Sharpton: Criticism of Rev. Wright 'grossly unfair'

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: beyoku

Originally posted by: RY62

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Sinsear
We can't have this in the White House.

I feel like I'm asking this question a lot, but remind me again which of these guys I'm voting for? I don't want Rev. Wright or Al Sharpton in the White House, so lucky for me, they aren't running!

You may think you're not voting for them but if Obama is elected you'll be seeing so much of them you'll think you voted for them.
I can see four years of extreme racial tension. Maybe it'll be a good thing in the sense that people will get it out in the open. Right now, most white people are afraid to discuss race for fear of being called a racist. Black people can be as racist as they want and get away with it. If we get it out in the open maybe we can get rid of the double standards.

DUDE what is with this black people can be as racist as they want garbage. 2 questions:

What have racist black people done to White people as a group in history and present?
What have racist white people done to black people as a group in history and present?
Just think about that for a while.

You using "as a group" renders your argument moot. There is no such thing as "group guilt" - if certain whites wronged blacks due to racism, that's immoral, but it's no less immoral to hold all whites responsible as a group. You certainly wouldn't send a black man to prison for murder just because other black men may have been guilty of that crime in the past, would you?

That is sort of an evasive response. It is obvious (at least to me) that the poster is referring to at the very least slavery but perhaps also including issues such as limited civil rights, or breaking barriers in the workplace, sports, entertainment, politics, etc etc. These are things that, generally speaking, "anglo america" did to "afro-america" especially with regards to the topic of slavery.

just my .02

as to the OP as a whole...I am pleasantly surprised that such a dialogue can exist in a P&N thread. You guys are doing exactly what Obama wants America to do...and that is address racism in all of its covert/overt ways that we see everyday. There is a wide chasm as to how people of different races view racism.

 

[beyoku]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: beyoku

Originally posted by: RY62

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Sinsear
We can't have this in the White House.

I feel like I'm asking this question a lot, but remind me again which of these guys I'm voting for? I don't want Rev. Wright or Al Sharpton in the White House, so lucky for me, they aren't running!

You may think you're not voting for them but if Obama is elected you'll be seeing so much of them you'll think you voted for them.
I can see four years of extreme racial tension. Maybe it'll be a good thing in the sense that people will get it out in the open. Right now, most white people are afraid to discuss race for fear of being called a racist. Black people can be as racist as they want and get away with it. If we get it out in the open maybe we can get rid of the double standards.

DUDE what is with this black people can be as racist as they want garbage. 2 questions:

What have racist black people done to White people as a group in history and present?
What have racist white people done to black people as a group in history and present?
Just think about that for a while.

You using "as a group" renders your argument moot. There is no such thing as "group guilt" - if certain whites wronged blacks due to racism, that's immoral, but it's no less immoral to hold all whites responsible as a group. You certainly wouldn't send a black man to prison for murder just because other black men may have been guilty of that crime in the past, would you?

That post was to Sinsear. He is the one that used the grouping when he said "Black People can be as racist as they want" I see people say this over and over again, as if Black People or certain groups within black people have some history of Racism against white people. - They dont, This simply is not true, they are just upset black folks, usually poor, or individuals that CONTROL the poor. White people or certain groups within white people HAVE practiced racism against Black people. The largest GROUP we happen to be talking about when it comes to such racism was the U.S. Government. The government as a group actually should be responsible and for the most part they have. - Civil rights act etc.

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: beyoku

Originally posted by: RY62

Originally posted by: beyoku
Why Am i missing something. Don Imus didn't say anything really racist. The church leader also didnt say anything "Bad" about white people. 'Rich white men control the U.S.' is not saying anything bad about white people. 'God Damn the U.S. for killing innocents......' is not saying anything particularly against White people. What BAD stuff did the preacher say about white people?

I think most people would consider all of these statements to reflect a hatered toward white people and the US in general. If you can't see the racism here there is something wrong with you.

"The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color."

?Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run! We [in the U.S.] Believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.?

"United States of White America, U.S. of KKKA ...."

"Black men turning on black men,,,that is fighting the wrong enemy. You both are the primary targets in an oppressive society that sees both of you as a dangerous threat."

"White America got their wake-up call after 9/11. White America and the Western world came to realize people of color had not gone away, faded in the woodwork, or just disappeared as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring black concerns."

"Black women are being raped daily in Africa. One white girl from Alabama gets drunk at a graduation trip to Aruba, goes off and gives it up while in a foreign country and that stays in the news for months.

Sen. Barack Obama's pastor says blacks should not sing "God Bless America" but "God damn America."

"God Damn America, That's in the Bible...for killing innocent people." " God Damn America for treating her citizens as less than human. "God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme.?

?Barack knows what it means living in a country and a culture that is controlled by rich white people. Hillary would never know that.?

?Hillary ain?t never been called a *****. Hillary has never had a people defined as a non-person.?

?Hillary is married to Bill, and Bill has been good to us. No he ain?t! Bill did us, just like he did Monica Lewinsky. He was riding dirty.?

"Jesus was a poor black man" "Jesus taught me how to hate my enemies ? The enemy he is referring to is white people!

"We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World people live in grinding poverty. .

Hmm, i guess i missed most of that, I keep seeing is that "damn America video over and over. Many of the things that you posted dont seem to say anything about white people at all but rather the U.S. And some are true. That fact that White people will equate America=White People only drives the fact home that America is founded and run white supremacy. Any one that knows anything about the concepts of white supremacy know this to be true. Example, he says "We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World..." That statement would include himself and everyone in the room that he was talking to. He was speaking about ALL AMERICANS. White people take offense to this and label that "We" and "Our" only to apply to them. That is because as the preacher said, White America thinks "black people have gone away, faded in the woodwork, or just disappeared." How else could a critique of America be ONLY a critique of white people and not anyones else - as if we don't live here too? We dont vote, pay taxes, and consume cheap goods?

On that list of things you quoted, how many of those things are NOT true?
-I would say the HIV thing - although the accidental spread of the virus was and continues to be covered up.
-U.S. of KKK
-Fighting wrong enemy, although as a group I do NOT think white people want us here the same way they dont want other immigrants in "THEIR". country taking "THEIR" jobs.
-Jesus teaching hate,
thats 4 of 14 IMO.

Just to ask a question, If America was a person and she died today. IF she were to go to "Heaven or a Hell" where would she go; based on her history. From the White immigrant standpoint? From the Native American and SW Indian (Mexican) standpoint? And lastly From the African American Standpoint......One that feels they have been unfairly treated at least up until they had to FIGHT for civil rights only 30 years ago? Based on the history i think at LEAST 2 of these groups would probably send her to hell. The paster gave his opinion from one of those standpoints. By far the worst thing he said IMO is that 'Jesus taught him how to hate his enemies and that enemy is white people.' - This is hate speech.

I agree with your perspective on these quotes. The 'Jesus taught him how to hate his enemies and that enemy is white people.' Just seems to stick out so much compared to the other comments because that statement is obviously hate speech and counter to anything a Christian Pastor should believe. It's that statement above all others that leads me to believe that the Rev Wright does in fact have a hate against White America. I don't know why the popular media isn't running THAT video 24/7. The rest of the quotes can be rationalized as sensational, hyperbole, or controversial in the context that the Pastor is trying to send a message that the Black Community needs to be stronger, smarter, and unified against an oppressor...and this is nothing new. Is it a productive message of unification? probably not. Is it effective? probably not as effective as Obama's position of trying to see both sides of the white vs black racial issue.

Pastor Wright obviously wants blacks to circle the wagons and be strong. I beleive The same can be said for alot of 'White' pastors and 'White' churches in America...maybe not so much against black america but maybe about gay america or mixed race marriage Americans (something I personally have seen and heard very recently). The point is, there are very real race problems, some of it embedded in the church, and not all of it can be attributed to a single race in America.

Based on Obama's speech he feels that if we continue to circle the wagons and not reach across this racial abyss then nothing will change.

He denounced the Rev. Wrights position on racism in America. But he understands it. Is that any different than how you and I feel? And I think it speaks volumes that Obama can denounce Rev Wright's messages and opinions, but he cannot denounce the man because of his feelings or committment to him, anymore than Obama can denounce his grandmother for her racial slurs or fear. To me, that is serious conviction, or at the very least, that is a real understanding of the Christian faith, where one can permit love in his or her heart even for those people that have wronged you.

Obama feels as though he has a better solution to the race dilemma in America, and you heard it last tuesday.

 

[Moonbeam]

A few more centuries of all this black hate for whites and shit, they might even start to pull up even. Damn it's going to be a pain in the ass listening to ghetto white preachers complain about the treachery of the United States.

 

[Moonbeam]

Oh, and didn't that dude that supposedly killed the King say he was innocent? Geez, there's a can of worms.

 

[spidey07]

This is fantastic. It does nothing more than call attention to just how racist obama, his preacher and sharpton are.

So Mr. Obama, as you said in your own words - what did you mean by "typical white person?" No double standards allowed here you racist.

"610 WIP host Angelo Cataldi asked Obama about his Tuesday morning speech on race at the National Constitution Center in which he referenced his own white grandmother and her prejudice. Obama told Cataldi that "The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity, but that she is a typical white person. If she sees somebody on the street that she doesn't know (pause) there's a reaction in her that doesn't go away and it comes out in the wrong way.""

http://campaignspot.nationalre...YzMTA4Y2NhMDA4ZWRlOWU=

 

[Brigandier]

Originally posted by: spidey07
This is fantastic. It does nothing more than call attention to just how racist obama, his preacher and sharpton are.

So Mr. Obama, as you said in your own words - what did you mean by "typical white person?" No double standards allowed here you racist.

That's a pretty strong charge with no evidence to support it. Cal;m down, take a deep breath and relax, us white people will be in power for a long time.

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: spidey07
This is fantastic. It does nothing more than call attention to just how racist obama, his preacher and sharpton are.

So Mr. Obama, as you said in your own words - what did you mean by "typical white person?" No double standards allowed here you racist.

"610 WIP host Angelo Cataldi asked Obama about his Tuesday morning speech on race at the National Constitution Center in which he referenced his own white grandmother and her prejudice. Obama told Cataldi that "The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity, but that she is a typical white person. If she sees somebody on the street that she doesn't know (pause) there's a reaction in her that doesn't go away and it comes out in the wrong way.""

http://campaignspot.nationalre...YzMTA4Y2NhMDA4ZWRlOWU=

I would agree with you if what Obama said is wrong and he his manufacturing a situation to suit his agenda. But I think he is right, that the typical white person DOES have fear and the typical 'white' reaction is fear in that situation where he/she has to walk by a young black man on the street.

You might disagree with that. Honestly speaking, do you? Think about allll those times this has happened to you...what was your FIRST reaction?

 

[spidey07]

I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

 

[Brigandier]

Originally posted by: spidey07
I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

Obama hasn't preached any hate, and racism is far from dead, my friend. It exists within each race, and for reasons that can be addressed.

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: spidey07
I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

racism isn't dead.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: spidey07
I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

racism isn't dead.

bullcrap. It's dead on an institutionary level, employment level and every other aspect.

Stop playing victim. Stop the double standards. I think obama needs to attend sensitivity training on how every white person is offended by how he said "typical white person".

So Mr. obama? What is a "typical white person" How about you describe what a "typical white person" is?

 

[Brigandier]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: spidey07
I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

racism isn't dead.

bullcrap. It's dead on an institutionary level, employment level and every other aspect.

Stop playing victim. Stop the double standards. I think obama needs to attend sensitivity training on how every white person is offended by how he said "typical white person".

So Mr. obama? What is a "typical white person" How about you describe what a "typical white person" is?

You, sir, are a typical white person. I am not offended by typical white person, just look at statistical averages. Walk through the ghetto, how do you feel? Seeing a black man at Hollister is different than seeing a black man in front of a liquor store on a street that sane people don't walk down.

 

[RKDaley]

Originally posted by: spidey07
Racism doesn't exist anymore

But a few posts up, you called Obama a racist.
Without racism, how can someone be a racist?
😕

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: spidey07
I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

racism isn't dead.

bullcrap. It's dead on an institutionary level, employment level and every other aspect.

Stop playing victim. Stop the double standards. I think obama needs to attend sensitivity training on how every white person is offended by how he said "typical white person".

So Mr. obama? What is a "typical white person" How about you describe what a "typical white person" is?

I agree. Institutional racism is more or less non-existent.

 

[m1ldslide1]

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I sincerely hope both campaigns soon move on to what I consider more pressing issues - economy, war, immigration, etc...

QFT. Such sentiments inspired my sig.

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: spidey07
I absolutely disagree with it. Only a racist uses such language and obama has shown his true colors - a blame typical whitey racist.

And my first reaction? Oh look a person. Racism doesn't exist anymore and people like obama, sharpton and wright are the only ones perpetuating it and their victim mentality. They NEED racism in order to exist and preach their hate.

racism isn't dead.

bullcrap. It's dead on an institutionary level, employment level and every other aspect.

Stop playing victim. Stop the double standards. I think obama needs to attend sensitivity training on how every white person is offended by how he said "typical white person".

So Mr. obama? What is a "typical white person" How about you describe what a "typical white person" is?

you are wrong. I'm sorry but you can't claim racism is dead. And no one is playing the victim, no one is claiming double standards. I think you need to stop using these canned phrases to try and angle yourself into a coherent argument. Speaking from reality, and not "playing the victim" there are instances everyday where race plays a factor in the world.

I supposed if I felt like racism is dead..like you do...then I would feel that anyone that brings up racism is just using it to score points. So if you guys really feel that racism is dead then there is not point continuing to discuss this with you further.

However I will add that I am 100% mexican albeit light skinned and anglo-looking, and alot of the time I wear a beard/goatee, I am also quite a big fella and somewhat in shape. I know from first hand experience that I am treated alot more differently when I am out in public and even while at work when I am clean shaven, as opposed to when I have my goatee on. So you will never convince me that racism is dead.

 

[m1ldslide1]

Originally posted by: beyoku

On that list of things you quoted, how many of those things are NOT true?
-I would say the HIV thing - although the accidental spread of the virus was and continues to be covered up.
-U.S. of KKK
-Fighting wrong enemy, although as a group I do NOT think white people want us here the same way they dont want other immigrants in "THEIR". country taking "THEIR" jobs.
-Jesus teaching hate,
thats 4 of 14 IMO.

Good post. That's what gets me - I read Wright's comments, and besides what's mentioned above, I have trouble finding any misinformation in his statements. Most people knee-jerk to negative criticism of 'merica, or of the actions and attitudes of the races contained within.

So long as people are taught to think that the civil war was to free slaves, 9/11 happened because islamics hate freedom, and everything is copasetic in regards to race these days, our society will be continuing down the same path of ignorance and division. And that road will get a lot worse before it gets any better.

 

[fstime]

Sharpton is a racist and should DIAF.

Sharpton was quoted as saying to an audience at Kean College in 1994 that, ?White folks was in caves while we was building empires ... We taught philosophy and astrology and mathematics before Socrates and them Greek homos ever got around to it.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
A few more centuries of all this black hate for whites and shit, they might even start to pull up even. Damn it's going to be a pain in the ass listening to ghetto white preachers complain about the treachery of the United States.

I actually heard a young african american woman on the radio this morning (XM POTUS 08 channel) who predicts that it will all fade away in time -- and I agree with her. She rightly points out that MOST of the anger and animosity is lost in generations X and Y... so, by the time the baby-boomers die out, we should be left with a generation who never witnessed the blatant degregation and racism -- they've never even SEEN a water fountain they cant use. So, while there will certainly still be small pockets of racism throughout the U.S., the underlying hostility and anger demonstrated by Wright should begin to dissappear naturally.

IOW, the "fight" for equality will become less and less militant over time, just as it has with feminism.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
A few more centuries of all this black hate for whites and shit, they might even start to pull up even. Damn it's going to be a pain in the ass listening to ghetto white preachers complain about the treachery of the United States.

I actually heard a young african american woman on the radio this morning (XM POTUS 08 channel) who predicts that it will all fade away in time -- and I agree with her. She rightly points out that MOST of the anger and animosity is lost in generations X and Y... so, by the time the baby-boomers die out, we should be left with a generation who never witnessed the blatant degregation and racism -- they've never even SEEN a water fountain they cant use. So, while there will certainly still be small pockets of racism throughout the U.S., the underlying hostility and anger demonstrated by Wright should begin to dissappear naturally.

IOW, the "fight" for equality will become less and less militant over time, just as it has with feminism.

I don't know about that. I think it'll just change into a different form. The current racism towards Mexicans and illegal immigrants to the growing rise of White Extremist groups.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
A few more centuries of all this black hate for whites and shit, they might even start to pull up even. Damn it's going to be a pain in the ass listening to ghetto white preachers complain about the treachery of the United States.

I actually heard a young african american woman on the radio this morning (XM POTUS 08 channel) who predicts that it will all fade away in time -- and I agree with her. She rightly points out that MOST of the anger and animosity is lost in generations X and Y... so, by the time the baby-boomers die out, we should be left with a generation who never witnessed the blatant degregation and racism -- they've never even SEEN a water fountain they cant use. So, while there will certainly still be small pockets of racism throughout the U.S., the underlying hostility and anger demonstrated by Wright should begin to dissappear naturally.

IOW, the "fight" for equality will become less and less militant over time, just as it has with feminism.

I don't know about that. I think it'll just change into a different form. The current racism towards Mexicans and illegal immigrants to the growing rise of White Extremist groups.

I was referencing African Americans who think as Rev. Wright does, specifically. His anger and bitterness is a leftover product of the 50's and 60's, and one that will eventually fade away as his generation dies out.

But of course racism will always exist in one form or another, without a doubt.

 

[maverick44]

Originally posted by: spidey07
This is fantastic. It does nothing more than call attention to just how racist obama, his preacher and sharpton are.

So Mr. Obama, as you said in your own words - what did you mean by "typical white person?" No double standards allowed here you racist.
"610 WIP host Angelo Cataldi asked Obama about his Tuesday morning speech on race at the National Constitution Center in which he referenced his own white grandmother and her prejudice. Obama told Cataldi that "The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity, but that she is a typical white person. If she sees somebody on the street that she doesn't know (pause) there's a reaction in her that doesn't go away and it comes out in the wrong way.""

http://campaignspot.nationalre...YzMTA4Y2NhMDA4ZWRlOWU=

FORTUNATELY, there IS a double standard as far as racism is concerned.

You see hate speech against whites/non-minorities is treated a little differently by MOST secular and democratic societies versus hate speach against minorities.

If you are stupid enough to not see why that is then maybe you need to go to reinvest in your education.

Racist remarks/ hate speach against whites might, in the worst case scenario, lead to a potentially lively congregation at a local black church.

Racist remarks against blacks might, in the worst case scenario, lead to the reinvigoration of the KKK, lynchings or widespread discrimination against blacks in the work place

The danger in spreading hatred in the white community is greater than the danger in spreading hatred in the black community.

In other words, say there is a civil war between blacks and whites, who would be wiped out??? What would blacks gain by hating whites... who is more vulnerable as a community

Personally, I wish the last remnants of RACE as a form of identity is extinguished then we can all stop debating about who is being racist and when

 

[beyoku]

Originally posted by: BouZouki
Sharpton is a racist and should DIAF.

Sharpton was quoted as saying to an audience at Kean College in 1994 that, ?White folks was in caves while we was building empires ... We taught philosophy and astrology and mathematics before Socrates and them Greek homos ever got around to it.

LOL, he did say that, Sharpton is an ass, now what part of that quote is untrue? 😀

 

[Red Dawn]

I bet I hate more White People than Obama does and I'm a Red Neck!