Should drunk driving (even when it ends safely) have harsher penalties?

[DWW]

The thread about the crown victoria being going up in flames had me thinking.

What do you think about drunk driving penalties. Should there be larger repercussions?

According to the US Department of Transportation there were 42,116 fatal collisions in 2001, of which 41% involved alcohol (17,268).

I just think 17,268 is quite a large number and it shouldn't be seen as "acceptable loss".

Edit: fixed the numbers, it was a couple thousand off.

 

[Scouzer]

Wow that statistic is much worse than I would have imagined. (no sarcasm)

 

[jagec]

YES

YES

YES

Honestly, why would anyone say "no"?

 

[flot]

NO.

NO.

NO.

Jesus. Why does everyone jump on this particular bandwagon??

Here's a little tip for you: Go to any popular bar on a friday or saturday night. Watch how many people have 2 or more drinks and then drive away. All of those people are likely "under the influence" under the current definitions.

You would propse to ruin the lives of every person who went to a bar, had two drinks, and drove home? (last I checked, the punishments for DUI are pretty severe as it is)

 

[Zim Hosein]

Should there be larger repercussions?

Yes IMO

 

[DaveSimmons]

Originally posted by: flot
NO.

NO.

NO.

Jesus. Why does everyone jump on this particular bandwagon??

Here's a little tip for you: Go to any popular bar on a friday or saturday night. Watch how many people have 2 or more drinks and then drive away. All of those people are likely "under the influence" under the current definitions.

And this is good even if most of them don't maim or kill anyone?

 

[KarenMarie]

I think that drunk driving should come with very severe penalties. Accident or not.

I dont think, however, that the constant lowering of acceptable consumption levels is successful in dealing with the problem. It is a great revenue generator, yes, but two beers across the board doesnt deal with the drunk drivers that will do it no matter what the levels are.

Repeat offenders need stiffer penalties.

 

[Deadtrees]

Ahh...I had a list of drunk driving punishment in several countries.
I can't remember the names of countries, but do remember the punishment.

Here are some that I remember :

1. Cutting off one hand.

2. 1st time, no penalty. 2nd time, Death penalty.

3. Dropping the driver 30km away from home, make him walk all the way, then arrest him at home I'm not sure but I think it is Turkey.

4. Taking away one month of salary. I'm not sure but I think it is Finland.


I personally like the 3rd one.

 

[flot]

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons

Originally posted by: flot

Jesus. Why does everyone jump on this particular bandwagon??

Here's a little tip for you: Go to any popular bar on a friday or saturday night. Watch how many people have 2 or more drinks and then drive away. All of those people are likely "under the influence" under the current definitions.

And this is good even if most of them don't maim or kill anyone?

Of course it is. Because drinking and serving alcohol is legal in this country.

If you want to stop drinking and driving, then I suggest you go to the source, and tell every bar, restaurant, and club in the country that they are no longer allowed to serve more than 1 drink per hour to any patron.

I'd love to see how quickly a new special interest group pops up in D.C.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: flot
Here's a little tip for you: Go to any popular bar on a friday or saturday night. Watch how many people have 2 or more drinks and then drive away. All of those people are likely "under the influence" under the current definitions.

You would propse to ruin the lives of every person who went to a bar, had two drinks, and drove home? (last I checked, the punishments for DUI are pretty severe as it is)

would it be THAT hard for them to get a designated driver?

Would two drinks REALLY be enough to drive them past .08?

If two drinks were enough to drive them past .08, are they REALLY sober enough to operate a 3000 lb slab of metal at 80 MPH?

I don't think so.

 

[UsandThem]

Habitual drunk drivers (i.e. more than once) should be punished more harshly. A lot of people make a terrible decision and drive drunk. Penalties for a first time offense (at least in my state) are already pretty harsh.

So in summary:

First time (causing no deaths or major injuries to others) - Same laws as we have

Second time and on - Increase the penalties

 

[UsandThem]

Originally posted by: KarenMarie
I think that drunk driving should come with very severe penalties. Accident or not.

I dont think, however, that the constant lowering of acceptable consumption levels is successful in dealing with the problem. It is a great revenue generator, yes, but two beers across the board doesnt deal with the drunk drivers that will do it no matter what the levels are.

Repeat offenders need stiffer penalties.

When I was stationed in Germany, the legal limit there is .05 - that is like one German beer

 

[DWW]

Originally posted by: flot

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons

Originally posted by: flot

Jesus. Why does everyone jump on this particular bandwagon??

Here's a little tip for you: Go to any popular bar on a friday or saturday night. Watch how many people have 2 or more drinks and then drive away. All of those people are likely "under the influence" under the current definitions.

And this is good even if most of them don't maim or kill anyone?

Of course it is. Because drinking and serving alcohol is legal in this country.

If you want to stop drinking and driving, then I suggest you go to the source, and tell every bar, restaurant, and club in the country that they are no longer allowed to serve more than 1 drink per hour to any patron.

I'd love to see how quickly a new special interest group pops up in D.C.

That is an easy way out. Don't blame the bar. It is your own choice to drive drunk or to not make a plan ahead of time.

 

[flot]

I can only assume that no one with the police-state-type-replies has ever been to a bar at "happy hour."

With the current legal limit at .08 in half the states, I believe this falls right into "two drink" territory. In other words, have two drinks, pay your bill, start your car = you committed a crime.

In addition to this, I would like to buy some people a clue and inform you that, of the 200-500 people who leave a popular bar "illegally" on any given night, there are probably 10-30 of them who have had UPWARDS OF SIX DRINKS AND CAN NO LONGER CARRY ON AN INTELLIGENT CONVERSATION. At least half of these stumbling buffoons will walk right out into their car and drive home.

The people in group #2 are a serious threat to everyone's wellbeing. The people in group #1 are about as dangerous as your average soccer mom idiot talking on a cell phone while yelling at her kid in the back seat. Hell, I'm sure I'm much more dangerous when I'm driving with my dog in the car than I am after 3 drinks.

 

[jyates]

Originally posted by: KarenMarie
I think that drunk driving should come with very severe penalties. Accident or not.

I dont think, however, that the constant lowering of acceptable consumption levels is successful in dealing with the problem. It is a great revenue generator, yes, but two beers across the board doesnt deal with the drunk drivers that will do it no matter what the levels are.

Repeat offenders need stiffer penalties.

Ditto

 

[flot]

Originally posted by: DWW

That is an easy way out. Don't blame the bar. It is your own choice to drive drunk or to not make a plan ahead of time.

Bullsh!t. There are thousands upon thousands of bars in areas that are not often served by taxis, in cities where there is little to no public transportation, with HUGE WIDE OPEN parking lots.

Perhaps the bar owners didn't realize their patrons would be drinking? Perhaps the people giving out liquor licenses didn't notice the bar was right off the interstate? And oh, maybe the waitress didn't see you get out of your brand new yellow H2 that you parked in front of the door, and then got back into when you left?

*Everyone* involved knows that the majority of the patrons will be leaving that bar in a vehicle, with a BAC close to or above the recent "legal limits" in many states.

 

[DWW]

Originally posted by: flot

Originally posted by: DWW

That is an easy way out. Don't blame the bar. It is your own choice to drive drunk or to not make a plan ahead of time.

Bullsh!t. There are thousands upon thousands of bars in areas that are not often served by taxis, in cities where there is little to no public transportation, with HUGE WIDE OPEN parking lots.

Perhaps the bar owners didn't realize their patrons would be drinking? Perhaps the people giving out liquor licenses didn't notice the bar was right off the interstate? And oh, maybe the waitress didn't see you get out of your brand new yellow H2 that you parked in front of the door, and then got back into when you left?

It shouldnt' be up to the bar owners and workers for your own judgement. That is passing the blame. If you can't find a way home without driving yourself then how about just not drinking? It isn't that hard unless your an alcoholic.

 

[jagec]

http://www.ohioduiattorney.com/drinks.html

considering the source, this is probably pretty conservative.
So for your average-sized guy, it's the fourth drink that pushes you over the edge. I don't know about you, but after four drinks there is NO way I could drive home.

 

[flot]

Originally posted by: DWW
It shouldnt' be up to the bar owners and workers for your own judgement. That is passing the blame. If you can't find a way home without driving yourself then how about just not drinking? It isn't that hard unless your an alcoholic.

Oh really? So you can walk into your local gun store at 11:00 at night and buy a handgun?

You do know that there are actually drive-through liquor stores in some states?

 

[flot]

Originally posted by: jagec
http://www.ohioduiattorney.com/drinks.html

considering the source, this is probably pretty conservative.
So for your average-sized guy, it's the fourth drink that pushes you over the edge. I don't know about you, but after four drinks there is NO way I could drive home.

I know plenty of people who have driven home after anywhere from 5 to 10 drinks, over a period of 1-3 hours. I'm not saying that's smart, I'm not calling it a good idea, etc. I'm just trying to bring a little bit of real life to this conversation. People who go out and drink tend to go out and drink. Even most bartenders/waitresses will give you a hard time if you stop at 2. (happens to me all the time)

According to that table, having two 16 oz (2 pints) beers puts you right at the edge of legal.

 

[DWW]

Originally posted by: flot

Originally posted by: DWW
It shouldnt' be up to the bar owners and workers for your own judgement. That is passing the blame. If you can't find a way home without driving yourself then how about just not drinking? It isn't that hard unless your an alcoholic.

Oh really? So you can walk into your local gun store at 11:00 at night and buy a handgun?

You do know that there are actually drive-through liquor stores in some states?

So do you think they are suggesting you drink while driving just because they give you a convenience so you don't have to get out of your car?

 

[Xionide]

I had a friend die in a car fire as a result of driving under the influence (tho it wasnt the only reason the accident happened) and the guy that lived and was driving the
truck is my friend. I had another friend drive off a cliff and almost kill 3 people. These guys are my friends and I know they are stupid and they are both going through hell for it. But I still think the laws are too leniant.

-Xionide

 

Originally posted by: flot

Originally posted by: DWW
It shouldnt' be up to the bar owners and workers for your own judgement. That is passing the blame. If you can't find a way home without driving yourself then how about just not drinking? It isn't that hard unless your an alcoholic.

Oh really? So you can walk into your local gun store at 11:00 at night and buy a handgun?

You do know that there are actually drive-through liquor stores in some states?

What do guns and buying them at 11 at night have to do with personal responsiblity?

 

[stnicralisk]

Yes because the two people I know that have gotten drunk driving tickets have BOTH done it again. I think a lot of them are repeat offenders but I cant know for sure.

 

[stnicralisk]

Originally posted by: flot
NO.

NO.

NO.

Jesus. Why does everyone jump on this particular bandwagon??

Here's a little tip for you: Go to any popular bar on a friday or saturday night. Watch how many people have 2 or more drinks and then drive away. All of those people are likely "under the influence" under the current definitions.

You would propse to ruin the lives of every person who went to a bar, had two drinks, and drove home? (last I checked, the punishments for DUI are pretty severe as it is)

What about those people who go home and hit two military officers killing one and continue to drive home - parking their SUV in the garage and not admitting anything for days? Should their lives have been ruined?