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Sharon Thumbs His Nose At Mr. Bush

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Does anyone else find it disturbing that Sharon can just say no when it comes to the Road Map? President Bush stated that Israel must not continue the settlements, to which Mr. Sharon repsonds, "Umm, yes, we will continue the settlements."

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon brushed off a warning from President Bush not to allow further West Bank settlement growth, indicating Israel would continue to solidify its hold on areas it considers of strategic importance.
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At the ranch, Bush told Sharon that any further building on the settlements would be in violation of the internationally backed ?road map? peace plan, which both the Israelis and the Palestinians have formally accepted, but which has been long dormant with both sides failing to carry out their initial obligations.
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?I?ve been very clear. Israel has an obligation under the road map. That?s no expansion of settlements,? Bush said.
That does not sound "open to interpretation" to me. That says, NO SETTLEMENT EXPANSION.

Sharon then says:
But later, Sharon said that while U.S. opposition to the settlements dated back to when Israel first captured the West Bank and Gaza Strip in the 1967 Middle East war, Israel has nevertheless continued to build communities to keep a hold on the land.
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So what? The Road Map didn't exist yet! Red Herring much? The media simply lets him get away with it of course....
In any case, given that the U.S. provides money and weaponry to Israel (into the billions of dollars per year), shouldn't the U.S. be able to ask them to abide by the plan they agreed to? If they don't want to abide by it, then all funding should cease immediately.
There's plenty of evidence to support Arab claims that there is a pattern of unfairness in U.S. policy toward the ME.
Discuss.
 
why doesn't the US just invade Isreal like it did Iraq..oh wait Isreal DOES have WMD's ..the US can't do that now can they
 
Originally posted by: Stumps
why doesn't the US just invade Isreal like it did Iraq..oh wait Isreal DOES have WMD's ..the US can't do that now can they
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Israel really is Bush's puppet, Bush talks the talk in public...but Israel is his cohort in crime, in private. Bush is trying to have his cake and eat it too, with Israel.
 
Well, the Propagandist's flip-flopping sent mexed missages to Sharon. First he pulls out of peace talks, now, as johnny-come-lately, he thinks he can direct Sharon down a U.S.-set path?
 
Kerry has NOTHING on Bush, when it comes to flip-flopping.

It's a shame that 51% of voters bought into Bush's lies and dog-and-pony show.

We're ALL paying for that for the next 4 years of increased terrorism.
 
If true, good for Sharon. Bush is wrong on this one.

Land for peace doesn't work and Israel has a right to defend itself.
 
I just love the hypocracy in Sharon

He comes to Bush saying he is unhappy with Abbas, he is not fighting militants hard enough and if nothing changes Israel will have to step in since the palestinians are not following their peace agrement after the latest mortar attacks on Israeli settlements.... after the Israelis gunned down 3 palestinian youths who entered a closed off area, fetching their soccer ball. Then Sharon has the nerve to prepare to build a new settlement, a direct violation of the road map.

 
Originally posted by: conjur
Well, the Propagandist's flip-flopping sent mexed missages to Sharon. First he pulls out of peace talks, now, as johnny-come-lately, he thinks he can direct Sharon down a U.S.-set path?
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DEJA VU - circa 1990. Bush Sr. sends mixed messages to Saddam/IRAQ...and turns him into an enemy.

History repeating itself, in the latest generation of Bush? :/ Hmmmmm
 
Bush never had any intentions of inducing Israeli compliance with the "Road Map". That was clear from the start. Just more of the usual bait and switch, this time on the Pals as well as the American public. The Israelis won't be done until they've settled (taken) all of Palestine, reduced the Pals to living in impoverished Bantustans. Even that may not be enough. We may see the forced resettlement of West Bank Pals in Gaza and Iraq, for "humanitarian" reasons, of course... It's a done deal, made under the table when Cheney visited Israel in the wake of 9/11.

It's a kinder and gentler, slow motion version of Liebensraum....

 
Originally posted by: Riprorin
If true, good for Sharon. Bush is wrong on this one.

Land for peace doesn't work and Israel has a right to defend itself.
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Taking more land will create peace? That doesn't make sense.
I guess I have to agree with the general sentiment in here, that Bush is speaking with a forked tongue.
Makes for a good show anyway....
 
Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Bush never had any intentions of inducing Israeli compliance with the "Road Map". That was clear from the start. Just more of the usual bait and switch, this time on the Pals as well as the American public. The Israelis won't be done until they've settled (taken) all of Palestine, reduced the Pals to living in impoverished Bantustans. Even that may not be enough. We may see the forced resettlement of West Bank Pals in Gaza and Iraq, for "humanitarian" reasons, of course... It's a done deal, made under the table when Cheney visited Israel in the wake of 9/11.

It's a kinder and gentler, slow motion version of Liebensraum....
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Blah, blah, blah, blah blah

Aren't you guys missing the part that the Palestinians haven't fullfilled their part of the road map either?

"but which has been long dormant with both sides failing to carry out their initial obligations."

Why blame Israel? They have treated the Palestinians much better then Jordan did. Jordan didn't even bother to try to negotiate a settlement. There would be a Palestinian State right now if Arafat had given in on one issue (Jerusalem). Israel has shown a willingness to work for peace, but why would you expect them to just give up their land when all the Palestinians have shown them is that they want to destroy Israel?
 
Old and experienced Sharon is beating BushBaby like a toy drum and will get his way, regardless of how the Bushies wish to spin it.

But there's one thing that could be done, and Isreal would get in line, lock-step real quick.
That would be to terminate all funding assistance to them & shut off their access to the War-machine products that gives Isreal their domminance in the area in the first place.

Without the U.S, subsidising Isreal, it would end - like instantly.

Hell, Sharon want's the U.S. to foot every bill and pay for everthing - always.
We don't even give our own states the financial support that Isreal gets.
 
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Old and experienced Sharon is beating BushBaby like a toy drum and will get his way, regardless of how the Bushies wish to spin it.

But there's one thing that could be done, and Isreal would get in line, lock-step real quick.
That would be to terminate all funding assistance to them & shut off their access to the War-machine products that gives Isreal their domminance in the area in the first place.

Without the U.S, subsidising Isreal, it would end - like instantly.

Hell, Sharon want's the U.S. to foot every bill and pay for everthing - always.
We don't even give our own states the financial support that Isreal gets.
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That might hurt Israel and it might not. But given that the people funding the palestinian terrorist groups are the same people who are funding Al Qaeda, wouldn't that be stupid for the US to do? Israel and the US are fighting the same enemy. We are both fighting against terrorists who pretend to be muslim and get donation from the muslim world. Giving in to the Palestinians would be shooting ourselves in the foot.
 
But given that the people funding the palestinian terrorist groups are the same people who are funding Al Qaeda, wouldn't that be stupid for the US to do? Israel and the US are fighting the same enemy.

You know that for a fact, or is that speculation ?
 
Well, smc13, the Israelis are a modern state, with a central govt, military, police, etc... The Pals are mostly just people with a disorganized and intentionally fractured, crippled infrastructure, having no real government, no power to enforce their edicts. Infractions by individual palestinians are inevitable, and by individual Israelis. That's not the case for organized violence and expropriation carried out by the Israeli govt... which is what's happening. They even hold pals accountable for actions carried out by groups beyond pal control, like Hezbollah, a Lebanese faction. If groups of pals resist, then they're all held accountable. If they don't then they're all overrun, their property confiscated, their towns surrounded by monstrous fences and checkpoints, their ability to survive reduced day by day, anyway. That'sa some catch, that catch-22....

Your "point"', such as it is, in no way contradicts what I said, above... You offer the mideast equivalent of the "But Clinton!" routine wrt discussion of domestic affairs, if a little less transparent...
 
Israel wants the land to grow their country.

If everyone stopped meddling in their affairs, then they could solve their problems.

By even one not stopping support, then there is a need/excuse for all to keep supporting their own interests.

There is a big difference between political hatred and national interests/obligations.

 
What are you talking about? I, as a taxpayer, fund a country who is not abiding by conditions set in an agreement they entered into. Their affairs are the affairs of the U.S. by extension. We have every right to meddle. Pull the funding and weaponry, THEN they can do whatever they like. That way it doesn't reflect on the U.S.
At the same time, I wouldn't feel so used when it's revealed that the Israelis have been selling aircraft designs to the Chinese which are equal or superior to our own designs.....
 
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
But given that the people funding the palestinian terrorist groups are the same people who are funding Al Qaeda, wouldn't that be stupid for the US to do? Israel and the US are fighting the same enemy.

You know that for a fact, or is that speculation ?
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I think he was referring to The Evildoers.
 
Originally posted by: TheSnowman
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
But given that the people funding the palestinian terrorist groups are the same people who are funding Al Qaeda, wouldn't that be stupid for the US to do? Israel and the US are fighting the same enemy.

You know that for a fact, or is that speculation ?
Click to expand...

I think he was referring to The Evildoers.
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The Evildoers

 
To me it seems like a carefully coordinated sham by Bush and Sharon to fool the world that America is not biased towards Israel by publicly criticizing it, but doing so in such a way that Israel can get away with it.

Just look at the wording that Bush used to state American?s position: ?no expansion of settlements?. To Sharon it might mean ?no outward expansion of settlements? which is also very ambiguous because who knows the real boundaries of settlements?

While the roadmap clearly states ?freeze on settlement activity and dismantling of settlements built in the last two years?. If Bush meant business, he would use the actual Middle East road map wording so that Sharon could not weasel out of it with technicalities.

 
There is an interesting interview with Sharon on CNN:
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BLITZER: Let's talk about some other issues. The settlements on the West Bank, supposedly a source of contention between the Bush administration and the Israeli government. Will your government authorize the construction of 3,500 new housing units in the West Bank at Ma'aleh Adumim, a settlement outside of Jerusalem.

SHARON: First, I think that the noise about this issue may be partially coming from the Israeli side. ... but the Israeli position [is] that Ma'aleh Adumim is one of the major blocs, that [is] the way we see it, and that's in accordance ... to the letter of President Bush that I got on the 14th of April 2004 where he talked about the major blocs of Jewish population, the realities that were established there.
So Ma'aleh Adumim is one of those blocs.

BLITZER: Did the president ask you not to go ahead and expand that existing settlement. Did he ask you to stop the construction?

SHARON: I don't think that that was the purpose of my visit there, and altogether I think the president repeated what we have said, that we have to look at the road map and to act upon the road map because he's ...

BLITZER: But he says, the president -- excuse me for interrupting -- the president says the road map calls for a freeze of settlement activity, including what's called "natural growth," standing, existing settlements.

SHARON: I believe that this issue will be discussed also again in the future. We have been discussing those issues. And I believe that Israel understands its commitment. And I believe that there will be discussion on these issues also in the future. But as about Ma'aleh Adumim, no doubt that's one of the major blocs, and according to the Israeli position, it will be a part of Israel in the future, and it should be contiguity between this town and Jerusalem.

BLITZER: So I take it you have authorized the construction of 3,500 additional housing units.

SHARON: No, we have not discussed it ... It's an old plan, 10 years old, passing through all the various bureaucratic steps. And that is not what we're doing.
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So Sharon and Bush discussed the road map, but they have not discussed building 3500 additional housing units which is a clear violation of the road map?

Sharon?s excuse for building new housing units is Bush?s statement on the ?realities that were established by Israel? hence Sharon is now allowed to establish new ?realities? by expanding the settlements?

What kind of bull $hit is this?

Edit: link and formatting
 
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