Second Swift-Boat ad against Kerry

[smashp]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: umbrella39
That is a picture of him with his EQUALS or superiors if not mistaken. As noted here countless times, those in the picture do not respect his post war postition nor are they the men that served under his leadership.

Correct - they were his peers and not his superior officers or the men that served with him. Which, to me, says a lot. I would hope that in any of the pictures of myself and all my peers, I would have more than one person that supported me.

Edit: I'll add to that. I think the people that served *under* him generally respected him. But not those that worked *with* him. It is good to know that those on his boat respected him, IMHO.

I'll add this picture, pulled from Fark also Definition of "served together"

The Problem is, Well never know what any of their feelings were towards Kerry while he was with thim, Before he Testified and led VVAW, now Will we. They even admit their feeling for the guy are skewed by the fact he testified to congress........ In fact their is an ad somewhere that proves that point.....Oh yeah this thread.


How long Was Kerry in the Vietnam Theater Alchemize?

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: smashp

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: umbrella39
That is a picture of him with his EQUALS or superiors if not mistaken. As noted here countless times, those in the picture do not respect his post war postition nor are they the men that served under his leadership.

Correct - they were his peers and not his superior officers or the men that served with him. Which, to me, says a lot. I would hope that in any of the pictures of myself and all my peers, I would have more than one person that supported me.

Edit: I'll add to that. I think the people that served *under* him generally respected him. But not those that worked *with* him. It is good to know that those on his boat respected him, IMHO.

I'll add this picture, pulled from Fark also Definition of "served together"

The Problem is, Well never know what any of their feelings were towards Kerry while he was with thim, Before he Testified and led VVAW, now Will we. They even admit their feeling for the guy are skewed by the fact he testified to congress........ In fact their is an ad somewhere that proves that point.....Oh yeah this thread.


How long Was Kerry in the Vietnam Theater Alchemize?

How very true. I bet if you could go back in time and ask those men right after that picture was taken, what they think of John Kerry, I guarantee they would paint you a MUCH different picture than they are painting today.

 

[Todd33]

http://www.suntimes.com/output/iraq/cst-nws-abuse18.html

The Army reservist who tipped off investigators to abuse of Iraqi prisoners by his fellow soldiers is in protective military custody because of death threats, family members said Tuesday.

How times change. People don't want the truth, the want to wrap themselves in the flag and pretend their country is perfect. Some of us want to make it better, not just cover up mistakes.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: smashp

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: umbrella39
That is a picture of him with his EQUALS or superiors if not mistaken. As noted here countless times, those in the picture do not respect his post war postition nor are they the men that served under his leadership.

Correct - they were his peers and not his superior officers or the men that served with him. Which, to me, says a lot. I would hope that in any of the pictures of myself and all my peers, I would have more than one person that supported me.

Edit: I'll add to that. I think the people that served *under* him generally respected him. But not those that worked *with* him. It is good to know that those on his boat respected him, IMHO.

I'll add this picture, pulled from Fark also Definition of "served together"

The Problem is, Well never know what any of their feelings were towards Kerry while he was with thim, Before he Testified and led VVAW, now Will we. They even admit their feeling for the guy are skewed by the fact he testified to congress........ In fact their is an ad somewhere that proves that point.....Oh yeah this thread.


How long Was Kerry in the Vietnam Theater Alchemize?

I completely agree - their opinion was based on his actions after the war, not during the war. That's pretty much the purpose of this thread. Obviously we wouldn't have any of these discussions if he hadn't been a anti-war activist. Of course, would he be a senator today if we hadn't? All conjecture of course.

 

[smashp]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: smashp

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: umbrella39
That is a picture of him with his EQUALS or superiors if not mistaken. As noted here countless times, those in the picture do not respect his post war postition nor are they the men that served under his leadership.

Correct - they were his peers and not his superior officers or the men that served with him. Which, to me, says a lot. I would hope that in any of the pictures of myself and all my peers, I would have more than one person that supported me.

Edit: I'll add to that. I think the people that served *under* him generally respected him. But not those that worked *with* him. It is good to know that those on his boat respected him, IMHO.

I'll add this picture, pulled from Fark also Definition of "served together"

The Problem is, Well never know what any of their feelings were towards Kerry while he was with thim, Before he Testified and led VVAW, now Will we. They even admit their feeling for the guy are skewed by the fact he testified to congress........ In fact their is an ad somewhere that proves that point.....Oh yeah this thread.


How long Was Kerry in the Vietnam Theater Alchemize?

I completely agree - their opinion was based on his actions after the war, not during the war. That's pretty much the purpose of this thread. Obviously we wouldn't have any of these discussions if he hadn't been a anti-war activist. Of course, would he be a senator today if we hadn't? All conjecture of course.

Well, We agree. The Protesting of the war probely earned him the fame needed to win the senate, although it may have been possible without it.

On a side note, I watched on cspan last weekend the debate between Kerry and Oneil on the dick Caveet show. It was sad to realize how barbaric Politics have become in this country. It was nice to see a real, thoughtful debate with respect for the opposition.

 

[1EZduzit]

Why do they want a second ad? It's like a lawyer making a statment in court that he can't legally make. Then the Judge instructs the Jury to disregard that statement. Yeah right, damage done already.

This ad is just to ride on the coatails of the first ad and keep the lies in the back of as many peoples minds that they can.. Bush should come out and denounce/stop the ads for Christ sake, not make a toned down version???

 

[1EZduzit]

Samuel Johnson said "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel." That sure seems to fit Dubyuh & Company.

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: alchemize
I completely agree - their opinion was based on his actions after the war, not during the war. That's pretty much the purpose of this thread. Obviously we wouldn't have any of these discussions if he hadn't been a anti-war activist. Of course, would he be a senator today if we hadn't? All conjecture of course.

Alchemize, do you believe that the Vietnam war was one worth fighting? Second question, do you think America would tolerate over 58,000 casualties in a war today?

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: alchemize

I completely agree - their opinion was based on his actions after the war, not during the war. That's pretty much the purpose of this thread. Obviously we wouldn't have any of these discussions if he hadn't been a anti-war activist. Of course, would he be a senator today if we hadn't? All conjecture of course.

I think in that regard the second ad is the more honest of the two (even though much of it is essentially a blatantly unfair edit of Kerry's comments that takes them completely out of context).

I can certainly understand that Kerry's actions after the war offended a lot of GIs and vets, but frankly I think they showed tremendous moral courage. He could easily have come home and enjoyed the political capital of being a war hero (whether or not you agree he was one), but instead he tried sincerely to help prevent more unnecessary deaths among his comrades in arms. I think some of Kerry's actual comments at the time sound bad in hindsight, but in my view they can be forgiven in light of his age and passion for the subject. The Vietnam conflict was stupid and unnecessary IMO (as witnessed by virtue of the fact the "domino effect" never happened, after we withdrew from the war).

Now, of course, he is paying the price for his words, because every fellow VN vet who disagreed with him and had even a tangential relationship to him in VN has been given a stage to rally against him. It appears to me many of them are lying. and frankly I think the SBVFT are substantially being used as political pawns - LT CDR Elliott is a particularly sad case in that respect. Meanwhile, nearly all the men who actually served alongside Kerry, on his boat, support him.

I think the SBVFT are a sad testament to the slash-and-burn, scorched-earth philosophy that has dominated presidential campaigns in recent years - I think we have the late Lee Atwater and Karl Rove to thank for this, although there are gross offenders on both sides of the aisle. The problem with this, of course, is that we are effectively making elections pivot on 30-year-old allegations, as opposed to today's issues - it's retarded, mean-spirited, and harmful to all Americans IMO.

 

[Pepsei]

Truth about the Swift-boat vets