only has ten Socket 939 processors listed, I read the Opteron is a great overclocker, but the 185 Denmark 2.6 GHz is over $200, the remaining X2 are sub $100 along with the single cores.

I had no serious problems with Crysis on my current set-up on medium settings and no AA, but I'm missing out on all the eye candy and think unless you spend major $$ on a new mobo, processor, ram, gpu and etc you won't see it.

I would wait till some benchmarks are done.

 

[Demoth]

Originally posted by: mode101wpb
I'm in the same boat as well, 2 year old system but with a 4000+ San Diego, only upgrade was the GPU since 2005 have a x1959Pro now. Newegg only has ten Socket 939 processors listed, I read the Opteron is a great overclocker, but the 185 Denmark 2.6 GHz is over $200, the remaining X2 are sub $100 along with the single cores.

I had no serious problems with Crysis on my current set-up on medium settings and no AA, but I'm missing out on all the eye candy and think unless you spend major $$ on a new mobo, processor, ram, gpu and etc you won't see it.

I would wait till some benchmarks are done.

You got unlucky with AMDs sudden ending of the 939 platform. There is no reason anyone should be spending close to $200 to upgrade a 939 CPU. The good news is, you can get a top performing intel setup for under $200 that you know now will be compatible with the next gen of CPUs.


Qty. Product Description Savings Total Price

A-DATA Extreme Edition 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) $15.00 Mail-in Rebate $62.99

BIOSTAR P35D2-A7 LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
$20.00 Mail-in Rebate $82.99

Intel Dual-Core E2140 Allendale 1.6GHz LGA 775 Processor Model BX80557E2140 - Retail $74.99

Subtotal: $220.97 - 35= $185.97

This would OC easy to 2.8 on stock cooling and be on par with anything around at high settings as just about all your games will be GPU limited far before faster CPUs with more cache come into play.

 

[Lunyone]

Originally posted by: Demoth

Originally posted by: mode101wpb
I'm in the same boat as well, 2 year old system but with a 4000+ San Diego, only upgrade was the GPU since 2005 have a x1959Pro now. Newegg only has ten Socket 939 processors listed, I read the Opteron is a great overclocker, but the 185 Denmark 2.6 GHz is over $200, the remaining X2 are sub $100 along with the single cores.

I had no serious problems with Crysis on my current set-up on medium settings and no AA, but I'm missing out on all the eye candy and think unless you spend major $$ on a new mobo, processor, ram, gpu and etc you won't see it.

I would wait till some benchmarks are done.

You got unlucky with AMDs sudden ending of the 939 platform. There is no reason anyone should be spending close to $200 to upgrade a 939 CPU. The good news is, you can get a top performing intel setup for under $200 that you know now will be compatible with the next gen of CPUs.


Qty. Product Description Savings Total Price

A-DATA Extreme Edition 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) $15.00 Mail-in Rebate $62.99

BIOSTAR P35D2-A7 LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
$20.00 Mail-in Rebate $82.99

Intel Dual-Core E2140 Allendale 1.6GHz LGA 775 Processor Model BX80557E2140 - Retail $74.99

Subtotal: $220.97 - 35= $185.97

This would OC easy to 2.8 on stock cooling and be on par with anything around at high settings as just about all your games will be GPU limited far before faster CPUs with more cache come into play.

Good idea there. Only problem is if you don't have $200 to spend. He could just spend $65 or so on a x2 and be set until his overhaul is ready to buy. Yes that would be spending $65 on a dead socket, but that way he could take advantage of the extra CPU and not have to replace all of the other parts.

 

[mode101wpb]

Originally posted by: Lunyone

Originally posted by: Demoth

Originally posted by: mode101wpb
I'm in the same boat as well, 2 year old system but with a 4000+ San Diego, only upgrade was the GPU since 2005 have a x1959Pro now. Newegg only has ten Socket 939 processors listed, I read the Opteron is a great overclocker, but the 185 Denmark 2.6 GHz is over $200, the remaining X2 are sub $100 along with the single cores.

I had no serious problems with Crysis on my current set-up on medium settings and no AA, but I'm missing out on all the eye candy and think unless you spend major $$ on a new mobo, processor, ram, gpu and etc you won't see it.

I would wait till some benchmarks are done.

You got unlucky with AMDs sudden ending of the 939 platform. There is no reason anyone should be spending close to $200 to upgrade a 939 CPU. The good news is, you can get a top performing intel setup for under $200 that you know now will be compatible with the next gen of CPUs.


Qty. Product Description Savings Total Price

A-DATA Extreme Edition 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) $15.00 Mail-in Rebate $62.99

BIOSTAR P35D2-A7 LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
$20.00 Mail-in Rebate $82.99

Intel Dual-Core E2140 Allendale 1.6GHz LGA 775 Processor Model BX80557E2140 - Retail $74.99

Subtotal: $220.97 - 35= $185.97

This would OC easy to 2.8 on stock cooling and be on par with anything around at high settings as just about all your games will be GPU limited far before faster CPUs with more cache come into play.

Good idea there. Only problem is if you don't have $200 to spend. He could just spend $65 or so on a x2 and be set until his overhaul is ready to buy. Yes that would be spending $65 on a dead socket, but that way he could take advantage of the extra CPU and not have to replace all of the other parts.

That's what I was thinking, though that Intel set-up is a fair price. If your going to spend $$ on a new 8800GT, the X2 may help with the bottleneck for under $100 extra and keep everything else as is.

I'm still not sure if Crysis will take advantage of the Quad Core Opteron or if that alone will make much of a difference?

 

[Demoth]

Yeah, the dual core X2 does help in games like Oblivion and future multi core optimized games, but is far behind the current intels. You could get a cheap X2 now, but will be in the same situation again soon while being CPU limited now. CPU tends to be more important for these large RPGs though the GPU is still the main limiting factor.

Look at it this way...

Spend the $185 now, and your next upgrade (other then GPU) will be a $70 low end but highly overclockable quad or octa Penryn gen chip. The DDR2 RAM will not be very limiting compared to DDR3 and this cheap build can keep you going strong for literally years.

Considering how cheap a good P35 board is now and the fact it WILL be penryn compatible and a current $75 chip can easily OC to destroy even the highest end X2, putting any more into a 939 is kind of wasteful unless your dead broke.

 

[tygger401]

Hey guy i was wondering about the power supply myself,I to just bought a GT5628 and ordered a xfx 8800gt extreme..It works perfect i have had no probs what so ever been running it for 4 days now with absolutly no probs.yes the card is long you have just enough room to plug in the power with about a half inch to spare.i also ordered a PCI fan and that also helps.im using riva tuner for the heat prob with the 8800gt i have fan set to 45% and can now run crysis 1280x768 everything set to very high with not a glitch 54c idle 75c load.very very please with this computer i swore i would never buy a retail but for the price i couldnt beat it couldnt ever build it for 1,090 only thing is bought a 22" samsung 2232gw 2ms 3000:1 to go with it cant go wrong with this monitor.hope this helps ya i will prob upgrade power supply in future but right now not a prob at all good luck and get yourself a 8800gt there amazing.