Setting up Home Theater System

[Gamingphreek]

For Christmas I came home from College to be pleasantly surprised by the beginnings of a fabulous new HT System.

Right now we have:
Scientific Atlanta 8300HD Digital Receiver/PVR
Panasonic 50" 1080P Plasma HD TV
------
Up converting (1080i Max) DVD Player
Sony Receiver and Satellites with Powered Sub


First off, I set up the system, but I am having slight problems. I can't get 5.1 signals consistently.

• I had the DVD Player set up for Bitstream Audio Encoding but I wasn't receiving any audio signal through our Receiver and Satellites. My initial reaction is that the receiver does not have the APU which will decode the raw audio stream. So now it is stuck on 48hz PCM (From what I remember)

• I cannot get a 5.1 channels from any of our channels- even the Digital HD ones which are clearly in HD. It is just stuck in 2.1

Anyone have any ideas why this is? I have looked through every configuration menu on each of the components and triple checked that everything is outputting to the correct port.

Next, I am almost 100% positive I am correct but just wanted to verify:
I have the Coax cable going into our 8300HD. From there we have an HDMI cable going into the TV. We have a second HDMI cable going from TV into our DVD Player.
For audio purposes (Since our receiver does not have HDMI) we have a TosLink Optical Cable going from the receiver into our 8300HD. We have a Coaxial Digital Out cable (Since our receiver has one TosLink and one Coaxial port) going from our receiver to our DVD Player. Is this the optimal setup given our components?

Finally, I set everything up using 720P. Since NOTHING, save for BluRay, uses 1080P , from what I understand 720P is equal to or better than 1080i (Though the difference is supposedly negligible). Any opinions either way here?
---------

The DVD Player and the Receiver are definitely holding the system back in my honest opinion. But seeing as we have the new expensive equipment I am going to advise my Dad on a few purchases:

Power Conditioner : Is this necessary. We have a surge protector hooked up, but on many nice Home Theater setups this can eliminate a lot of potential problems (High Ripple on AC Lines, EMI etc...)

A new receiver and Speakers. He wants to get another all-in-one system but I am begging him to reconsider. Is it possible to build a decent 5.1 system for ~$5-600?

Finally, he isn't going for it, but I have been begging for BluRay as right now nothing else is using 1080P and DVD's just plain don't look as good as they used to- even when up converted.

Anything else we should be looking at here?

-Kevin

 

[PurdueRy]

There is a lot of questions here. Let's start off with the most concerning....the surround sound not working

I have set up a few Sony HTiB's before. I think your problem may be that they are finicky about being in the right "mode". Make sure on the receiver that you don't have any effects being applied and trying scrolling through them until you set it to "auto-detect" or something similar.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Ok I managed to get the surround working in Bitstream for both the DVD Player as well as the Cable Box. The only problem right there that I have now is that the TV's own speakers cannot output sound. For instance, if we didn't want to turn on the surround sound system, and we merely wanted sound from the TV-- we can't do that right now.

I understand why: (Audio Out: Is set to Dolby Digital, not HDMI (So the TV doesn't receive any through the HDMI port) -- but if I set to HDMI, then the receiver only receives 2.1 PCM sound). Any way to output both types?

That is the main thing I got partially solved-- other than that, everything still stands.

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok I managed to get the surround working in Bitstream for both the DVD Player as well as the Cable Box. The only problem right there that I have now is that the TV's own speakers cannot output sound. For instance, if we didn't want to turn on the surround sound system, and we merely wanted sound from the TV-- we can't do that right now.

I understand why: (Audio Out: Is set to Dolby Digital, not HDMI (So the TV doesn't receive any through the HDMI port) -- but if I set to HDMI, then the receiver only receives 2.1 PCM sound). Any way to output both types?

That is the main thing I got partially solved-- other than that, everything still stands.

Run analog R/L cables to the TV. Those are typically "always on". And, with TV speakers, you aren't going to notice a clarity difference.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok I managed to get the surround working in Bitstream for both the DVD Player as well as the Cable Box. The only problem right there that I have now is that the TV's own speakers cannot output sound. For instance, if we didn't want to turn on the surround sound system, and we merely wanted sound from the TV-- we can't do that right now.

I understand why: (Audio Out: Is set to Dolby Digital, not HDMI (So the TV doesn't receive any through the HDMI port) -- but if I set to HDMI, then the receiver only receives 2.1 PCM sound). Any way to output both types?

That is the main thing I got partially solved-- other than that, everything still stands.

Run analog R/L cables to the TV. Those are typically "always on". And, with TV speakers, you aren't going to notice a clarity difference.

Well in that case, let me ask this. Would it be better for us to save our HDMI cord and merely use Component Video with Composite RCA Audio Cords? It seems to me that the HDMI Audio Signal is completely wasted in going from the Cable Box to the TV.

I say that because since it is hooked up via HDMI, HDMI is it's own entity as far as TV/Video selection is concerned-- I don't believe it has any Analog Audio Ports associated with that Channel.

-Kevin

 

[Tiamat]

You mentioned 'in the event that you dont want to turn on the surround sound just for TV'. Is that something you want to enforce? In terms of power consumption, running surround sound system is at most akin to running a 60 W lightbulb, so energy savings wouldnt amount to much if you wanted to just use TV speakers for TV. Just wondering...

 

[Gamingphreek]

Ok, so it turns out our TV had Analog Ports for that specific reason. However, it only had it for HDMI 1 not HDMI 2-- so my Dad is just going to have to deal with the fact that he has to use the 5.1 System for DVD's no matter what (I don't understand why he wants it all like this but whatever).

So now I have accomplished:
5.1 Surround Sound AND Stereo TV Speaker sound from Cable Box
5.1 Surround Sound via DVD

All of this via Bitstream NOT PCM.

So it seems that all the audio problems are fixed. Thank you for the help. Now onto the other questions-- Any ideas?

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok, so it turns out our TV had Analog Ports for that specific reason. However, it only had it for HDMI 1 not HDMI 2-- so my Dad is just going to have to deal with the fact that he has to use the 5.1 System for DVD's no matter what (I don't understand why he wants it all like this but whatever).

So now I have accomplished:
5.1 Surround Sound AND Stereo TV Speaker sound from Cable Box
5.1 Surround Sound via DVD

All of this via Bitstream NOT PCM.

So it seems that all the audio problems are fixed. Thank you for the help. Now onto the other questions-- Any ideas?

You're players/boxes should be set to 1080i typically. Your TV will deinterlace this content to 1080p.

A power conditioner is only necessary if your house has horrible power for some reason. I have heard of some cases where this can negatively affect the lifespan of a set...but its not typical.

As for the all in one home theater. Look at the Onkyo 800 HTiB. That will perform fairly decently.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok, so it turns out our TV had Analog Ports for that specific reason. However, it only had it for HDMI 1 not HDMI 2-- so my Dad is just going to have to deal with the fact that he has to use the 5.1 System for DVD's no matter what (I don't understand why he wants it all like this but whatever).

So now I have accomplished:
5.1 Surround Sound AND Stereo TV Speaker sound from Cable Box
5.1 Surround Sound via DVD

All of this via Bitstream NOT PCM.

So it seems that all the audio problems are fixed. Thank you for the help. Now onto the other questions-- Any ideas?

You're players/boxes should be set to 1080i typically. Your TV will deinterlace this content to 1080p.

A power conditioner is only necessary if your house has horrible power for some reason. I have heard of some cases where this can negatively affect the lifespan of a set...but its not typical.

As for the all in one home theater. Look at the Onkyo 800 HTiB. That will perform fairly decently.

Hmm so the TV SHOULD do Hardware Deinterlacing?
This is the TV we have- any way to know for sure if it will deinterlace interlaced video. So even though, say, Sports games are only broadcast in 720P, we should still have the TV set to 1080i, wherein the TV will deinterlace that signal?

Also, the DVD Player should be set to 1080i possible?

I will definitely look at that receiver-- thank you so much for the help!

-Kevin

Edit: Additionally, our house SHOULD have absolutely fine power. Is there any way for me to test the power condition (We have a multi-meter, but we do not have an Oscilliscope) to verify?

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok, so it turns out our TV had Analog Ports for that specific reason. However, it only had it for HDMI 1 not HDMI 2-- so my Dad is just going to have to deal with the fact that he has to use the 5.1 System for DVD's no matter what (I don't understand why he wants it all like this but whatever).

So now I have accomplished:
5.1 Surround Sound AND Stereo TV Speaker sound from Cable Box
5.1 Surround Sound via DVD

All of this via Bitstream NOT PCM.

So it seems that all the audio problems are fixed. Thank you for the help. Now onto the other questions-- Any ideas?

You're players/boxes should be set to 1080i typically. Your TV will deinterlace this content to 1080p.

A power conditioner is only necessary if your house has horrible power for some reason. I have heard of some cases where this can negatively affect the lifespan of a set...but its not typical.

As for the all in one home theater. Look at the Onkyo 800 HTiB. That will perform fairly decently.

Hmm so the TV SHOULD do Hardware Deinterlacing?
This is the TV we have- any way to know for sure if it will deinterlace interlaced video. So even though, say, Sports games are only broadcast in 720P, we should still have the TV set to 1080i, wherein the TV will deinterlace that signal?

Also, the DVD Player should be set to 1080i possible?

I will definitely look at that receiver-- thank you so much for the help!

-Kevin

Edit: Additionally, our house SHOULD have absolutely fine power. Is there any way for me to test the power condition (We have a multi-meter, but we do not have an Oscilliscope) to verify?

If you have never had trouble with lights flickering and such...there is no need for a power conditioner. A simple surge protector will be adequate.

The TV does not have a "setting" for the resolution. You cannot set the TV to "1080i". What the TV does depends on the source connected to it. If you send it a 720p video signal from your DVD player, it will upscale that picture to 1080p. If you send it a 1080i signal, it will convert it to 1080p.

The end image will ALWAYS be 1080p. So, considering that the resolution of 1080i = 1080p. You should set everything to output 1080i to the TV to take advantage of the extra resolution your TV can display. Plus, there is no scaling work that needs to be done on a 1080i signal into a 1080p display.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok, so it turns out our TV had Analog Ports for that specific reason. However, it only had it for HDMI 1 not HDMI 2-- so my Dad is just going to have to deal with the fact that he has to use the 5.1 System for DVD's no matter what (I don't understand why he wants it all like this but whatever).

So now I have accomplished:
5.1 Surround Sound AND Stereo TV Speaker sound from Cable Box
5.1 Surround Sound via DVD

All of this via Bitstream NOT PCM.

So it seems that all the audio problems are fixed. Thank you for the help. Now onto the other questions-- Any ideas?

You're players/boxes should be set to 1080i typically. Your TV will deinterlace this content to 1080p.

A power conditioner is only necessary if your house has horrible power for some reason. I have heard of some cases where this can negatively affect the lifespan of a set...but its not typical.

As for the all in one home theater. Look at the Onkyo 800 HTiB. That will perform fairly decently.

Hmm so the TV SHOULD do Hardware Deinterlacing?
This is the TV we have- any way to know for sure if it will deinterlace interlaced video. So even though, say, Sports games are only broadcast in 720P, we should still have the TV set to 1080i, wherein the TV will deinterlace that signal?

Also, the DVD Player should be set to 1080i possible?

I will definitely look at that receiver-- thank you so much for the help!

-Kevin

Edit: Additionally, our house SHOULD have absolutely fine power. Is there any way for me to test the power condition (We have a multi-meter, but we do not have an Oscilliscope) to verify?

If you have never had trouble with lights flickering and such...there is no need for a power conditioner. A simple surge protector will be adequate.

The TV does not have a "setting" for the resolution. You cannot set the TV to "1080i". What the TV does depends on the source connected to it. If you send it a 720p video signal from your DVD player, it will upscale that picture to 1080p. If you send it a 1080i signal, it will convert it to 1080p.

The end image will ALWAYS be 1080p. So, considering that the resolution of 1080i = 1080p. You should set everything to output 1080i to the TV to take advantage of the extra resolution your TV can display. Plus, there is no scaling work that needs to be done on a 1080i signal into a 1080p display.

OH-- so no matter what we are getting a 1080P image, what we determine is how much the TV has to post process to achieve that image.

You are saying that 1080i merely needs deinterlacing, whereas 720P needs to be rescaled up to 1080p which is harder than to deinterlace.

As for the power conditioner lights don't typically flicker from what I can remember. I know the Microwave may be on the same circuit as the TV or the lights for our room (When we use the microwave, the lights flicker very slightly and dim a little in the family room-- but I assume that is just merely a high power draw?)

I looked at the Onkyo 800 and looking at reviews, from what I understand the HDMI ports will not carry the audio signal and that we would still need to use TosLink or Coaxial for Digital Audio. Is that correct? Let me see what his actual price range for this system is. If I can find a compelling set of reasons why that price range doesn't work, then he may entertain the idea of upping it a bit.

-Kevin

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Ok, so it turns out our TV had Analog Ports for that specific reason. However, it only had it for HDMI 1 not HDMI 2-- so my Dad is just going to have to deal with the fact that he has to use the 5.1 System for DVD's no matter what (I don't understand why he wants it all like this but whatever).

So now I have accomplished:
5.1 Surround Sound AND Stereo TV Speaker sound from Cable Box
5.1 Surround Sound via DVD

All of this via Bitstream NOT PCM.

So it seems that all the audio problems are fixed. Thank you for the help. Now onto the other questions-- Any ideas?

You're players/boxes should be set to 1080i typically. Your TV will deinterlace this content to 1080p.

A power conditioner is only necessary if your house has horrible power for some reason. I have heard of some cases where this can negatively affect the lifespan of a set...but its not typical.

As for the all in one home theater. Look at the Onkyo 800 HTiB. That will perform fairly decently.

Hmm so the TV SHOULD do Hardware Deinterlacing?
This is the TV we have- any way to know for sure if it will deinterlace interlaced video. So even though, say, Sports games are only broadcast in 720P, we should still have the TV set to 1080i, wherein the TV will deinterlace that signal?

Also, the DVD Player should be set to 1080i possible?

I will definitely look at that receiver-- thank you so much for the help!

-Kevin

Edit: Additionally, our house SHOULD have absolutely fine power. Is there any way for me to test the power condition (We have a multi-meter, but we do not have an Oscilliscope) to verify?

If you have never had trouble with lights flickering and such...there is no need for a power conditioner. A simple surge protector will be adequate.

The TV does not have a "setting" for the resolution. You cannot set the TV to "1080i". What the TV does depends on the source connected to it. If you send it a 720p video signal from your DVD player, it will upscale that picture to 1080p. If you send it a 1080i signal, it will convert it to 1080p.

The end image will ALWAYS be 1080p. So, considering that the resolution of 1080i = 1080p. You should set everything to output 1080i to the TV to take advantage of the extra resolution your TV can display. Plus, there is no scaling work that needs to be done on a 1080i signal into a 1080p display.

OH-- so no matter what we are getting a 1080P image, what we determine is how much the TV has to post process to achieve that image.

You are saying that 1080i merely needs deinterlacing, whereas 720P needs to be rescaled up to 1080p which is harder than to deinterlace.

As for the power conditioner lights don't typically flicker from what I can remember. I know the Microwave may be on the same circuit as the TV or the lights for our room (When we use the microwave, the lights flicker very slightly and dim a little in the family room-- but I assume that is just merely a high power draw?)

I looked at the Onkyo 800 and looking at reviews, from what I understand the HDMI ports will not carry the audio signal and that we would still need to use TosLink or Coaxial for Digital Audio. Is that correct? Let me see what his actual price range for this system is. If I can find a compelling set of reasons why that price range doesn't work, then he may entertain the idea of upping it a bit.

-Kevin

That is correct.

The power conditioner is up to you. I highly doubt you need it, but it can't hurt. If you don't mind spending the money then keep it.

You are correct that it will not decode the audio signal from HDMI. This is common in cheaper receivers unfortunately. So you would just run toslink or digital coax to get the surround sound from the player.

 

[Gamingphreek]

I'll talk to him about a larger budget for a receiver. Plus I am still going to push for a BluRay player...

We tried setting our Cable Box to 1080i over 720p and to be honest I can't tell any difference at all-- we don't have a really good HD feed coming in (ESPN 2's Football is the best I have right now and it leaves a lot to be desired). I really need a constant set of videos to look at-- and in that event, I don't really see how I would notice otherwise. Is there something I should be looking for?

Also, we did turn on the Noise Reduction Filters on the TV. We left Video Noise reduction off (We have a pretty good signal), but turned on Block and Mosquito filters. So the picture should look better regardless.

I'll try the DVD Player at 1080i and what not and compare the results later as well.

-Kevin

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
I'll talk to him about a larger budget for a receiver. Plus I am still going to push for a BluRay player...

We tried setting our Cable Box to 1080i over 720p and to be honest I can't tell any difference at all-- we don't have a really good HD feed coming in (ESPN 2's Football is the best I have right now and it leaves a lot to be desired). I really need a constant set of videos to look at-- and in that event, I don't really see how I would notice otherwise. Is there something I should be looking for?

Also, we did turn on the Noise Reduction Filters on the TV. We left Video Noise reduction off (We have a pretty good signal), but turned on Block and Mosquito filters. So the picture should look better regardless.

I'll try the DVD Player at 1080i and what not and compare the results later as well.

-Kevin

It's not going to be easy to notice any difference quite honestly. At normal viewing distances its very hard to impossible. At close range there might be some differences but they won't be alarming.

Your best bet is to calibrate the TV.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
I'll talk to him about a larger budget for a receiver. Plus I am still going to push for a BluRay player...

We tried setting our Cable Box to 1080i over 720p and to be honest I can't tell any difference at all-- we don't have a really good HD feed coming in (ESPN 2's Football is the best I have right now and it leaves a lot to be desired). I really need a constant set of videos to look at-- and in that event, I don't really see how I would notice otherwise. Is there something I should be looking for?

Also, we did turn on the Noise Reduction Filters on the TV. We left Video Noise reduction off (We have a pretty good signal), but turned on Block and Mosquito filters. So the picture should look better regardless.

I'll try the DVD Player at 1080i and what not and compare the results later as well.

-Kevin

It's not going to be easy to notice any difference quite honestly. At normal viewing distances its very hard to impossible. At close range there might be some differences but they won't be alarming.

Your best bet is to calibrate the TV.

Calibrate in what way? I did go and find one of our DVD's with the THX Optimizer on it and went through the whole gamut of Audio and Video Tests. Is there something else I can do to calibrate it more accurately/further?

-Kevin

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
I'll talk to him about a larger budget for a receiver. Plus I am still going to push for a BluRay player...

We tried setting our Cable Box to 1080i over 720p and to be honest I can't tell any difference at all-- we don't have a really good HD feed coming in (ESPN 2's Football is the best I have right now and it leaves a lot to be desired). I really need a constant set of videos to look at-- and in that event, I don't really see how I would notice otherwise. Is there something I should be looking for?

Also, we did turn on the Noise Reduction Filters on the TV. We left Video Noise reduction off (We have a pretty good signal), but turned on Block and Mosquito filters. So the picture should look better regardless.

I'll try the DVD Player at 1080i and what not and compare the results later as well.

-Kevin

It's not going to be easy to notice any difference quite honestly. At normal viewing distances its very hard to impossible. At close range there might be some differences but they won't be alarming.

Your best bet is to calibrate the TV.

Calibrate in what way? I did go and find one of our DVD's with the THX Optimizer on it and went through the whole gamut of Audio and Video Tests. Is there something else I can do to calibrate it more accurately/further?

-Kevin

Try the AVIA DVD or Digital video essentials. I own avia. It will at least let you calibrate colors/brightness/contrast.

Also, turn the Panny of "Vivid" mode. This will immediately yield an improvement in color accuracy. Turn it to "standard" or "normal".